Special Teams Weakness

Barry from MS · 07-27-2011, 11:10 PM

Have we fired our Special Teams coordinator from last year (McMahon) yet? If not, why the hell not? He is what is called MF'ing Awful. As with Gary Gibbs, it is overdue time to kick this suck-tard to the curb...

jcp026 · 07-27-2011, 11:19 PM

Can't say that I disagree.

hagan714 · 07-28-2011, 02:59 AM

We need KR/PR big time. Roby is not the answer. he is ok Brad smith NJ is my choice in FA to fill the need. He works at WR/RB and was a college QB to boot. Makes end around more fun to watch when u got a guy who can throw and run. I say he would make Henderson or Roby unneeded on the team.

darstep · 07-28-2011, 06:45 AM

Could be that one of the youngster undrafted guys can fill the KR/PR roll for special teams. I kind of have a hard time firing the coach when the 11 guys that "should" stay in their lanes and make tackles, don't stay in their lanes and make tackles. Or when the return guy starts hitting the brakes rather than hitting a seam and turning it on. It comes down to fundamental blocking and tackling. At the pro level, its just a matter of putting guys out there who get the job done.

papz · 07-28-2011, 07:14 AM

A lot of people say how we have some pretty good players on our STU but the fact of the matter is... our coverage unit isn't good and it's been like that for years. The good thing is that the rules changed and we'll see more touchbacks I believe... alleviating some of the problem.

spkb25 · 07-28-2011, 07:42 AM

We struggled there last year, no doubt. I don't know if it is players or coach or both, but I know our D was garbage until Greg, so...

Euphoria · 07-28-2011, 07:52 AM

Yes we got Gable from USC. I think he is the guy who will end up being our return guy.

Roby isn't the answer and we need to get some help on ST hopefully that is what we expect from the pics and FA's we got. Hopefully we find some gems.

SaintsBro · 07-28-2011, 09:19 AM

Originally Posted by darstep

I kind of have a hard time firing the coach when the 11 guys that "should" stay in their lanes and make tackles, don't stay in their lanes and make tackles. Or when the return guy starts hitting the brakes rather than hitting a seam and turning it on. It comes down to fundamental blocking and tackling. At the pro level, its just a matter of putting guys out there who get the job done.

It is the job of the Special Teams coach to make sure the players do or don't do all of those things. If we are putting guys out there who don't know how to get the job done, or can't get the job done, then that is the fault of the special teams coach for not coaching them properly on what to do. If it's just "putting guys out there who get the job done" then why do we even have a special teams coach at all. If it's all on the players, then why do we have any coaches for that matter.

The guys we have on special teams are for the most part, good to excellent athletes and comparable or better than any other team in the league; it's how they perform due to poor coaching and bad decisions that is the problem. For example, kicking off short to Seattle, giving them such good field position, was a very very bad decision on either Payton or McMahon's part, and it changed the entire momentum of that game -- it got Seattle back in the game right when we were going great guns early in the game. The Saints were literally on the verge of running away with it in the first and second quarter, until those deliberately short kickoffs let the Seahawks put together short drives, get scores, and changed the whole tone of the game completely. Special teams.

darstep · 07-28-2011, 09:25 AM

Roby's impact was felt on both sides of ST. He was the disruptor if not the initial tackler on most coverage situations. When he went down, his replacement just wasn't getting to the ball carrier soon enough after the catch. Gunning is a fine art and somewhat hard to teach. If you don't have a good gunner, return lanes develope way too often to have good results.

07-27-2011, 11:10 PM	#1
Barry from MS Site Donor 2014 Join Date: May 2007 Location: TEMPO VC Okefenokee Swamp Posts: 1,985 Blog Entries: 2	Special Teams Weakness Have we fired our Special Teams coordinator from last year (McMahon) yet? If not, why the hell not? He is what is called MF'ing Awful. As with Gary Gibbs, it is overdue time to kick this suck-tard to the curb...

07-27-2011, 11:19 PM	#2
jcp026 500th Post Join Date: Mar 2010 Posts: 950	Can't say that I disagree.
jcp026 500th Post Join Date: Mar 2010 Posts: 950

07-28-2011, 02:59 AM	#3
hagan714 LB Mentallity Join Date: Dec 2005 Posts: 15,870 Blog Entries: 68	We need KR/PR big time. Roby is not the answer. he is ok Brad smith NJ is my choice in FA to fill the need. He works at WR/RB and was a college QB to boot. Makes end around more fun to watch when u got a guy who can throw and run. I say he would make Henderson or Roby unneeded on the team. strato likes this.

07-28-2011, 09:19 AM	#8
SaintsBro Site Donor Join Date: Sep 2010 Location: in line with my ridiculous CLEAR PLASTIC BAG Posts: 3,650 Blog Entries: 3	Originally Posted by darstep I kind of have a hard time firing the coach when the 11 guys that "should" stay in their lanes and make tackles, don't stay in their lanes and make tackles. Or when the return guy starts hitting the brakes rather than hitting a seam and turning it on. It comes down to fundamental blocking and tackling. At the pro level, its just a matter of putting guys out there who get the job done. It is the job of the Special Teams coach to make sure the players do or don't do all of those things. If we are putting guys out there who don't know how to get the job done, or can't get the job done, then that is the fault of the special teams coach for not coaching them properly on what to do. If it's just "putting guys out there who get the job done" then why do we even have a special teams coach at all. If it's all on the players, then why do we have any coaches for that matter. The guys we have on special teams are for the most part, good to excellent athletes and comparable or better than any other team in the league; it's how they perform due to poor coaching and bad decisions that is the problem. For example, kicking off short to Seattle, giving them such good field position, was a very very bad decision on either Payton or McMahon's part, and it changed the entire momentum of that game -- it got Seattle back in the game right when we were going great guns early in the game. The Saints were literally on the verge of running away with it in the first and second quarter, until those deliberately short kickoffs let the Seahawks put together short drives, get scores, and changed the whole tone of the game completely. Special teams.

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07-28-2011, 06:45 AM	#4
darstep SaintSince67 Join Date: Sep 2007 Location: PortCity Posts: 2,044	Could be that one of the youngster undrafted guys can fill the KR/PR roll for special teams. I kind of have a hard time firing the coach when the 11 guys that "should" stay in their lanes and make tackles, don't stay in their lanes and make tackles. Or when the return guy starts hitting the brakes rather than hitting a seam and turning it on. It comes down to fundamental blocking and tackling. At the pro level, its just a matter of putting guys out there who get the job done.

07-28-2011, 07:14 AM	#5
papz Problem? Join Date: Jan 2005 Location: New Orleans Posts: 11,681	A lot of people say how we have some pretty good players on our STU but the fact of the matter is... our coverage unit isn't good and it's been like that for years. The good thing is that the rules changed and we'll see more touchbacks I believe... alleviating some of the problem.

07-28-2011, 07:42 AM	#6
spkb25 10000 POST CLUB Join Date: Aug 2004 Location: Baltimore, MD Posts: 13,057	We struggled there last year, no doubt. I don't know if it is players or coach or both, but I know our D was garbage until Greg, so...

07-28-2011, 07:52 AM	#7
Euphoria 5000 POSTS! + Join Date: Mar 2004 Location: Hollywood, CA Posts: 7,601 Blog Entries: 5	Yes we got Gable from USC. I think he is the guy who will end up being our return guy. Roby isn't the answer and we need to get some help on ST hopefully that is what we expect from the pics and FA's we got. Hopefully we find some gems.

07-28-2011, 09:25 AM	#9
darstep SaintSince67 Join Date: Sep 2007 Location: PortCity Posts: 2,044	Roby's impact was felt on both sides of ST. He was the disruptor if not the initial tackler on most coverage situations. When he went down, his replacement just wasn't getting to the ball carrier soon enough after the catch. Gunning is a fine art and somewhat hard to teach. If you don't have a good gunner, return lanes develope way too often to have good results.