Interesting Shockey Article

Tobias-Reiper · 04-18-2008, 02:49 PM

Originally Posted by SaintFanInATLHELL

I don't think that I've reiterated in a while that any move on the #10 pick that doesn't result in the acquisition of a solid defensive starter is a bad idea. Also any move that trades even a somewhat solid defensive starter (such as Harper) for an offensive player is also a bad idea.

I just feel like jawing a bit today. It almost seems like folks are so interested in acquiring offensive talent so that they can stock their fantasy football teams. "Can you imagine Brees' and Shockey's stats if they play together?"

The Saints have 6 TE. SIX! The team thought well enough of two free agents to resign them. Brees threw for nearly 4500 yards with supposedly crappy tight ends last year.

I really hope all this Shockey stuff is a smoke screen and that the Saints will use their early draft picks for solid defensive talent that will help the defense get off the field.

Just a reminder just in case you hadn't read it in a while.

SFIAH

I agree that the #10 pick HAS to yield defensive talent. No question

... but out of the 6 TEs the Saints have, the best one is Billy Miller. Yes, Billy Miller. So, I would not mind the 2nd round pick going to the Giants for Shockey, unless someone can guarantee me that they'll get Ellis in the first round and Connor in the 2nd round.

SaintFanInATLHELL · 04-18-2008, 04:19 PM

Originally Posted by Tobias-Reiper

I agree that the #10 pick HAS to yield defensive talent. No question

Good.

... but out of the 6 TEs the Saints have, the best one is Billy Miller. Yes, Billy Miller.

Actually I agree with this assessment. I think Billy Miller should win the starting job outright. All he seems to do is make plays.

So, I would not mind the 2nd round pick going to the Giants for Shockey, unless someone can guarantee me that they'll get Ellis in the first round and Connor in the 2nd round.

I'd love that guarantee too. But sadly it's probably going to take a move up to #7 or #8 to get Ellis and may require some shuffling of the #2 or #3 pick to pull it off.

So I don't think an Ellis/Connor (or Ellis/Mayo?) would be a lock by any stretch of the imagination.

But the talk sounds like the Saints offense will go kaput if they don't get Shockey. Or Chad Johnson. Thank goodness the Clady chatter finally died.

What this offense needs more than anything else is a defense that supports them and erases their inevitable screwups. A defense that can get scoring in the ballpark of 17 PPG. That defense coupled with the existing healthy offense will most likely be in Tampa come next January.

A TE won't get the Saints to the promised land. A stud DT/LB/CB combo with the existing offense just may be able to pull it off.

SFIAH

saintsfan1976 · 04-18-2008, 04:57 PM

Originally Posted by BRSaintsFan

Michael Smith just reported on ESPN's On The Clock that he believes Shockey will be a Saint before the draft EITHER for the Saints 2nd round pick OR Roman Harper and a late second day pick. Im all down with Harper and a later round pick. That still gives us the flexibility to possibly make a run at Dorsey as speculated by swapping 1s and giving our 2 or to still get Rivers at 10 and a CB at 40.

Getting Dorsey will cost a whole lot more than swapping 1's and giving our 2.

If we do loose Harper then we should trade back from #10 for more value picks.

BRSaintsFan · 04-18-2008, 05:46 PM

Originally Posted by saintsfan1976

Getting Dorsey will cost a whole lot more than swapping 1's and giving our 2.

If we do loose Harper then we should trade back from #10 for more value picks.

Maybe so but using the updated value chart for picks

Rams #2 = 1900

Saints #10= 1375 + Saints #40 500 = 1875

With the Rams having needs all across the board, they would seemingly like to trade down.

hagan714 · 04-18-2008, 06:45 PM

I am not crazy about Harper and a late pick at all.

winmill1 · 04-18-2008, 09:41 PM

I think that Shockey is a great pass catching, play making tight, but it seemed when given the opportunity Billy Miller was a major asset. I remember in many games last year(and at crucial times) he and Colston weremkng the huge plays. And I could be wrong but it seemed like he was always creating seperation between defenders. I could be off but it seems like he could be an offensive weapon. I just think we should load up on defense as much as possible. Any thoughts on Miller.

SaintsStorm · 04-18-2008, 09:54 PM

I am not a fan of this. I do not think we are in this big of a need for a TE

I believe our offense will be fine without Shockey

I would hope we could possibly pick another defensive player and build some depth either in the Secondary/Line

SaintFanInATLHELL · 04-19-2008, 12:22 PM

Originally Posted by SaintsStorm

I am not a fan of this. I do not think we are in this big of a need for a TE

I believe our offense will be fine without Shockey

I would hope we could possibly pick another defensive player and build some depth either in the Secondary/Line

A voice of reason screaming in the wilderness.

I just wanted to let you know that I hear you. I hear you.

SFIAH

BRSaintsFan · 04-19-2008, 12:43 PM

I like Billy Miller and he is an asset as a receiver. His greatest value is finding the gaps underneath and settling in for the dumpoff. Shockey would bring a different dimension to the offense in that he can not only catch the dumpoff, but also make something out of it. Again, I think Miller is great for Brees being able to check off to, but Shockey provides mismatch problems against any defense in the league along with the ability to stretch the middle of the field as well as make plays in the seams of the defense. If it happens, it adds a great dimension to the offense. If somehow it could happen with Harper and a late pick, you still leave yourself the flexibility to make a play at Dorsey, or stay at 10 and take Rivers or a corner. You also hang onto the 2nd round pick where you can either go corner/LB/DT or possibly even get a Kenny Phillips if he somehow falls to replace Harper at S. I like Harper but I think that Bullocks and KK can get effectively get the job done with some other players around them. Ideally, I would like to see the Shockey trade happen for Bullocks in a late pick, but that may be wishful thinking.

pakowitz · 04-19-2008, 01:56 PM

Originally Posted by SaintsStorm

I am not a fan of this. I do not think we are in this big of a need for a TE

I believe our offense will be fine without Shockey

I would hope we could possibly pick another defensive player and build some depth either in the Secondary/Line

im sorry but i totally disagree with this.. after reggie brees and colston we have an injured deuce and a bunch of other players who wouldnt likely see playing time on alot of other teams.. we definetly need another playmaker on offense to take the pressure off colston and reggie to do something..

04-18-2008, 02:49 PM	#11
Tobias-Reiper Merces Letifer Join Date: Dec 2004 Posts: 4,161	Re: Interesting Shockey Article Originally Posted by SaintFanInATLHELL I don't think that I've reiterated in a while that any move on the #10 pick that doesn't result in the acquisition of a solid defensive starter is a bad idea. Also any move that trades even a somewhat solid defensive starter (such as Harper) for an offensive player is also a bad idea. I just feel like jawing a bit today. It almost seems like folks are so interested in acquiring offensive talent so that they can stock their fantasy football teams. "Can you imagine Brees' and Shockey's stats if they play together?" The Saints have 6 TE. SIX! The team thought well enough of two free agents to resign them. Brees threw for nearly 4500 yards with supposedly crappy tight ends last year. I really hope all this Shockey stuff is a smoke screen and that the Saints will use their early draft picks for solid defensive talent that will help the defense get off the field. Just a reminder just in case you hadn't read it in a while. SFIAH I agree that the #10 pick HAS to yield defensive talent. No question ... but out of the 6 TEs the Saints have, the best one is Billy Miller. Yes, Billy Miller. So, I would not mind the 2nd round pick going to the Giants for Shockey, unless someone can guarantee me that they'll get Ellis in the first round and Connor in the 2nd round.

04-18-2008, 04:19 PM	#12
SaintFanInATLHELL The Professor Join Date: Oct 2003 Location: Lithonia, GA Posts: 2,647	Re: Interesting Shockey Article Originally Posted by Tobias-Reiper I agree that the #10 pick HAS to yield defensive talent. No question Good. ... but out of the 6 TEs the Saints have, the best one is Billy Miller. Yes, Billy Miller. Actually I agree with this assessment. I think Billy Miller should win the starting job outright. All he seems to do is make plays. So, I would not mind the 2nd round pick going to the Giants for Shockey, unless someone can guarantee me that they'll get Ellis in the first round and Connor in the 2nd round. I'd love that guarantee too. But sadly it's probably going to take a move up to #7 or #8 to get Ellis and may require some shuffling of the #2 or #3 pick to pull it off. So I don't think an Ellis/Connor (or Ellis/Mayo?) would be a lock by any stretch of the imagination. But the talk sounds like the Saints offense will go kaput if they don't get Shockey. Or Chad Johnson. Thank goodness the Clady chatter finally died. What this offense needs more than anything else is a defense that supports them and erases their inevitable screwups. A defense that can get scoring in the ballpark of 17 PPG. That defense coupled with the existing healthy offense will most likely be in Tampa come next January. A TE won't get the Saints to the promised land. A stud DT/LB/CB combo with the existing offense just may be able to pull it off. SFIAH
	Super Bowl Championships: New Orleans Saints:1, Carolina:0, Atlanta Chokers: STILL ZERO Only Atlanta choked in an unchokable situation... Life is definitely good.

04-18-2008, 04:57 PM	#13
saintsfan1976 10000 POST CLUB Join Date: Apr 2007 Location: Atlanta Posts: 10,534 Blog Entries: 3	Re: Interesting Shockey Article Originally Posted by BRSaintsFan Michael Smith just reported on ESPN's On The Clock that he believes Shockey will be a Saint before the draft EITHER for the Saints 2nd round pick OR Roman Harper and a late second day pick. Im all down with Harper and a later round pick. That still gives us the flexibility to possibly make a run at Dorsey as speculated by swapping 1s and giving our 2 or to still get Rivers at 10 and a CB at 40. Getting Dorsey will cost a whole lot more than swapping 1's and giving our 2. If we do loose Harper then we should trade back from #10 for more value picks.

04-18-2008, 05:46 PM	#14
BRSaintsFan 100th Post Join Date: Jul 2004 Location: Atlanta, GA Posts: 449	Re: Interesting Shockey Article Originally Posted by saintsfan1976 Getting Dorsey will cost a whole lot more than swapping 1's and giving our 2. If we do loose Harper then we should trade back from #10 for more value picks. Maybe so but using the updated value chart for picks Rams #2 = 1900 Saints #10= 1375 + Saints #40 500 = 1875 With the Rams having needs all across the board, they would seemingly like to trade down.

04-18-2008, 06:45 PM	#15
hagan714 LB Mentallity Join Date: Dec 2005 Posts: 15,870 Blog Entries: 68	Re: Interesting Shockey Article I am not crazy about Harper and a late pick at all.

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04-18-2008, 09:41 PM	#16
winmill1 100th Post Join Date: Jul 2007 Posts: 423	Re: Interesting Shockey Article I think that Shockey is a great pass catching, play making tight, but it seemed when given the opportunity Billy Miller was a major asset. I remember in many games last year(and at crucial times) he and Colston weremkng the huge plays. And I could be wrong but it seemed like he was always creating seperation between defenders. I could be off but it seems like he could be an offensive weapon. I just think we should load up on defense as much as possible. Any thoughts on Miller.
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04-18-2008, 09:54 PM	#17
SaintsStorm Rookie Join Date: Apr 2008 Posts: 1	Re: Interesting Shockey Article I am not a fan of this. I do not think we are in this big of a need for a TE I believe our offense will be fine without Shockey I would hope we could possibly pick another defensive player and build some depth either in the Secondary/Line
SaintsStorm Rookie Join Date: Apr 2008 Posts: 1

04-19-2008, 12:22 PM	#18
SaintFanInATLHELL The Professor Join Date: Oct 2003 Location: Lithonia, GA Posts: 2,647	Re: Interesting Shockey Article Originally Posted by SaintsStorm I am not a fan of this. I do not think we are in this big of a need for a TE I believe our offense will be fine without Shockey I would hope we could possibly pick another defensive player and build some depth either in the Secondary/Line A voice of reason screaming in the wilderness. I just wanted to let you know that I hear you. I hear you. SFIAH

04-19-2008, 12:43 PM	#19
BRSaintsFan 100th Post Join Date: Jul 2004 Location: Atlanta, GA Posts: 449	Re: Interesting Shockey Article I like Billy Miller and he is an asset as a receiver. His greatest value is finding the gaps underneath and settling in for the dumpoff. Shockey would bring a different dimension to the offense in that he can not only catch the dumpoff, but also make something out of it. Again, I think Miller is great for Brees being able to check off to, but Shockey provides mismatch problems against any defense in the league along with the ability to stretch the middle of the field as well as make plays in the seams of the defense. If it happens, it adds a great dimension to the offense. If somehow it could happen with Harper and a late pick, you still leave yourself the flexibility to make a play at Dorsey, or stay at 10 and take Rivers or a corner. You also hang onto the 2nd round pick where you can either go corner/LB/DT or possibly even get a Kenny Phillips if he somehow falls to replace Harper at S. I like Harper but I think that Bullocks and KK can get effectively get the job done with some other players around them. Ideally, I would like to see the Shockey trade happen for Bullocks in a late pick, but that may be wishful thinking.

04-19-2008, 01:56 PM	#20
pakowitz The Dark Overlord Join Date: Oct 2002 Location: dirty south Posts: 3,450	Re: Interesting Shockey Article Originally Posted by SaintsStorm I am not a fan of this. I do not think we are in this big of a need for a TE I believe our offense will be fine without Shockey I would hope we could possibly pick another defensive player and build some depth either in the Secondary/Line im sorry but i totally disagree with this.. after reggie brees and colston we have an injured deuce and a bunch of other players who wouldnt likely see playing time on alot of other teams.. we definetly need another playmaker on offense to take the pressure off colston and reggie to do something..