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pakowitz 04-29-2004 09:23 PM

the most sickening thing i have ever read
 
UMass grad student: Tillman's not a hero

ESPN.com news services
AMHERST, Mass. -- A University of Massachusetts student has openly criticized Pat Tillman, calling the former NFL player a Rambo-like idiot in the school paper.


The column in question was submitted by graduate student Rene Gonzalez and published Wednesday in the Daily Collegian. It was titled "Pat Tillman is not a hero: he got what was coming to him."


Gonzalez writes that Tillman was a "Rambo" who probably acted out of "nationalist patriotic fantasies." In his own neighborhood in Puerto Rico, according to Gonzalez, Tillman would not have been considered a hero, but a "pendejo," or idiot.


The column drew harsh criticism from many on campus. University president Jack Wilson says the op-ed piece was "disgusting, arrogant and intellectually immature."


Tillman, who gave up his NFL career to join the Army Rangers in 2002, was killed in combat one week ago in Afghanistan. The military announced on Wednesday that he has been posthumously promoted to the rank of corporal and awarded the Purple Heart and Meritorious Service Medal.


"You know he was a real Rambo, who wanted to be in the 'real' thick of things," Gonzalez writes in his column, which is posted on the collegiate paper's Web site. "I could tell he was that type of macho guy, from his scowling, beefy face on the CNN pictures. Well, he got his wish. Even Rambo got shot in the third movie, but in real life, you die as a result of being shot. They should call Pat Tillman's army life 'Rambo 4: Rambo Attempts to Strike Back at His Former Rambo 3 Taliban Friends, and Gets Killed.'"


Gonzalez also says that Tillman's service was not "necessary."


"It wasn't like he was defending the East coast from an invasion of a foreign power. THAT would have been heroic and laudable," Gonzalez writes. "What he did was make himself useful to a foreign invading army, and he paid for it. It's hard to say I have any sympathy for his death because I don't feel like his 'service' was necessary. He wasn't defending me, nor was he defending the Afghani people. He was acting out his macho, patriotic crap and I guess someone with a bigger gun did him in."


In a letter to its readers Thursday, the Daily Collegian says Gonzalez' opinion in no way reflects that of the newspaper's editorial board. A column by one of the editors praising Tillman's sacrifice ran in the paper next to the one by Gonzalez.


"We do not hold back from printing news stories, columns or editorials that may upset our readership -- instead, we seek to both inform and stir debate through our publication," the letter, also posted on the Web site, reads. "Our decision to publish Gonzalez's column -- an opinion piece written by a member of our campus community -- is the only way for us to live up to this ideal."


Tillman will be eulogized at a public memorial service in his hometown of San Jose, Calif., early next week, and funeral arrangements are pending.


The body of Tillman arrived at Dover Air Force Base in Delaware on Monday. His brother, Spc. Kevin Tillman, also a Ranger with the 2nd Battalion of the 75th Ranger Regiment, was expected to accompany the body to the funeral home, Lawrence said.


Tillman was killed in a firefight on a road near Sperah, about 25 miles southwest of a U.S. base at Khost.


After coming under fire, Tillman's patrol got out of their vehicles and gave chase, moving toward the spot of the ambush. Beevers said the fighting was "sustained" and lasted 15-20 minutes.


The Cardinals said they will retire Tillman's No. 40 and name the plaza surrounding the new stadium under construction in suburban Glendale the "Pat Tillman Freedom Plaza."


Information from The Associated Press was used in this report.





what an idiot... that is sad that he would write about tillman like that, if more people were like pat tillman we would live in a much better world...


http://sports.espn.go.com/nfl/news/story?id=1792200

biloxi-indian 04-29-2004 10:07 PM

the most sickening thing i have ever read
 
Sad, so very sad! Tillman fights and dies for the very freedom this person uses to express his opinions about an American soldier who provides the very security he sleeps under tonight. Forget Tillman was a former NFL player, he was an American who volunteered for service.

Let\'s see if Rene Gonzalez will express his courage and volunteer for duty! My bet is he will be drawn into service alright... by volunteering for the cheerleading squad at UMASS.

Sad, so very sad!

ami2kind4words 04-29-2004 10:31 PM

the most sickening thing i have ever read
 
The article is so stupid and sickening that it bring me to the question to why circulate her ignorance on here? The only thing I percieve is that she want some attention for being a ignorant @##$% (woof Woof). Sorry to say I can\'t think of anyone who will turn down Millions to serve his/her country so in my book Tillman is a orignally Hero. Remarks like this shouldn\'t be tolerated or circulated to tarnish a true hero.

WhoDat 04-29-2004 10:43 PM

the most sickening thing i have ever read
 
Pak, even on this board, I cannot remember being more sickened by a post. A man gives his life for his country - agree or disagree with the cause that\'s noble - and some a$$hole wants to belittle that which is the ultimate sacrifice.

I wonder if Gonzalez would have said the same thing about those who died \"invading\" Germany during WWII - afterall, it\'s not like the Germans attacked America. Iraq harbored, supported, and generally bred people who did attack this country. In fact, they killed more people in New York alone than were killed at Pearl Harbor, if memory serves. When that happens you hit back... hard. Tillman is more of a man than I. I doubt I would ever have given up millions to risk life and limb to fight this fight. He did, and he gave his life, and he should be honored as a hero for that.

saintz08 04-29-2004 11:17 PM

the most sickening thing i have ever read
 
Someone as stupid as Gonzalez needs only be called one thing :

Bait ..... ;)

vulture 04-29-2004 11:31 PM

the most sickening thing i have ever read
 
What do you expect from some third world immigrant who is lucky enough to even be in this country? If he feels that Pat Tillman got what he deserved then maybe one day this jacka$$ will get what is coming to him and all the other wets who come here to piss on this country and milk it for the benefits and that\'s deported. He\'s fortunate enough to be an immigrant hispanic and able to say what is on his mind unlike most people in this country who have to hide behind a curtain of political correctness for fear of being called the great \"racist\" which is exactly what grants people like him the ability to be here.

D_it_up 04-30-2004 09:21 AM

the most sickening thing i have ever read
 
Quote:

Gonzalez writes that Tillman was a \"Rambo\" who probably acted out of \"nationalist patriotic fantasies.\" In his own neighborhood in Puerto Rico, according to Gonzalez, Tillman would not have been considered a hero, but a \"pendejo,\" or idiot.
This just goes to show how ignorant foreign people are about the United States. I have nothing against people of other cultures until they blatantly disgrace Americans, which Gonzalez did. I\'m all about freedom of speech and expression which this country was founded on, but to sit there and say Pat Tillman wasn\'t a hero with a straight face is asanine, uneducated, and downright disgusting. Pat Tillman and EVERY SINGLE SOLDIER IN THE MILITARY ARE HEROS. I take great offense to this as do all of you, i\'m sure. I served in the military for 6 years, and fortunately, never had to go into any type of battle situation. Had the opportunity come around, I would have been up to the task. Pat Tillman saw it his patriotic duty to fight for his country. Unfortunately, he lost his life in the fight, but that just shows his willingness to die for the United States. What does a Puerto Rican know about AMERICAN patriotism? Obviously this one knows absolutely nothing. To sit there and have the balls to write an article in a newspaper IN THE STATES about Pat Tillman not being a hero has to be one of the dumbest moves I\'ve ever seen. What goes around, comes around, Rene Gonzalez. You will catch hell in the United States for this stunt. Don\'t let the airplane door hit you on the ass on your way back to Puerto Rico. Better yet, I hope you get caught in that door on the outside of the plane. GOD BLESS AMERICA AND OUR TROOPS!!!!!!!

BlackandBlue 04-30-2004 11:50 AM

the most sickening thing i have ever read
 
I would guess that this is the end result of some heartbreak, where he had his heart crushed by some fly by night ditz, and can\'t for the life of him figure out why he isn\'t loved.
Even when I was in college, I couldn\'t stand the ideals and practices that some of our youth adhire to. Yes, you\'re getting a higher education, and yes, this is a momentous time in their lives, but this does not put you on a higher plane than everyone else in existance. There is a real problem with college students in confusing freedom of speech with good taste. They trample good taste, and hide behind the basic principles of this country.

[Edited on 30/4/2004 by BlackandBlue]

canucksaint 04-30-2004 02:23 PM

the most sickening thing i have ever read
 
I debated responding to this post, as I would not want to be seen as trying to tarnish the memory of Pat Tillman, however I equally would not wish to be associated with some of the comments that have been said regarding the original article.

While I don’t subscribe to the same thoughts of the writer of this article, I am equally offended by some (not all) of the responses that I have seen. I feel that this (like a lot of university publications) are done without too much thought into the overall impact of their writing, as I am sure this writer did, and admits in their apology. http://sports.espn.go.com/nfl/news/story?id=1792673
Some of these responses are hopefully just knee-jerk reactions to an offensive piece of writing; however the responses are equally offensive to all. I don’t feel that you need to be American to understand patriotism, or understand the deep emotions of what happened on 9/11. Your country, from what I understand welcomes everyone, and hopefully not into the loving arms of people like Vulture who seem to spew bigotry. (hopefully his response was just a pissed off reaction, and not true feelings.)
While I do not agree with the attack on Iraq, WhoDat’s statement seems to be somewhat flawed (in my eyes). I don’t recall Iraq killing more people in New York than Pearl Harbour. I am not trying to diminish this day, but lay blame where it should be. That blame is to lie at the feet of Al-Qaeda.
I do agree with B&B, this article was in bad taste, regardless of an apology. However sometimes we have to take the good and the bad together. That’s what makes this such an interesting society.



ami2kind4words 04-30-2004 02:57 PM

the most sickening thing i have ever read
 
I 100% agree w/ canucksaint. I figured this will start racism remarks. People must remember that Tillman and many other soliders w/ different nationality fought to keep America free. Don\'t let ignorant statement by others cause you to show your ignorance. Like I said before I wish this article didn\'t spread to this forum cuz you only making Gonzalez words circulate and spread like a cancer.


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