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Adalius Thomas,

this is a discussion within the Saints Community Forum; Originally Posted by TheDeuce Originally Posted by DJLengai We need a guy for the middle of that defense, a true MLB, and Thomas ain't it. We've got Fujita and Shanle on the outside, both who are good players. Also, in ...

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Old 01-29-2007, 07:12 PM   #21
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Originally Posted by TheDeuce
Originally Posted by DJLengai
We need a guy for the middle of that defense, a true MLB, and Thomas ain't it. We've got Fujita and Shanle on the outside, both who are good players. Also, in case you haven't noticed, Thomas plays in a 46 defense which allows him to be primarily an edge rusher.
Are you actually serious or did you fall and hit your head on something? Adalius plays all over becuase he is the best Ravens' LB and doesn't play the middle (excpet when Lewis is injured) becuase Ray can't play like Thomas.
Wow, that's one of the most ludicrous things I've heard in a while on this board. The best LB on the Ravens is Adalius Thomas? Really? How do you figure? Because he had 20 less tackles than Ray Lewis AND Bart Scott? Because he had fewer interceptions than Ray Lewis AND Bart Scott? Because he had less pass deflections than Ray Lewis AND Bart Scott? Because he didn't have any forced fumbles, but Lewis did? Oh I guess I see why... because he had 11.5 sacks. Is that why he's "the best" linebacker on the team? Sure, 11.5 sacks is extremely impressive (fyi, it was 2nd best on the team), but I think that has more to do with the position that he plays than truly how "great" he is. Like I explained in my previous post, the 46 defense that Baltimore runs allows these OLBs to rush off the edge because they've got big uglies in the middle collapsing the middle of the line and 2 DEs who are also bringing pressure. They can't block everybody, so guys like Thomas are going to have oppportunities to get to the QB. That's the reason why Bart Scott (another LB, who happened to have 20 more tackles, more interceptions, more TFL, and more pass deflections) only had 1.5 sacks less than Thomas (9.5). Hell I could make a point that Bart Scott is better than Thomas, but I don't necessarily believe that it would be completely correct (even though statistically he had a much better year). But you seem to have been missing the points of my posts in their entirety. Don't just look at the part where I talk about him being a product of his teammates and the system he plays in... look at the other stuff I'm saying. I'm saying he's a very good player. He's probably the most versatile player in the NFL. I'm saying I'd like to see him in black and gold. But what you apparently don't get is that we have bigger needs (CB for one), and it's also my humble opinion that if we're going to go out and get a linebacker, why not get one who addresses a need? Do we need a guy who can play OLB, DE, MLB, Safety, CB, waterboy, popcorn guy, and mascot? No!!!!! Here' my point!!!!! We have Fujita and Shanle who are two very solid OLBs. We don't have a very good MLB. Thomas is not a MLB. Plain and simple. If you want to argue, you're wasting your time and perhaps more importantly, my time, because you're just plain wrong. The guy is an outside LB, a rushing linebacker, and a very good one, but he doesn't belong at the LB, and the Ravens know this. That's why they have Ray Lewis there, in case you haven't noticed.

Oh and by the way... you're right, I guess Ray Lewis STARTS AT MIDDLE LINEBACKER because he's WORSE than Adlius Thomas. That makes a lot of sense. If Adalius Thomas is the best MLB on the team, I'm sure Rex Ryan sits there and thinks "Hmmmm.... I've got an idea, let's move our best MLB (Adalius Thomas) all over the field to unnatural positions because Ray Lewis is worse than him. I think I'd rather have a worse MLB play there." I think the reason Ray plays MLB is because he's the best MLB on that squad. You can try and argue that, but I'll trust Rex Ryan because that's where he says Ray Lewis should play and he's the one with a top 5 defense year in and year out.
Lewis starts at the middle because he doesn't have the ability to play DE, DT or go wide in coverage like Thomas can. They are both excellent players. Thomas plays all over becuase Rex Ryan understands that Lewis can't perform well at those other positions. Moving a player to different positions with different assignments will not rack stats.

A MLB needs to have awareness, discipline, athleticism, speed, be able to shed blocks, tackle well, rush, cover, pursue, and understand the offensive formations. Thomas has all of these abilities. He's 270 pounds and has the speed to cover TE's, RB's, and receivers. He can move sideline to sideline. He can rush. He can tackle. He can clog running lanes. He can take on and shed blockers. What more is a MLB supposed to be able to do? Scream a lot and do funky dances?

You don't really believe that Thomas was unblocked on all of his sacks because of the D the Ravens run do you?

I also agree that we need a CB more than we need a MLB. We have the monies available to sign Nate and Adalius as well as bringing back Grant, Stinchomb, Hollis, Shanle, and the others. The window is only open for a few seasons so the time is ripe.
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Old 01-29-2007, 11:33 PM   #22
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Lewis starts at the middle because he doesn't have the ability to play DE, DT or go wide in coverage like Thomas can.
Yeah, and probably that little fact that Ray Lewis is the greatest MLB of his generation...

A MLB needs to have awareness, discipline, athleticism, speed, be able to shed blocks, tackle well, rush, cover, pursue, and understand the offensive formations. Thomas has all of these abilities.
Sure he does. He can also walk on water and turn water to wine. Your argument is ridiculous; you basically just said the guy can do everything without providing any reasons. Listen, he's not a MLB. He's an OLB that is a good fit for a 3-4 or a 46 defense, not a 4-3. He doesn't play MLB because he's not as good as Ray Lewis, FACT.

This is from Scouts, Inc.:
Thomas is athletic and extremely versatile. He can play many different roles in multiple schemes and is a fine special teams player. He has steadily refined his technique from a two-point stance. He has the size and functional strength to set the edge against the run. He has improved his block recognition and hand use. He can stack and hold the point or avoid and move through trash. He is a good pursuit defender. He has a knack for timing up blitzes. He is a strong tackler in the box. He has an explosive first step and good initial quickness on the pass rush. He works hard and can bend the edge and close on quarterbacks. He has active hands and can grab to get on a blocker's edge. He can be disruptive off inside games and zone fires. He gets his hands up and into passing lanes. Thomas isn't very fluid and still could refine his overall technique. He is cut high and doesn't bend very well. He has some limitations in coverage. He needs to be more explosive with his hands when separating from blocks. He has few pass-rush countermoves.
You don't really believe that Thomas was unblocked on all of his sacks because of the D the Ravens run do you?
No I don't, that would be dumb if I did. But I do think that he was certainly aided by the defense, and he wouldn't have nearly that amount of sacks if he played in say, the Saints defense. The guy's a player, there's no doubt about it, but if you can't realize the beneficial results of having Ray Lewis, Ed Reed, Bart Scott, Terrell Suggs, Trevor Pryce (13 sacks), Chris McAllister, Haloti Ngata, Samari Rolle, and Kelly Gregg on his defense, then you're blind.

I also agree that we need a CB more than we need a MLB. We have the monies available to sign Nate and Adalius as well as bringing back Grant, Stinchomb, Hollis, Shanle, and the others. The window is only open for a few seasons so the time is ripe.


Yeah, and while we're at it, why don't we just sign Dwight Freeney, Lance Briggs, and Asante Samuel. $29 million isn't going to get us the #1 CB and the #1 OLB, a DE looking for a big paycheck, our starting RT, our starting DT, our starting OLB, and "others".
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Old 01-30-2007, 01:11 AM   #23
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I know they will do their best to make the team better, I just can't wait until FA and the draft.
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Old 01-30-2007, 11:44 AM   #24
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Thomas is athletic and extremely versatile. He can play many different roles in multiple schemes and is a fine special teams player.
He has improved his block recognition and hand use. He can stack and hold the point or avoid and move through trash. He is a good pursuit defender. He has a knack for timing up blitzes. He is a strong tackler in the box. He has an explosive first step and good initial quickness on the pass rush.
He has active hands and can grab to get on a blocker's edge. He can be disruptive off inside games and zone fires. He gets his hands up and into passing lanes.
There is more about how well he can perform at MLB in there than there is about edge rushing. You conveniently forgot to highlight all of this info.


Yeah, and while we're at it, why don't we just sign Dwight Freeney, Lance Briggs, and Asante Samuel. $29 million isn't going to get us the #1 CB and the #1 OLB, a DE looking for a big paycheck, our starting RT, our starting DT, our starting OLB, and "others".

having Ray Lewis, Ed Reed, Bart Scott, Terrell Suggs, Trevor Pryce (13 sacks), Chris McAllister, Haloti Ngata, Samari Rolle, and Kelly Gregg on his defense
You trapped yourself on that one. The Ravens can afford signing/paying all of these players plus Thomas, McNair, and J. Lewis. Smith, Grant and McKenzie are the big 3 on our D. We have a low amount of FA this season and substantial monies to sign these players.

Urlacher wasn't a MLB and I'm sure there were plenty of "analysts" with "stats" that tried to make themselves appear on the surface to know what they're talking about as you have. He seems to have transitioned just fine into the MLB role.
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Old 01-31-2007, 01:38 AM   #25
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There is more about how well he can perform at MLB in there than there is about edge rushing. You conveniently forgot to highlight all of this info.
O really? Where does it say ".... and all of these things would make him a great MLB."? O yeah, it doesn't.

You trapped yourself on that one. The Ravens can afford signing/paying all of these players plus Thomas, McNair, and J. Lewis. Smith, Grant and McKenzie are the big 3 on our D. We have a low amount of FA this season and substantial monies to sign these players.
I don't really think I did. Do you think all of those guys have huge contracts? No. Also, the Ravens have neglected their offense for years. They aren't paying two Pro Bowl calibur running backs. Their QB isn't making $10 mil a season. I could go on. The point is, there are limits to how many of these guys we will be able to sign. We are just going to have to be smart about it.

Urlacher wasn't a MLB and I'm sure there were plenty of "analysts" with "stats" that tried to make themselves appear on the surface to know what they're talking about as you have. He seems to have transitioned just fine into the MLB role.
I know Brian Urlacher, and Adalius Thomas my friend, is no Brian Urlacher.
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Old 01-31-2007, 07:38 AM   #26
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You really have to look at one of Deuce's points.

In a perfect world you would have a complete and balanced offense and defense. However, most teams will focus in on oneside of the ball with most of their money. For us, the offense; the Ravens their defense.

Guys, I really think this is where having great coaches comes into play. Lets say we get a mediocre MLB, but the coach knows the guy has potential. His knowledge and working with the guy will make him better. Look at our defense at the begining of the year. Everyone, EVERYONE laughed and said their was no way this defense could stop anyone. Did they give up big plays????? Sure they did. How many games did we make big plays???? A butt ton. Yes, we need a CB. I love Fred and all but he just can't keep up. I really think we maybe a little too hard on Fred at times. Remeber, his hand was broke most of the season and still did a good job. If his had wasn't broke during Dallas, we have an INT and T.O. doesn't catch the TD.

Money right now is the problem. We don't have it.

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Old 01-31-2007, 07:41 AM   #27
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By the way if our Defense is so screwed up, I don't think we would be NFC South Champs, beat the #2 Offense and would not have played in the NFC Championship game; by the way just in case some of you don't remember, was our first time to do that.

JMO

May the bashing begin.....
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