The question no one wants to ask.....
 

Or think about. However after yesterday it is in your face!
Ivory is 22nd in the League in rushing, Thomas is 43rd. Had Ivory not limped off yesterday he would have had that 1 yd TD.

When Thomas returns if Ivory is still performing at this level. Who do you play?

tried and true...PT is our man.

Ivory runs harder than PT. But PT executes the swing pass to perfection. I think a healthy mix of both will be great

PT doesn't pretend he's holding a greased pig and let it slip out of his hands every other carry. Ivory ran like a beast yesterday, but he has to hold on to the ball.

I am of the mind we are Super Bowl Champs. Unless Franchised we have no man but the man who is the top performer. Now given Ivory is just starting to preform and we do not know how long Thomas will be out, this is going to get very interesting if it is 2-3 weeks from now and Ivory is still putting numbers like that down. Thomas has not been preforming at last years level this year so far.

Ivory only lost 1 fumble but I left that out because dropping the ball is a problem and who ever gets it back is some what luck.

The number that glares at me is the AVE Yards/carry. Ivory in the backfield will keep Defenses very honest.

Imagine this. Your a Defense and have to contend with Brees and his 7 targets of opportunity... (thats a Bi*#h!) Now you have to contend with Bush (floating and flying doing the dance man magic)and Ivory (running your ass over) in the back field. (Holly sh*&!).

Quite frankly i am going to fantasize about that all day.

Why must the answer be one or the other? Hey, here's an idea: Why not split carries between them? The real question becomes whether the Saints will still try to carry 4 RB's once Reggie and Pierre return to the lineup again and who to let go of between Betts and Jones as the 4th back...

I gotta say Pierre, Ivory is a stud not taking that away from him. However Pierre is the man we have relied on for the past 2 years, and you can always rely on him to come through in big game situations. Ivory is more of a bell cow back i believe, thinking that he can handle a load. But ya gotta give pierre the carries cuz he makes special things happen/
Then ya add Bush in there, split him out at WR, run a couple of fake end arounds whilst giving it up the gut to pierre and ivory, then give it to bush on the end around and let him work his magic.

Moderator please correct the spelling in my poll. should be performing not preforming. I can not find the Edit Poll button.


To realheavyd:
Because there is no fun in the easy road. This makes you think.

Regardless of how this turns out. I think once everyone is healthy Ivory will make us dominant once again. Even if it is Ivory , Thomas, and Bush...

It has taken me a while to adjust my way of thinking but I do fell it is the way Champions are made. What was done last year or for the last 5 years does not help us this year. Thomas needs to do something this year. I have no loyalty to players, only the Team.

BTW Thomas's numbers were when everyone was healthy!

I'm thinking they will split time between them, and giving Bush the usual occasional carry. Switching between who[P.T., Bush, Ivory] gets the majority of the work game to game, that'll keep those defensive coordinators guessing.

I am sure the carries will be split like normal. The only real issue Ivory has right now is holding on to the ball, which he should get better with in time. If Ivory can build towards holding the ball, and if he can stay healthy, I am sure in time he will pass Thomas on the depth chart. Thomas has been great, but not always healthy.

To answer the question between Betts and Jones, probably have to go with Jones as the 4th back once everyone is healthy again. My reason for this is Jones may have better ability to be more like Bush, thus not having to create a complete change of game plan if Bush is down. Jones can still break off long runs and can still catch passes out of the backfield. Betts is more of a power runner, which is closer to what Ivory and Thomas do already.

I'm for whatever works!!!

Hate to say it but his style of running, Ivory will have more fumbles.
He doesn't know when it's over. It's scary watching him flop around at the end of runs with defenders strickly going for the ball at that point.
PT on the other hand knows when to protect the ball.

I say use him sparsingly when PT and Bush get back to wear down defenses in the second half if the score permits it.

PT is a proven playmaker that excels in every facet of our offense. Ivory had a great game against the Buc's. Let's not get carried away. When all are healthy, Payton will find ways to get everyone the ball as he did when Bell and Hamilton were also on the roster... but PT is our guy here. With Ivory's legal woes, we have no idea how long he's going to be able to help us until he's incarcerated.

Anyone read Drew's book? "Never let your backup see the field". Bad move PT.

I voted PT, but mix them up. They each have their own talents. And when Ivory learns to hold on to the ball better, he's going to be a beast!

Unless your last name is Hartley... Then its ok.. ROFLMAO!

I would rather our opponents stay awake at night worrying about who will get the ball, than me worry about it.

Good point SaintsBro AND

No selection in the poll for "All of the above"

"All of the above" is way to easy. As fans we tend to second guess and arm chair quarterback. This makes you think, understand the repercussions. Actually weigh your decision.

Keep in mind. We brought in Ivory because of Thomas's injury. We jetted Carney because of roster space. We can't have all the eggs on game day.

p. thomas, ivory will get plenty

Between the two: Pierre Thomas if he's healthy. Turnovers have a way of cancelling even 400 yards worth of offense. Ivory looks good but lacks the discipline to seal all that great effort. A good point was made earlier about Ivory opening the door for ball strippers at the end of his runs. Has Ivory played a game yet without a fumble? regular or pre-season? I'm sure he will improve but it will take a while to get out of the bad habits he has formed. Payton will use PT, Bush, Ivory, and JJ in and out of sets as the need arises. Whoever is having the best day should be allowed to shine brightest.

Fair point. But if there was a Play both why would anyone pick one or the other?LOL

This is what I love about the Saints, our players aren't selfish. Most RBs would throw and huge fit if they had to share between 2 other RBs. Even some WRs don't like other big names on the same team.

But with the Saints, they're unselfish and play for one reason, and that's to win. That's what separates us. You have other teams where players go for stats. Unfortunately they don't realize, working as a team can bring good stats too.

I say use them both. Ivory sure did look awesome yesterday.

We need them both actually. PT offers and brings to the table a different game, as a matter of fact they all do but Ivory brings a combination of power and speed that we need. We had it somewhat with Bell and Hamilton. But Ivory and now Jones this is the best set of backs we’ve had in quit some time. I feel Betts maybe the odd back out once Bush and PT are back.

Tough question...but I picked Ivory because of this part of the question...

If PT is out for the next 3 games or so and Ivory has had 4 straight 100+ games, I think it makes it a no-brainer.

If PT is back next week, I can almost guarantee you he will be back in there.

It's not just about running the ball. PT is more versatile, especially in pass protection. Payton wants his backs to be able to pass-block, pick up blitzes, etc. Ivory is nowhere near PT in that aspect of his game. Sure he will get some action as a change of pace back, but PT is the man until Ivory becomes more of a complete player.

PT is easily the more polished all-around back. But, Ivory has more speed, power, and upside. Having PT, Bush, and Ivory all healthy is what's important. Who gets what and how many really isn't going to matter.

For this season, it's pretty clear that we'll benefit by having both. For next season, money will play a role, and if PT is looking for a big pay day we may cut him loose.

Some good points. I have a few questions..

1. What is more important?
Ability to block (I have yet to see proof Ivory can't).
Ability to make a Defense load the box so Brees can air it out easier? <-------- To me this one opens up a lot just being in the backfield.

2. What would you rather?
A back that delivers 50 yards rushing but does not fumble?
A back that Delivers 150 yards but may fumble? <-------- To me this one opens up a lot just being in the backfield.

Saint LB understood where I was going with this. I know everyone loves Thomas and he is near and dear to their heart. This whole poll and thread is based on the statement in the OP. "If Ivory is still performing this way 3 weeks from now"... In 4 games Ivory has 1/3 of the yardage that Thomas has for 22 games last year.

However if Ivory is still running like he is now when Thomas comes back. Ivory is my man. I have yet to see any Defense worry about Thomas. We do not need a blocker, that's what the O-Line is for. We need a back that can punch out 7-10 yard carries or longer to throw the Defense off.

I looked at Thomas's stats last year. There is nothing in there that would make me worry as a Defensive coordinator.
Pierre Thomas: Game Logs

Our passing game has not benefited from Thomas. It benefited from Bush. With Reggie and Ivory in the game Drew's options are wide open.

Keep this one key point in mind. There are dozens of comments out there from people who believe "they have figured us out"! Ivory putting people on their ass and chunking out 10-15 yard carries changes that whole dynamic.

We need to get out of that "thats our man" frame of mind with the exception of only a few players. No one knew who Arian Foster was last year. Now they are preparing for HIM.

Since when do we just use one back the whole game?

If Ivory keeps his 6.3 avg then linebackers have to respect the Saints run game again like last year which will open up the passing game for Drew and his cast of weapons which makes this offense scary good again

PT probably would have torched Tampa for 150 but who can say. Ivory wasn't being stacked up at the point of attack as in previous weeks. He wasn't at 10 ypc previously, he was more normal like 3.9 or so, which in my eyes, is a good number. We won a Superbowl in large part because of our positive turnover ratio. Ivory is significantly impacting that number. 400 yards of offense becomes mute if we are coughing up the ball in the red zone. PT, if healthy, should get the lion's share unless Ivory can show that he excels head-to-head against the same opponents week-to-week over time.

PT has broken 100 yds twice in his Career.


Poydras, you missed the point. We never have. We normally hand the ball to 2-3-4 players a game.... The point was who becomes the workhorse.

Both, and Reggie too

i agree ! GEAUX SAINTS!!

How about this question...

Since many blamed our offensive struggles on Bush's absence, does Ivory's play and putting up 31 points prove that Bush's absence was NOT the reason our offense struggled?

I think with the way Ivory is performing it makes the FO look very smart not giving Thomas his big money contract. He is a good player, but when you factor in his propensity to injury it is easy to see that he is a replaceable back. To answer your question I play whoever is hot at the moment.