Graham is not better than Gronkowski
 

NFL players got the vote wrong by ranking Graham seven spots higher than Gronkowski. Graham finished as the 14th best player -- and the No. 1 tight end -- in the league. Gronkowski was 22nd overall and No. 2 at his position.

Graham is not better than Gronkowski - NFL Nation Blog - ESPN

Graham will have a longer NFL life then Gronkowski

Graham is severely over-rated. He's merely an average run of the mill TE that benefits from a QB like Brees. Yep, borderline jouneyman TE.

He should accept an average contract like that from us next year too. No need to ask for a zillion dollar contract Jimmy, you aren't all that special. Yep, you're not that special Jimmy. Sign for a couple million / season...PLEEEEEEEEEZE?

Borderline journeyman.ROFLMAO
You kill me sometimes Danno.

The guy makes a pretty fair point. They are a little different players hower, just as stated in the article, but both really good in their own ways.

To me, Gronkowski vs Graham is like arguing Brees vs Stafford ... the first guy is a record-setting, polished veteran and the second guy is right behind him, making headlines with a bright future ahead, but not quite ready to take the #1 spot ... yet.

I'd take either one on my team, but if I had a vote, it would be Gronkowski #1/Graham #2 ... for now.

They have the same experience

Graham is more athletic, faster, has better hands, and jumps higher*

Just because gronk had better stats doesn't mean he's the better
TE. Chris Johnson had over 2000 yards in 09 and look at'm now

Stats definitely don't tell the whole story, but even if they did, c'mon... Jimmy broke Kellen Winslow's record and then Gronkowski Passed him by about what, 10 yards later that day? The only area where Gronk was fairly significantly ahead was in TD's. That's only because every time the Patriots got in the red zone, or near it, they were throwing to him. You never had to wonder who the first target was. It was always going to be him, and if someone else ended up with a TD it was only because Gronk was probably triple teamed. The beauty of our offense is we have so many polished weapons, Brees can pick and choose.

But all stats aside, the most dynamic playmaking TE I saw last year was Jimmy Graham. He might not be a polished blocker, but he now has just three combined years of playing football in his entire life. Give him a break, he'll get there. Though I think Gronkowski is a total moron, he's a good player, I'll give him that. But he unquestionably benefits from a TE oriented system, whereas we're more wide open and thus get more out of everyone.

Bout 30 seconds in is just one reason graham is better. That and his 4.5 speed compared to gronks 4.65-4.7

Yeah, Jimmy is freakishly athletic. The only TE perhaps in the history of the league who remotely compares is Vernon Davis. But even he takes a back seat to Graham, in my opinion. Davis is very fast for a TE but he doesn't consistently make plays, and he's been playing the game a lot longer than Jimmy.

I predict a couple years from now this subject will not be worth discussing. Jimmy Graham is going to be light years ahead of everyone else.


Edit: Want to clarify that I think Davis is the only TE who compares athletically, not in overall play. Obviously Gronkowski, Gates (when healthy), Tony Gonzalez in his prime and many others are, or were, better than Davis. Jimmy is in that upper echelon, but Vernon (except against us) just doesn't bring it enough.

Graham and Gronk are pretty even.

Gronk is a better runner after the catch, and run blocker. Graham is faster but lacks some running skills. Gronk runs like a power RB,
Kind of a TE/RB hybrid.

Graham is a better pass catcher, and pass blocker. Gronk can't make the one handed grabs or athletic dives Graham does.
A TE/WR hybrid.

depending on what your offense needs take your pick, but they are pretty even to me.

Agreed. Jimmy needs some work on breaking tackles. I'm sure he'll improve but if you had to pick a weakness, thats his.

yeah, Graham probably won with the players because of his catching ability. He is harder to cover than Gronk man to man, or in double coverage because his 6'7 area of catch ability, and 41' vertical is larger, and has a WR's hands probably from all the basketball training.
He must have caught 5 one handed last year , he makes brees look good.
But your right Dano, he has a problem breaking tackles, and his only good move is to hurtle defenders,lol.

Gronk has some damn good running moves, and can power plow over a defender. I would not want to tackle gronk after the catch for fear of being embarrassed.

I agree that they are fairly even for now. Don't think it will take long for Graham to surpass him in most every phase. I don't quite agree that Gronk is a better runner after the catch. Remember that play he made against the Texans last year, where he dragged defenders on his back for about 20 yards? Also the long TD against the 49ers in the playoffs, that was an incredible play. Those are the big one's that immediately come to mind, but I've seen him make plenty of nice, if not spectacular runs after the catch. I think YAC yards can be a very misleading stat. A lot of it, not all, but a lot has to do with where you catch the ball. If you're getting it in space, you stand to get a lot of extra yardage. The Patriots being an offense built around their tight ends, seemed to take more shots down field to those guys then the Saints did with Graham.

When we've given Jimmy some space to work with down field he's done his best work, but he's also great on the intermediate stuff. I didn't notice where Gronk was any better at breaking loose, but maybe that's just me. If he does need to improve, I am very confident he will.

Yeah, that was a great play:) , but if you watch Gronk he drags guys down the field every week,makes defenders look silly after the catch.
Graham has been tackled by 1 5'10 CB or safety way more than he gets away.

Graham was targeted 30 more times than Gronk last season. I think the YAC is valid in Gronks case. He is never as open as Graham is. Your right YAC is overrated in a lot of cases, but not is this case I believe.
Graham needs to improve in this area, and even if he never does, I don't think it matters.
In the end what really matters is who can catch better for a TE, and thats clearly Graham. He catches things only Colston could.

Rushing/Receiving TD
1. LeSean McCoy*+ · PHI 20
2. Rob Gronkowski*+ · NWE 18
3. Calvin Johnson*+ · DET 16
4. Jordy Nelson · GNB 15
Ray Rice* · BAL 15
6. Cam Newton · CAR 14
7. Marshawn Lynch · SEA 13
Adrian Peterson · MIN 13
9. Arian Foster* · HOU 12
10. Ahmad Bradshaw · NYG 11
Maurice Jones-Drew*+ · JAX 11
Jimmy Graham* · NOR 11
BenJarvus Green-Ellis · NWE 11
Laurent Robinson · DAL 11
Michael Turner · ATL 11

That needs to be taught... Not just to Jimmy. Coleston goes down pretty quick also... On the other hand Lance Moore put in 200% after the catch.

Interesting though is that Graham is 17th in the league for YAC.

Sproles is second and Thomas is fifteenth.
2011 NFL Player Receiving Stats - National Football League - ESPN

[quote=pherein;414338]"Yeah, that was a great play:) , but if you watch Gronk he drags guys down the field every week,makes defenders look silly after the catch.
Graham has been tackled by 1 5'10 CB or safety way more than he gets away.

Graham was targeted 30 more times than Gronk last season. I think the YAC is valid in Gronks case. He is never as open as Graham is. Your right YAC is overrated in a lot of cases, but not is this case I believe.
Graham needs to improve in this area, and even if he never does, I don't think it matters.
In the end what really matters is who can catch better for a TE, and thats clearly Graham. He catches things only Colston could".


Fair enough. A lot of that is Jimmy still trying to bulk up, after being a basketball player for so long. I don't suspect they'll try to add much more weight to him though, because at some point it starts to slow your foot speed.

Thats a Very good point. He might have been a little clumsy last season with all the added weight, that never occurred to me.

YAC is a bit different than breaking tackles. If Graham gets behind the LB's and splits the safeties he can get 40 to 50 yards after the catch without ever being touched.

I think he gets tackled too easily for a man his size. He's not bad, just not as good as he can be.

As he improves he'll start turning those 7 - 8 yard gains into 10 - 15 yard gains.

He needs to improve his Yards After Contact more than he does his Yards After Catch.

There is that aswell, but mainly I meant that he would need to bulk up more to break tackles like Gronkowski. I just didn't word it quite right. But to your point, he may indeed still be adjusting to playing at a higher weight. I think his weight is about right, at this point, being a receiving tight end.

Understood, but Jimmy is a different breed. He isn't as strong to break tackles, but plenty strong enough to fight for position and then faster than any TE out there to get away if he can manage to escape the initial defender.

I don't think you'll ever see Graham mauling people over the middle, but I think he'll develop some elusiveness.

Graham is still pretty raw fundamentally, so comparisons right now might not be fair. He still cuts off routes and misses the occasional blocking assignment. He's the perfect example of a talent that will get markedly with experience.
Is he better than Gronk? If it saves us money on his contract, I'll say no.

They're both awfully good ... and fortunately for TE fans like myself, there's a veritable cornucopia of good TE's in the league right now.

Like most here, it looks to me like Gronk throws his weight around a little better than Graham, but Graham probably tops Gronk in speed & athleticism. Criticisms of either are really nit-picking, though.

1. Gronk
2. Graham

It's not like it's a slap in the face to Graham or anything. Gronk is 2 years younger, more polished(due to playing football throughout his career), a better blocker, and has better hands as well as concentration. He's also built like a tank.

It's like the Brady/Manning/Brees debate. Does it really even matter? They're all elite beast.

Like what you had to say in the first paragraph. But dead wrong in the second. Well its like saying i like Coke better than Pepsi. It's the same thing..., matter of opinion. Mine Graham all day. Gronk is like dink, but if I would be too, money young, being a stud. Party Party like a star... ha, I would be in the league maybe three years???

I agree with everything except hand and concentration during the catch. I think Graham is clearly better at this, and the stats and visuals support it.
Gronk doesn't have the vertical or reach Graham has, and Brady rarely throws him a hard one to catch. Some of the stuff Graham pulls down is WR Sh*t, its nuts. Gronk wouldn't make those catches.



I still say their even

The guy used to play basketball,give him a brake.He is what he is,but what worries me is the fact that after his rookie contract he will ask gazillions and we dont have a second good TE like the Pats have in Hernandez.

Yeah, I agree it's like Coke/Pepsi when you're debating two guys so close in talent #1 and #2, but I gave Gronkowski a slight edge because he does what I like to see a TE do, run block/YAC, a little better then Graham ... now, if we're considering off-field personality & shenanigens, that's a knock on Gronkowski and I'm putting Graham #1 all day long ... I hate that 'party-like-a-rock-star/gangsta' persona so many of today's athletes like to project, but that's for another thread.

Oh...STOP IT!!!