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Don't take MY word for it...

this is a discussion within the Saints Community Forum; I think what we have here is one member trying to get under the skin of 2 other members Yep. 08 is all right. He don\'t like the taste of crow too much but he\'ll digest it sooner or later. ...

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Old 10-24-2003, 03:17 PM   #71
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Don't take MY word for it...

I think what we have here is one member trying to get under the skin of 2 other members
Yep. 08 is all right. He don\'t like the taste of crow too much but he\'ll digest it sooner or later. Who knows -- He might even be able to break the relationship off with Jake soon --
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Old 10-24-2003, 05:16 PM   #72
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Don't take MY word for it...

Alright Saintsfan

Have we eliminated your ignorance in making this statement :The West Coast offense most certainly does NOT NOT NOT use the short timing-base routes to \"set up the running game\". Brother, you\'re dead wrong...as usual.

With the following from Bill Walsh ?
Before we examine these side effects further, we should define what exactly the West Coast Offense is. As outlined to some extent by Walsh in his book, Finding the Winning Edge, and further refined from observational analysis, we find the following elements in the basic WCO used by Walsh and his successors with the 49ers:


A fairly equal mix of running and passing, although the pass seems to set up the run, which goes against the “conventional wisdom� of the NFL

\"It\'s the ball-control passing game that sets up the running game,\" Brent Jones said tight end for the 49ers.

I think I have eliminated all the big words right down to the point for you .........



[Edited on 25/10/2003 by saintz08]

\"Americans play to win at all times. I wouldn\'t give a hoot in hell for a man who lost and laughed.\" - George S. Patton
On another note, I\'ll take a bite of that crow 08. - Saintfan
Brooks is a moron!! - Halo
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Old 10-24-2003, 07:23 PM   #73
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Don't take MY word for it...

Indeed the West Coast offense can use the short pass to set up the run. I\'ve researched it on the web and found the same information you pasted here...word for word. I\'ve also found information that supports what I\'ve said...however, I\'ll will concede that to you 08. I do maintain however that, in it\'s ORIGINAL design, the West Coast offense was designed to make up for the lack of a running game by using the short pass...as a REPLACEMENT for it.

Once again, as I\'ve stated in an earlier post, we could argue what consists of a PURE West Coast offense \'til the dry cows come home and never reach an agreement.

Again, I ask you, what does this have to do with anything? What, exactly, is the point you\'re trying to make? And do you really beleive the Saints are running a pure West Coast Offense? If you think as much, then type it here and lets put it up for all the members on this board to debate. I\'ll bet you your Delhomme Jersey that most if not ALL the members of this board (and anyone else you decide to ask) will inform you as I have...that the Saints DO NOT run the West Coast offense in it\'s purest form. IT IS A V-A-R-I-A-T-I-O-N!!!!

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Old 10-24-2003, 08:02 PM   #74
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Don't take MY word for it...

Saintsfan
I do maintain however that, in it\'s ORIGINAL design, the West Coast offense was designed to make up for the lack of a running game by using the short pass...as a REPLACEMENT for it.


You can maintain all you want , but the West Coast offense was never designed for the lack of a running game . It was created for Vigil Carter .

Then Cook went down with a shoulder injury. His career was finished. In came Virgil Carter in 1970 -- smaller, agile, quick-thinking. Carter was able to go through his progressions quickly and throw on the go; not blessed with a big arm, but accurate. So Walsh crafted an offense to suit him, a horizontal offense with a lot of motion and underneath routes and breakoff patterns, an attack that now goes by the misnomer \"West Coast Offense.\"



\"Americans play to win at all times. I wouldn\'t give a hoot in hell for a man who lost and laughed.\" - George S. Patton
On another note, I\'ll take a bite of that crow 08. - Saintfan
Brooks is a moron!! - Halo
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Old 10-24-2003, 09:39 PM   #75
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Don't take MY word for it...

If I can jump in here (though I haven\'t been on this board very long), all this argument about whether the Saints run a WCO or not is pointless. 08: If McCarthy and Haslett think Brooks isn\'t the right QB for their offense (whatever they call it), they should modify the offense to suit his talents. If you think Brooks isn\'t performing well in the Saints\' offense, blame the coaches for faling to adjust the offense to fit the players they have. After all, they\'ve had several years to do so. If you think Delhomme is more talented than Brooks, I\'d like to know specifically why. OK, so we all agree he\'s a better team leader, but AB has so much better passing and scrambling skills that overall it seems clear he\'s a better choice, especially when you have receivers that can break the game open on any given play. With Horn & Co. out there, you have to want to get the ball downfield.

The genius of Walsh\'s systems was that they always made the most of the talents of each of the players involved. The smart thing to do is get the most talented players you can get, then build a system that emphasizes their talents while hiding their weaknesses. Look at what Parcells has done in Dallas so far this year without much talent (though I think they will lose this weekend as their weaknesses will be too hard to hide against the reigning champs).

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Old 10-25-2003, 09:45 AM   #76
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Don't take MY word for it...

Yes, rich006 it is very clear...clear to us all...all except for \"Mr. Agenda\" Saintz08. I agree the \"West Coast\" argument is pointless, but then so is debating 08 when it comes to Jake Delhomme. You couldn\'t pull his head outta Jakes azz with a tractor trailer.
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