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this is a discussion within the Saints Community Forum; Call it whatever you want, but when a guy like, I dunno, WHODAT, says that the Saints are going to be about .500 this season, and gets bashed all to hell by another guy we\'ll just call Billy, to protect ...

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Old 12-03-2003, 08:17 PM   #11
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Goodbye to all...

Call it whatever you want, but when a guy like, I dunno, WHODAT, says that the Saints are going to be about .500 this season, and gets bashed all to hell by another guy we\'ll just call Billy, to protect the innocent, who claims that the Saints are undoubtedly going to be 13-3 (I looked it up, you said 13-3 not 12-4), and then the Saints end up .500 after 75% of the season and incapable of getting to the 13-3 mark, and \"Billy\" keeps telling WhoDat about how he is short-sighted and doesn\'t understand football... well, let\'s just say it\'s hard to side with Billy and his even more greatly entrenched cohort saintfan. (how about that for a run-on sentence??)

Point is, it\'s real hard to keep up the good fight when you\'re on the losing side of the argument. I\'ll credit you Billy for at least being man enough to step up and admit you were wrong. That hasn\'t stop you from arguing about how right you are, but ocassionally the Tang wears off for long enough and you see things clearly and are cool about it. I\'ve been wrong and I will be wrong again. You and I will have plenty of good arguments in the future, but point is we\'ve both given each other credit where credit is due. Despite your Brooks goggles, you still see the rest of the field pretty well when you want to. Saintfan hadn\'t admitted being wrong in the slightest bit in over a year. It gets tough to continue to fight that fight when you arguments start to sound like those of the former Iraqi Intelligence Officer. \"Americans? There are no Americans here, and if there were they would be comitting suicide at my feet!\" (cut to picture of US tank rolling over 5 Iraqi soldiers in the background). That\'s what Saintfan has started to sound like to me.

\"Excuses, excuses, excuses. That’s all anyone ever makes for the New Orleans Saints’ organization.\" - Eric Narcisse


\"Being a Saints fan is almost like being addicted to crack,\"
he said.[i]\"You know you should stop, but you just can\'t.\"
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Old 12-03-2003, 08:36 PM   #12
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I\'m pretty sure the only person I\'ve ever flamed on this board was B&B.

But I would observe that there is perhaps no middle ground on the subject of Brooks\' play. Most Saints fans I know either
1. Adore him OR
2. Detest him.

Like it or not, Brooks seems to have polarized fans of this team. And certainly, Brooks isn\'t responsible for every loss. But Brooks does bear more share of responsibility than the average member of the special teams unit. Whether you like it or not, he is the QB and the QB\'s job is to help the offense score points. Like it or not, Brooks is the only guy on the team other than the center who touches the ball on every play.

In fairness to Brooks, a large part of his problem has been Jim Haslett. Haslett put him in over Blake after promising that no one loses a job to injury. Haslett has consistently gone easy on Brooks even when Brooks has done some really dumb things (as every new QB does). And Haslett has played Brooks hurt and caused the team to miss the playoffs when Brooks was physically unable to help the team win.

As a result, Brooks will be scrutinized more closely for his play and decision making than any other member of the team. Now perhaps that isn\'t fair, but if it\'s too much, maybe Brooks should start playing wide receiver.

The QB takes more than his share of credit for any wins, and more than his share of blame for any losses. Any mistake by the QB draws a lot more attention generally than a missed tackle on the defensive side. But on the flip side, it\'s easier for a QB to get back in good graces. After last Monday, Pennington was seen as a treasure for the Jets, even though he threw 2 picks. I think the same holds true for Brooks.

What I don\'t understand is why many discussions on Brooks have to dissolve into \"F*$! )#$\" wars. I would rather that reasonable people could reasonably disagree.

At any rate, the fact remains that Aaron Brooks is a lightning rod for people who love this team. Because they disagree doesn\'t mean they love the team any less. Because they disagree doesn\'t mean they are any less welcome to express their ideas. However, because they disagree doesn\'t mean that they are mental defectives, chemical dependants, inferior people or closet fans of other teams. I mean honestly: who else bothers to post on a team board day in day out that isn\'t a real fan? (Other than those guys like BucNup who stop by just to devil the other teams fans)

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Old 12-03-2003, 11:00 PM   #13
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Very good post BMG
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Old 12-03-2003, 11:54 PM   #14
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AMEN, good post BMG.
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Old 12-04-2003, 09:34 AM   #15
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I\'m pretty sure the only person I\'ve ever flamed on this board was B&B.
Really? When? Was I funny? Honestly, I don\'t remember it, but then my memory is not what it once was either
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Old 12-05-2003, 03:02 PM   #16
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I agree with almost everything BMG has said. My problem with many of the \"if you don\'t like Brooks, you don\'t know football\" gang is that the reciprocal could also be accurate...i.e. if you adore Brooks, you don\'t know football.

If I\'m having a discussion with someone and I\'m told, \"You don\'t know what you\'re talking about\" in response to a point I\'ve made, well frankly, at that juncture I pretty much believe I do know what I\'m talking about and I\'ve just proven it by virtue of the pathetic response I\'ve just received. It\'s kinda like having an argument with someone and they\'ve gotten to where the only thing they can come up with is dropping the \"F\" bomb: \"Oh yeah? Well f--- you!\" As far as I\'m concerned, that\'s an admission of defeat.

I don\'t know that Saintfan dropped any f-bombs but at times he seemed mighty close...and while many of us can laugh it off, it\'s unnecessary, disrespectful and downright rude.

Anyway, he\'ll be back...especially if the Saints continue to win. I really hope we can hear the \"I told you so\"s. That would Brooks finally got it together...or they put Bouman in.
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Old 12-05-2003, 03:22 PM   #17
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I agree with almost everything BMG has said. My problem with many of the \"if you don\'t like Brooks, you don\'t know football\" gang is that the reciprocal could also be accurate...i.e. if you adore Brooks, you don\'t know football.

If I\'m having a discussion with someone and I\'m told, \"You don\'t know what you\'re talking about\" in response to a point I\'ve made, well frankly, at that juncture I pretty much believe I do know what I\'m talking about and I\'ve just proven it by virtue of the pathetic response I\'ve just received. It\'s kinda like having an argument with someone and they\'ve gotten to where the only thing they can come up with is dropping the \"F\" bomb: \"Oh yeah? Well f--- you!\" As far as I\'m concerned, that\'s an admission of defeat.

I don\'t know that Saintfan dropped any f-bombs but at times he seemed mighty close...and while many of us can laugh it off, it\'s unnecessary, disrespectful and downright rude.

Anyway, he\'ll be back...especially if the Saints continue to win. I really hope we can hear the \"I told you so\"s. That would Brooks finally got it together...or they put Bouman in.
I hope he comes back. I don\'t remember him ever getting obscene with anyone here. If he did i\'m sure it was a lot less than many posters here. Most of what I remember about him was that he usually brought game and backed it up well.
There\'s probably a 3 to 1 ratio of negative to positive takes on this board, and with him leaving that ratio goes up.

32 teams, 1 SB winner, 12 playoff teams.
Parity implies each team makes the playoffs about once every 3 years,
And every team would win the superbowl once every 32 years.
We\'re overdue for both!

Whether we agree or disagree; its all for Him.
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Old 12-05-2003, 07:17 PM   #18
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I don\'t know that Saintfan dropped any f-bombs but at times he seemed mighty close...and while many of us can laugh it off, it\'s unnecessary, disrespectful and downright rude.
For anyone to be suggesting that saintfan was going around being obscene is ridiculous. I don\'t think there is a long time member here that hasn\'t lost his temper before. Blake, if you stick around long enough I\'m pretty sure you will too.

There\'s no doubt the the BASHERS rule on this board. The only way to be accepted in the gang around here is to critcize EVERYONE but Deuce. If you HATE Aaron Brooks then you might get promoted. If you say the coaches suck then you\'re a genius. If you think Delhomme is a FRANCHISE QB, you can do no wrong. After all the Panthers are 8-4. ENOUGH SAID !!

You can talk about penalties, dropped passes, lack of execution, but they ALWAYS point to Brooks. If you try to talk about ANYONE else then you are making excuses for Brooks.

The Brooks bashers tell me and saintfan that we are WRONG all the time. I tell them that they are wrong and they tell me that no one can EVER be wrong on here because opinions can\'t be wrong. It\'s all pretty confusing to me. I just accept the FACT that they are hypocritical and go on about my business.

Where are the members that should be standing up for saintfan when someone tells him that he is WRONG? Where ya at boys? Back up some of that preaching that you do? WhoDat? Gator?



[Edited on 6/12/2003 by BillyC]
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Old 12-06-2003, 10:50 AM   #19
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Gator -- Just because the majority of the posters here all agree that the Saints pretty much suck. I\'m not going to let you guys cram your opinions down my throat.

I am not buying these things that y\'all have been trying to sell :

1. The Saints playoff hopes were over after the 6th game. (it was said)
2. Brooks needs to be cut or traded. ( also been said )
3. All the coaches need to be fired ( also been said)
4. Everyone on this team is not living up to expectations except Deuce (also been said)
5. The Saints would be better off losing the rest of their games so the coaches would be fired and we could draft Eli Manning.
6. Brooks\' is the biggest problem with the offense and he is just plain stupid and doesn\'t care if we win or lose.

Not only have these things been said. They have been said over and over and over. Forgive me if I disagree with those things and question the logic behind those statements.

Most of these things have been said by WhoDat. But he certainly isn\'t alone. The majority rule and they are the one\'s constantly cramming opininos down someone\'s thorat Gator.




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Old 12-06-2003, 10:54 AM   #20
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Great post Gator, and I agree completely... excpet...

You and Saintsfan are the only two guys trying to tell everyone else they are wrong by debating other people\'s opinons.
Most of this board can disagree cordially and throw a couple of zingers back and forth at one another and it\'s all in good fun. But I will be the first to admit that I have told people that they are wrong. 97% of those statements were directed at Billy and/or Saintfan, and you are correct in saying that it is usually in response to being called short-sighted, unintelligent, drunk on Tang, having an agenda... etc, etc, etc.

I will say this. I agree completely with the spirit of your post, but I have to admit that I have thrown what Billy and Saintfan are selling right back in their faces. Of course, when the entire board agrees with you, yet one poster continues to berate and argue, I don\'t think it\'s wrong to put him in his place. We did that with Swampdog, and I will continue to show Billy the error of his ways. If he attacks, I will continue to make him look silly.

Otherwise, great post! Exactly what I expect out of this board.

\"Excuses, excuses, excuses. That’s all anyone ever makes for the New Orleans Saints’ organization.\" - Eric Narcisse


\"Being a Saints fan is almost like being addicted to crack,\"
he said.[i]\"You know you should stop, but you just can\'t.\"
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