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WalterFootball Mock Draft....

this is a discussion within the Saints Community Forum; I had an idea for Harper...Linebacker-backer. I guess it's a nickel, but we have three safeties and Harper stays on the fringes of the box. Better in coverage than an LB and better against the run and rushing the passer ...

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Old 02-27-2012, 12:15 PM   #21
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I had an idea for Harper...Linebacker-backer. I guess it's a nickel, but we have three safeties and Harper stays on the fringes of the box. Better in coverage than an LB and better against the run and rushing the passer than a CB.
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Old 02-27-2012, 12:46 PM   #22
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Originally Posted by jcp026 View Post
I had an idea for Harper...Linebacker-backer. I guess it's a nickel, but we have three safeties and Harper stays on the fringes of the box. Better in coverage than an LB and better against the run and rushing the passer than a CB.
Thats basically the description of a Strong Safety isn't it? He patrols the intermediate area of the field right behind the LB's.
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Old 02-27-2012, 01:49 PM   #23
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I'LL PATROL YOUR INTERMEDIATE AREA! ...I'm sorry.
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Old 02-27-2012, 01:51 PM   #24
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Originally Posted by jcp026 View Post
I'LL PATROL YOUR INTERMEDIATE AREA! ...I'm sorry.

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Old 02-28-2012, 11:58 AM   #25
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Originally Posted by FinSaint View Post
Yeah, that wouldn't work.


...and Harper's only 29, so I would hardly call that old. And I know Papz that you were only repeating what has been said about him by lots of ignorant people, who seem to know very little about football.

The truth is that Harper is a pro bowl caliber SS and the Saints could've done a lot worse in that department. No player is perfect and Harper certainly has his weaknesses, but, nonetheless, he is a good safety. And more importantly with the contract he got last off-season - he won't be going anywhere for a while, so people should stop with the hating on him.
And your qualifications of knowing more about football than everybody else are??? If you want to believe Harper is a pro bowl SS, thats your opinion. One that I personally and a lot of other people more knowledgable than you or I do not agree with.
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Old 02-28-2012, 04:28 PM   #26
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Originally Posted by Marlboro Man View Post
And your qualifications of knowing more about football than everybody else are??? If you want to believe Harper is a pro bowl SS, thats your opinion. One that I personally and a lot of other people more knowledgable than you or I do not agree with.

Oh, you really told me off...

I wasn't claiming that I'm some type of an authority when it comes to all things football, far from it. But what I do seem to be able to do better than some is to separate my feelings from the evaluation process and instead, I tend to rely on objective observation coupled with statistical evidence.

It is not about me wanting to believe that Harper is a pro-bowl SS - I don't have to rely on my imagination in this matter - because he has been selected to the pro-bowl twice (2009 & 2010). Consequently, that is all the evidence I need in order for it to be logical for me to call him a pro-bowl SS, because he has been one in the past and statistically the 2011 season was as good or even better than the 2009 season for Harper.

What I was referring to in my previous statement, which you took offence at, is that it seems to me that many don't seem to grasp the difference between a strong safety and a free safety. If you evaluate Harper's pass coverage abilities based on the belief that it is his responsibility to defend against long passes - then you're already starting from a point from which nothing worth while can be deduced.

Strong safety's primary job is to help out with the run defense, which is why he plays a lot closer to the line of scrimmage than a free safety, and his other primary job is to defend against passes to the tight end, which is why the SS lines up on the strong side hence the connotation - strong safety. At least this is my general understanding of that particular position and the primary duties associated with it.

I think it was Danno or someone else with access to the paid stat services, who stated that Harper in fact graded pretty well in TE pass coverage. And I think we all can agree that his run defense/pass rushing abilities are top notch when it comes to strong safeties. So all of this pretty much tells me that Harper is a good SS and even a pro-bowl level SS, which is why I criticized the common consensus that he isn't a good SS and that the Saints should do all they can to get rid of him.

I think that this shared (false) belief has its roots in some of the big plays of which Harper has been a part of and which have consequently made him look bad in people's eyes. I'm talking about the Seattle play-off game, the Bradford run, and some others, which have somehow erased to majority of the body of work that Harper has done - and done very well I might add.

So, I would like you to convince me with your seemingly vast knowledge of football why Harper isn't a pro-bowl SS and altogether a good SS? If there's something that I'm missing, I would honestly like to hear it and if your argument is compelling enough, I might even change my evaluation of Harper, but until then I hold on to it with valid justification.
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Old 02-28-2012, 04:48 PM   #27
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Harpers main problem is when he plays bad, its butt-ugly bad.

You can count on 3 or maybe 4 stinkers from him every season, but the other 12 to 13 games he plays very well.

I have a feeling thats not much different than most NFL players.

Also, with a weak pass rush, and the emergence of TE's with WR speed, most SS's will be a primary target. They don't have CB speed to keep up with 4.4 TE's. Gregg's system helped Harper shine in many ways, but the lack of a pass rush didn't do Harper any favors at all in GW's system.

Overall I'd rate Harper about a B-plus player.
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Old 02-29-2012, 04:12 AM   #28
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Second that Danno, how do you think he will work in Spags´system?
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Old 02-29-2012, 07:02 AM   #29
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Originally Posted by Danno View Post
Harpers main problem is when he plays bad, its butt-ugly bad.

You can count on 3 or maybe 4 stinkers from him every season, but the other 12 to 13 games he plays very well.

I have a feeling thats not much different than most NFL players.

Also, with a weak pass rush, and the emergence of TE's with WR speed, most SS's will be a primary target. They don't have CB speed to keep up with 4.4 TE's. Gregg's system helped Harper shine in many ways, but the lack of a pass rush didn't do Harper any favors at all in GW's system.

Overall I'd rate Harper about a B-plus player.

This is a very accurate assessment...

And while it is the commitment to continuity started by Coach Payton that has made the Saints the success they are today - I was thoroughly shocked to see the salary commitment made to Harper by the traditionally frugal Loomis-led Saints Front Office...

Harper has been exposed in memorable "stinkers" for his poor pass coverage/read abilities and while the player must ultimately make plays on the field, Coach Payton shares blame for putting too much faith in Gregg Williams' Buffoon Defense that has cost the Saints two playoff losses...

I was impressed that Coach Payton made a change in his staff a few years ago as I was used to Coaches (i.e. Mora) who'd stubbornly ignore the obvious to spite fans...

Coach Payton is loyal - but he is not going dampen the success of the team to spite out of pride even if fans may be right in seeing the obvious...

We hope that with the addition of Coaches Spagnuolo and Flajole that the defense can finally rise to a competitive level so as not to be an embarrassment or afterthought of the Saints...

“Your best?!? Losers always whine about their best. Winners go home (with) the prom queen.” - Sean Connery in The Rock
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