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Anyone think Miami will be harder to beat?

this is a discussion within the Saints Community Forum; Originally Posted by CantonLegend actually kevin smith is in the same boat as PT....underrated by the rest of the league but pretty talented brian westbrook is pretty good thomas jones and leon washington are 2 good running backs behind a ...

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Old 10-21-2009, 06:08 PM   #11
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Re: Anyone think Miami will be harder to beat?

Originally Posted by CantonLegend View Post
actually kevin smith is in the same boat as PT....underrated by the rest of the league but pretty talented

brian westbrook is pretty good

thomas jones and leon washington are 2 good running backs behind a beastly offensive line

fred jackson isnt a starter but he is pretty good as far as backups go

brandon jacobs and ahmad bradshaw are studs on one of the best running teams in the league

id say that we shut down teams pretty well as far as the running game is concerned

also dont forget that making our opponents pass the ball early is a huge part of why our defense has been so successful.....

while it may be hard to stop the wildcat, if they cant stop our offense then they will be playing the way we want them to
I said PRIME TIME, not "pretty good" or "good". Ronnie Brown is one of the best backs in the league. We have not seen a back like him yet this season (Thomas Jones is close, but he only carried the ball 13 times in that game, and Brandon Jacobs is averaging 3.6 yards per carry this season). Nor have we seen the wildcat. Point is, this is a dangerous team when they're clicking, and they looked like they were clicking in their last game. I still think the Saints are the better team, but we need to take this game seriously.
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Old 10-21-2009, 06:17 PM   #12
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Re: Anyone think Miami will be harder to beat?

Originally Posted by TheDeuce View Post
I said PRIME TIME, not "pretty good" or "good". Ronnie Brown is one of the best backs in the league. We have not seen a back like him yet this season (Thomas Jones is close, but he only carried the ball 13 times in that game, and Brandon Jacobs is averaging 3.6 yards per carry this season). Nor have we seen the wildcat. Point is, this is a dangerous team when they're clicking, and they looked like they were clicking in their last game. I still think the Saints are the better team, but we need to take this game seriously.
brian westbrook and thomas jones arent as good as ronnie brown?

thomas jones has 481 yards on 96 carries and 6 TDs

Brown has 443 yards on 93 carries and 6 TDs

ahmad bradshaw has 423 yards on 68 carries with 3 TDs

fred jackson has 415 yards on 98 carries and hes a backup

i understand that ronnie brown is the ideal player to run a wildcat formation but as far as running backs go, ronnie brown is not a head and shoulders above the other running backs we have played....he may be slightly better, but not a ton

"deal with it or you can go play the saints and get trounced by 30 and you won't have to worry about it."-colin cowherd
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Old 10-21-2009, 07:04 PM   #13
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Re: Anyone think Miami will be harder to beat?

Originally Posted by CantonLegend View Post
brian westbrook and thomas jones arent as good as ronnie brown?

thomas jones has 481 yards on 96 carries and 6 TDs

Brown has 443 yards on 93 carries and 6 TDs

ahmad bradshaw has 423 yards on 68 carries with 3 TDs

fred jackson has 415 yards on 98 carries and hes a backup

i understand that ronnie brown is the ideal player to run a wildcat formation but as far as running backs go, ronnie brown is not a head and shoulders above the other running backs we have played....he may be slightly better, but not a ton
Your forgetting that those numbers are with Ronnie having a bye week. Last week he was #2 in yards and tied for 1st in td's. Ricky was #13 last week as well.

Most of Thomas Jones yards came last week against a garbage run D in Buffalo

Westbrook was one of the best in the league over the last few years but has dropped back into the pack a little now.

The Giants duo is very good I just think Ronnie and Ricky are a hair better.

A lot of people forget that 2 years ago Ronnie was leading the league in all porpuse yard and just starting to hit his stride when he got hurt and was out for the rest of the season. This is the 1st year he has been back to 100% since that happened.

On a side note you guys have a great running triple threat as well. Not that I needed to tell you guys that but I think a lot of people think you guys are an air it out all day team and don't give you credit for how balanced your attack is.

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Old 10-21-2009, 07:11 PM   #14
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Re: Anyone think Miami will be harder to beat?

Originally Posted by FinFan View Post
Your forgetting that those numbers are with Ronnie having a bye week. Last week he was #2 in yards and tied for 1st in td's. Ricky was #13 last week as well.

Most of Thomas Jones yards came last week against a garbage run D in Buffalo

Westbrook was one of the best in the league over the last few years but has dropped back into the pack a little now.

The Giants duo is very good I just think Ronnie and Ricky are a hair better.

A lot of people forget that 2 years ago Ronnie was leading the league in all porpuse yard and just starting to hit his stride when he got hurt and was out for the rest of the season. This is the 1st year he has been back to 100% since that happened.

On a side note you guys have a great running triple threat as well. Not that I needed to tell you guys that but I think a lot of people think you guys are an air it out all day team and don't give you credit for how balanced your attack is.
first i'll address the bolded.....most of thomas jones' yards came against a terrible run defense in buffalo.....but most of brees' TDs came against a terrible pass defense in detroit and nobody is discrediting him for his talent.....just saying.....you can only play the teams on your schedule and your job is to do well....jones did his job

in fact....we know exactly how ronnie brown felt because we had a running back named reggie bush who was leading the league in touchdowns before suffering an injury last year

the fact of the matter is that we have faced quality running games and while you may think ronnie brown is better than them all, the stats dont say that and our offense puts up too many points too fast for our opponents to commit to running the ball

i used to love the dolphins but they have fallen off my radar a bit.....i just cant see their offensive line holding up against our defensive blitz and i think we will score too quickly to allow the wildcat to hurt us

of course this is just my opinion and theres really only one way to tell what happens.....heres to a great game and my boys in black and blue coming out on top

"deal with it or you can go play the saints and get trounced by 30 and you won't have to worry about it."-colin cowherd
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Old 10-21-2009, 07:17 PM   #15
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Re: Anyone think Miami will be harder to beat?

also....a couple more stats

our run defense is ranked 5th in the league

we have faced the 12th, 5th, 2nd, 20th, and 22nd ranked running offenses

despite facing some quality run offenses, our defense has managed to only allow 83 ypg on the ground
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Old 10-21-2009, 07:25 PM   #16
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Re: Anyone think Miami will be harder to beat?

Canton and Deuce and well, Finfan - you guys all make really good points (REP up). But the one dividing factor is the Wildcat. Plain and simple. People keep saying we "handled it in Philly" but we really didn't. Philly had success when they gave it a half-hearted attempt.

AND

That really opened the door for Kevin friggin KOLB to light us up!

Bottom line is the WC will be the equalizer bc the fins run it well.
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Old 10-21-2009, 07:34 PM   #17
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Re: Anyone think Miami will be harder to beat?

Originally Posted by CantonLegend View Post
first i'll address the bolded.....most of thomas jones' yards came against a terrible run defense in buffalo.....but most of brees' TDs came against a terrible pass defense in detroit and nobody is discrediting him for his talent.....just saying.....you can only play the teams on your schedule and your job is to do well....jones did his job

in fact....we know exactly how ronnie brown felt because we had a running back named reggie bush who was leading the league in touchdowns before suffering an injury last year

the fact of the matter is that we have faced quality running games and while you may think ronnie brown is better than them all, the stats dont say that and our offense puts up too many points too fast for our opponents to commit to running the ball

i used to love the dolphins but they have fallen off my radar a bit.....i just cant see their offensive line holding up against our defensive blitz and i think we will score too quickly to allow the wildcat to hurt us

of course this is just my opinion and theres really only one way to tell what happens.....heres to a great game and my boys in black and blue coming out on top
Don't get me wrong I think Jones is good. I think some times stats can be deceiving, for one Ricky takes a lot of carries away from Ronnie and I understand you could make the same argument for Jones/Washington and the Giants duo but Ronnie also has one less game then then all these guys mentioned.

If you look at the yards per game not total yards Ronnie is 3rd behind only Peterson and Chris Johnson and like I said before the bye last week Ronnie was tied for 1st in td's.

Of course there is no real right or wrong here it's just a matter of opinion. While I don't think Brown is the top RB I do think he is the most versatile, I mean how many RBs also play QB for 20% of the teams snaps.

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Old 10-21-2009, 08:08 PM   #18
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Re: Anyone think Miami will be harder to beat?

Originally Posted by TheDeuce View Post
In my opinion, their running game is very worrisome. The Saints haven't really faced a prime time running back yet this season, so we haven't really been able to see how they'll handle a good rushing attack. I've watched a couple of Dolphins games this year, and I will say that it's an impressive offense when the passing game gets going. If Henne has a good game, they'll be hard to stop because there are just so many options for them.

When Henne's off, it's easy to pack the box and stop the run, but he was pretty awesome in their win over the Jets.

The Dolphins are 2-3. If Atlanta can handle them, surely the Saints can handle them.
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Old 10-21-2009, 08:46 PM   #19
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Re: Anyone think Miami will be harder to beat?

Originally Posted by Tobias-Reiper View Post
The Dolphins are 2-3. If Atlanta can handle them, surely the Saints can handle them.
All 3 of those losses came with "Noddle Arm" Penny behind center. We are 2-0 with Henne "The Robot" as starter.

Don't get me wrong, we owe Penny a lot. With out him we don't win the division last year plus he was a great mentor to Henne.

This is an entirely different offence with Henne back there. Teams can no longer just stack the box because they now have to respect the long ball. With Penny every throw was underneath dump passes.
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Old 10-21-2009, 08:47 PM   #20
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Re: Anyone think Miami will be harder to beat?

Originally Posted by FinFan View Post
All 3 of those losses came with "Noddle Arm" Penny behind center. We are 2-0 with Henne "The Robot" as starter.

Don't get me wrong, we owe Penny a lot. With out him we don't win the division last year plus he was a great mentor to Henne.

This is an entirely different offence with Henne back there. Teams can no longer just stack the box because they now have to respect the long ball. With Penny every throw was underneath dump passes.
i know your more than content to talk about your offense....but how about switching over and telling us a little about your defense....how do you think they stack up against the best offense in the league(statistically)
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