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biloxi-indian 02-16-2012 11:15 AM

Conundrum...
 
The New Orleans Saints have a few questions this offseason, but some of them come with easy answers. Unfortunately for the Saints, not all of the decisions will be as easy when it comes to which players they can afford to sign and which ones they will be forced to watch sign with a new team.

First things first. Quarterback Drew Brees is not going anywhere. Not under any circumstances will the Saints not have Brees under contract for at least the 2012 NFL season. Whether they are forced to use their franchise tag on the record setting gunslinger for one season or whether they can agree to a long term contract, Brees will be under center by the time New Orleans begins OTAs in a few months. That much is a given.

Read more; When New Orleans Saints Sign Drew Brees, Will They Lose Marques Colston Or Carl Nicks? | The Pigskin Report

|Mitch| 02-16-2012 11:27 AM

I'm thinking Nicks stays and Colston walks...

SloMotion 02-16-2012 11:33 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by |Mitch| (Post 378595)
I'm thinking Nicks stays and Colston walks...

I agree, it's all just speculation at this point and you know they're going to do everything possible to keep 'em both, but if push came to shove I gotta' believe more emphasis would be put on keeping Nicks.

Mardigras9 02-16-2012 11:37 AM

I think Nicks goes. He is a great OLiner , but Colston is a playmaker and IMO more valuable.

FinSaint 02-16-2012 01:23 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mardigras9 (Post 378603)
I think Nicks goes. He is a great OLiner , but Colston is a playmaker and IMO more valuable.


I disagree, Nicks is a Playmaker (notice the capital P) in the O-Line pass protecting and making running plays possible. and he is more valuable than Colston to the Saints and would also be more valuable on the FA market.

Nicks stays - at least for another year - and hopefully Colston does as well, but if it is only one: it clearly should be Nicks.

Luda34 02-16-2012 02:06 PM

I don't see Colston as greed money hungry player but
I understand wanting to get payed what your worthy. What he may be made at is they never offered him a contract sooner.

biloxi-indian 02-16-2012 04:47 PM

Owner/GM Jerry Jones has made it clear that the Cowboys will be active in free agency this offseason.

The Cowboys have $12.6 million in salary cap space, and can increase that number by releasing Terence Newman and restructuring a few more contracts. "And we will use [the cap space]," emphasized Jones. Needing a boost on the interior offensive line and at cornerback, the Cowboys are often mentioned as a potential landing spot for free agent LG Carl Nicks.

Cowboys ready to spend big in free agency - Rotoworld.com

gandhi1007 02-16-2012 06:03 PM

Nicks is a must! Protecting your multi-million dollar baby is more important than keeping one of your receivers, especially when there are many others that can fill that void in free agency or via the draft. I love Colston, but if he wants money he will have to get paid somewhere else. I would prefer to keep Brees upright & not injured.

Danno 02-16-2012 06:20 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by gandhi1007 (Post 378698)
Nicks is a must! Protecting your multi-million dollar baby is more important than keeping one of your receivers, especially when there are many others that can fill that void in free agency or via the draft. I love Colston, but if he wants money he will have to get paid somewhere else. I would prefer to keep Brees upright & not injured.

THIS^^^

I simply can not understand why anyone would prefer Colston over Nicks. It just doesn't compute IMO.

SloMotion 02-17-2012 06:20 AM

Here's an interesting scenario that might ease the pain of a Colston departure ... the Saints develop Arrington and between him, Meachem & probably a draft pick, they fill the void left by Colston's departure (somewhat) ... after the 2012 season and successfully renegotiating contracts to allow for more favorable cap space, they go after Calvin Johnson who is a F/A after 2012 ... badda-bing, badda-bang, badda-boom ... the glass is always half full ...

FinSaint 02-17-2012 06:58 AM

I thought they were in talks at the moment with Calvin Johnson in getting a contract extension done, which would keep him in Detroit for a long time.

And I have my doubts about Arrington, I see Morgan as a more promising prospect than AA.

SloMotion 02-17-2012 07:17 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by FinSaint (Post 378818)
I thought they were in talks at the moment with Calvin Johnson in getting a contract extension done, which would keep him in Detroit for a long time.

And I have my doubts about Arrington, I see Morgan as a more promising prospect than AA.

That's what they say, but it's kind of similiar to the Colston/Nicks situation in that the Lions are bumping up against the cap also. Calvin's interviews sound a lot like Nick's interviews in that "he'd like to stay, but ..."

FinSaint 02-17-2012 08:11 AM

I have to believe that they'll do anything they can in order to keep Johnson in the fold... and they have a complete season to do it.

I think they'll let Avril go because of the cap restrictions you mentioned, but they have to keep Johnson around if they want to see Stafford progress in his development.

SloMotion 02-18-2012 07:56 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by FinSaint (Post 378839)
I have to believe that they'll do anything they can in order to keep Johnson in the fold... and they have a complete season to do it.

I think they'll let Avril go because of the cap restrictions you mentioned, but they have to keep Johnson around if they want to see Stafford progress in his development.

Yeah, I think Avril becomes odd man out in a cap situation just because the Lions are kinda' deep on the D/Line and I'm also thinking he's looking for too big a payday.

I always think WR's are somewhat expendable in a pinch, but in Calvin's case, I'll agree with you ... keeping him around while Stafford matures can only help, and Stafford is the key to that team moving forward.

It's a business, whattya' gonna' do? That's the whole point in the salary cap, to promote 'parity' in the league ... no more dynasties.

FinSaint 02-18-2012 09:25 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by SloMotion (Post 379009)
Yeah, I think Avril becomes odd man out in a cap situation just because the Lions are kinda' deep on the D/Line and I'm also thinking he's looking for too big a payday.

I always think WR's are somewhat expendable in a pinch, but in Calvin's case, I'll agree with you ... keeping him around while Stafford matures can only help, and Stafford is the key to that team moving forward.

It's a business, whattya' gonna' do? That's the whole point in the salary cap, to promote 'parity' in the league ... no more dynasties.


Your Lions are already paying him quite a lot - cap hit of almost $17.8M for 2012 - so I don't know how much more any other team would be willing to pay him with the current salary cap restrictions.

It would be highly beneficial to the Lions if they could negotiate a new contract with him before the FA period begins in March, because that way they could free up some cap room if they made the new contract "end-heavy."

halloween 65 02-18-2012 10:54 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by biloxi-indian (Post 378671)
Owner/GM Jerry Jones has made it clear that the Cowboys will be active in free agency this offseason.

The Cowboys have $12.6 million in salary cap space, and can increase that number by releasing Terence Newman and restructuring a few more contracts. "And we will use [the cap space]," emphasized Jones. Needing a boost on the interior offensive line and at cornerback, the Cowboys are often mentioned as a potential landing spot for free agent LG Carl Nicks.

Cowboys ready to spend big in free agency - Rotoworld.com

I read this somewhere else also, and that really got to thinking Jones would give us a king's ranson for Nicks if we tagged him. I would hate Nicks to go but if we could stay competitive for many, many years to come, I'd pull the trigger.

spkb25 02-19-2012 10:05 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by FinSaint (Post 378623)
I disagree, Nicks is a Playmaker (notice the capital P) in the O-Line pass protecting and making running plays possible. and he is more valuable than Colston to the Saints and would also be more valuable on the FA market.

Nicks stays - at least for another year - and hopefully Colston does as well, but if it is only one: it clearly should be Nicks.

Hate to say it, but Brees isn't throwing to anyone on his back. All starts upfront

gandhi1007 02-20-2012 12:40 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by spkb25 (Post 379309)
Hate to say it, but Brees isn't throwing to anyone on his back. All starts upfront

^^^^^^ THIS ^^^^^^

Rugby Saint II 02-20-2012 04:36 PM

Find a reasonable deal for Drew then it's all about Nicks.

blackangold 02-20-2012 07:40 PM

If we sign Brees (which we will) we only have 20 mil in cap space before signing him. Lets say he takes a friendly figure against the cap, say 16 mil his first year. This means nicks would have to take a maximum of 4mil against the cap which wont happen.

Brees should avg 18mil per year (first year 16mil maybe?)
Nicks should get 6-7mil per year (same as Evans)
Colston wants 7mil per year

Do the math saints have 100mil against the cap without these players(cap is 120m).

Unless cuts are made to the defense we will lose Nicks and Colston. Cutting some lackluster vet on D means keeping Nicks, however if the FO want all three back look for some major cuts on D.
(yes I know some vets may restructure contracts but it may not be enough)

Personally I love the young talent we have on D, but we cant get rid of the veteran knowledge completely. My prediction- Colston will no longer be a Saint, Shanle and Will Smith get cut.

FinSaint 02-20-2012 10:05 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by blackangold (Post 379407)
If we sign Brees (which we will) we only have 20 mil in cap space before signing him. Lets say he takes a friendly figure against the cap, say 16 mil his first year. This means nicks would have to take a maximum of 4mil against the cap which wont happen.

Brees should avg 18mil per year (first year 16mil maybe?)
Nicks should get 6-7mil per year (same as Evans)
Colston wants 7mil per year

Do the math saints have 100mil against the cap without these players(cap is 120m).

Unless cuts are made to the defense we will lose Nicks and Colston. Cutting some lackluster vet on D means keeping Nicks, however if the FO want all three back look for some major cuts on D.
(yes I know some vets may restructure contracts but it may not be enough)

Personally I love the young talent we have on D, but we cant get rid of the veteran knowledge completely. My prediction- Colston will no longer be a Saint, Shanle and Will Smith get cut.


The 2012 cap is a bit more than $120M, because there's the whole "roll over" of last year's unused cap space in the new CBA.

Salary Cap Numbers Updated Heading Into 2012 NFL Free Agency - SBNation.com

Nicks wouldn't accept a $6-7M/year contract like you stated, he wants $8-9M/year (Evans' contract is ~$8M/year).

Colston might want a little more than that, I would say he is looking for something in the $7.5-8.5M/year range, and there probably are teams (with a lot of cap space) around which will give that to him (f.e. the Bengals).

I'm not sure where you got that figure of $100M of already used up cap space, because I've seen a lot lower calculations around, most in the lower $90M range.

Excess fat needs to be cut and contracts need to be restructured, but that is no different from any other off-season - this is the time of the year the team GMs and FOs earn their pay.

blackangold 02-20-2012 10:51 PM

PY has an article on the espn south blog regarding cap for the saints, he states 102mil as the current... so it is a harder situation then I thought

spkb25 02-22-2012 07:10 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by blackangold (Post 379407)
If we sign Brees (which we will) we only have 20 mil in cap space before signing him. Lets say he takes a friendly figure against the cap, say 16 mil his first year. This means nicks would have to take a maximum of 4mil against the cap which wont happen.

Brees should avg 18mil per year (first year 16mil maybe?)
Nicks should get 6-7mil per year (same as Evans)
Colston wants 7mil per year

Do the math saints have 100mil against the cap without these players(cap is 120m).

Unless cuts are made to the defense we will lose Nicks and Colston. Cutting some lackluster vet on D means keeping Nicks, however if the FO want all three back look for some major cuts on D.
(yes I know some vets may restructure contracts but it may not be enough)

Personally I love the young talent we have on D, but we cant get rid of the veteran knowledge completely. My prediction- Colston will no longer be a Saint, Shanle and Will Smith get cut.

SS doesn't mater. The guy is old, and he was slow when he wasn't old. I mean if we can keep him around as a backup for a good price, good, but him leaving I don't think affects us.

Will Smith is restructuring or leaving. No way he earns that salary this year. I think he'll probably restructure.

It's going to be hard to sign Colston and Nicks. I hope we find a way to keep both, but if we can only have one I'll take Nicks.

Just my opinion


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