Would Smoot and Champ Baily have helped?

GumboBC · 05-31-2004, 01:10 PM

Pass attempts against Saints secondary - 485
Pass attempts against Redskins secondary - 483

TDs given up by Saints secondary - 20
TDs given up by Redskins secondary - 23

Yds per game given up passing by Saints - 187.1
Yds per game given up passing by Redskins - 199.7

Comp. % by Saints secondary - 54.4%
Comp % by Redskins secondary - 59%

And for the record here's how our run defenses compare:
Saints rush attempts against defense: 480
Redskins rush attempts against: 504

Saits yds. allowed per rush: 4.7
Redskins yds allowed per rush: 4.4

Saints secondary vs.
M. Hasselbeck 12/23 137 2 0
S. McNair 22/33 252 2 0
D. McNabb 16/25 259 1 0
B. Johnson 27/46 321 2 2
B. Johnson 20/34 213 2 1

Redskins secondary vs.
D. McNabb 23/32 242 3 0
R. Grossman 19/32 249 2 1
K. Collins 24/39 276 3 0
B. Johnson 22/30 268 4 0
M. Hasselbeck 19/29 241 1 1

Saitns and Redskins againt same QBs.
D. McNabb 23/32 242 3 0 vs Redskins
D. McNabb 16/25 259 1 0 vs Saints

B. Johnson 22/30 268 4 0 vs. Redskins
B. Johnson 20/34 213 2 1 vs. Saints

M. Hasselbeck 19/29 241 1 1 vs. Redskins
M. Hasselbeck 12/23 137 2 0 vs. Saints

OK. Here's the point I'm trying to make. Most people are convinced our cornerbacks are terrible. I don't think they are, and I believe that the MAIN reason they struggled at times is because of a lack of a pass rush.

I think everyone would agree that Fred Smoot and Champ Baily are 2 of the top CB in the league.

If you look at the Saints worst games and the Redskins worst games, you will see that the Redskins did as bad or WORSE than our secondary. How could that be? How could the Redskins secondary get shredded with Smoot and Baily?

Could it be that even shut-down corners like Smoot and Baily can't even get the job done if the opposing teams QB is allowed enough time in the pocket?

How much difference would Smoot and Baily have made in our defense last year? Considering their defensive line was better than ours at stopping the run, they couldn't have made that much of a difference.

On the other hand, Carolina's secondary was much better than the Saints and Redskins? How could that be? Seems impossible doesn't it? Not to me. It's possible because a pass rush makes one heck of a difference.

That's why I think Haslett went in the right direction by concentrating on the D-line and therefore making our secondary better.

[Edited on 31/5/2004 by GumboBC]

Euphoria · 05-31-2004, 01:19 PM

It all boils down to the run... if you key on stopping the run or don\'t get anykind of rush, you are suspect for a passing attack. If you can shut down the run and FORCE them to throw you can hope for mistakes. The Bucs game the Saints were stopping the run and forcing them to throw and they made mistakes... INTs. They would not have helped us much if at all... we have to get a rush and we have to be dominate up front... DOME PATROL had a pass rush from hell.

[Edited on 31/5/2004 by Euphoria]

SaintNik · 05-31-2004, 01:37 PM

Good point there Bill. No secondary can cover even the weakest offense all day long without having pressure up front. The best defenses year in year out are ones that first stop the run and then limit the time the QB has to throw the ball. Sacks are great but a defense doesn\'t have to lead the league in sacks to be highly effective. Consistent pressure that forces the QB to throw before he is ready leads to incompetions and interceptions.

When teams practice going 7 on 7 the QBs and Wrs have the advantage. Add a great pass rush to the mix and things change in favor of the defense.

This team has used 3 first round draft picks the past 2 years to acquire two players to bolster the defensive line along with bringing in Young via free agency. We have a youthful group of defensive linemen that (other than the rookie Smith) have NFL experience. We appear to be deep here and they should bring a lot of energy and have fresh legs for 4 quarters.

We must improve from last year at stopping the run and putting pressure on the passer with the front seven and our pass defense will improve.

coastalkid · 06-01-2004, 08:06 AM

Point well made Billy. There isn\'t a corner in the league that can cover the receivers in this league all day long. A good aggressive pass rush will make your corners better. Even a average or less than average corner will look better as long as he has a good pass rush by the d-line. It all starts in the trenches.

05-31-2004, 01:10 PM	#1
GumboBC Banned Join Date: May 2004 Posts: 2,616	Would Smoot and Champ Baily have helped? Pass attempts against Saints secondary - 485 Pass attempts against Redskins secondary - 483 TDs given up by Saints secondary - 20 TDs given up by Redskins secondary - 23 Yds per game given up passing by Saints - 187.1 Yds per game given up passing by Redskins - 199.7 Comp. % by Saints secondary - 54.4% Comp % by Redskins secondary - 59% And for the record here's how our run defenses compare: Saints rush attempts against defense: 480 Redskins rush attempts against: 504 Saits yds. allowed per rush: 4.7 Redskins yds allowed per rush: 4.4 Saints secondary vs. M. Hasselbeck 12/23 137 2 0 S. McNair 22/33 252 2 0 D. McNabb 16/25 259 1 0 B. Johnson 27/46 321 2 2 B. Johnson 20/34 213 2 1 Redskins secondary vs. D. McNabb 23/32 242 3 0 R. Grossman 19/32 249 2 1 K. Collins 24/39 276 3 0 B. Johnson 22/30 268 4 0 M. Hasselbeck 19/29 241 1 1 Saitns and Redskins againt same QBs. D. McNabb 23/32 242 3 0 vs Redskins D. McNabb 16/25 259 1 0 vs Saints B. Johnson 22/30 268 4 0 vs. Redskins B. Johnson 20/34 213 2 1 vs. Saints M. Hasselbeck 19/29 241 1 1 vs. Redskins M. Hasselbeck 12/23 137 2 0 vs. Saints OK. Here's the point I'm trying to make. Most people are convinced our cornerbacks are terrible. I don't think they are, and I believe that the MAIN reason they struggled at times is because of a lack of a pass rush. I think everyone would agree that Fred Smoot and Champ Baily are 2 of the top CB in the league. If you look at the Saints worst games and the Redskins worst games, you will see that the Redskins did as bad or WORSE than our secondary. How could that be? How could the Redskins secondary get shredded with Smoot and Baily? Could it be that even shut-down corners like Smoot and Baily can't even get the job done if the opposing teams QB is allowed enough time in the pocket? How much difference would Smoot and Baily have made in our defense last year? Considering their defensive line was better than ours at stopping the run, they couldn't have made that much of a difference. On the other hand, Carolina's secondary was much better than the Saints and Redskins? How could that be? Seems impossible doesn't it? Not to me. It's possible because a pass rush makes one heck of a difference. That's why I think Haslett went in the right direction by concentrating on the D-line and therefore making our secondary better. [Edited on 31/5/2004 by GumboBC]
GumboBC Banned Join Date: May 2004 Posts: 2,616

05-31-2004, 01:19 PM	#2
Euphoria 5000 POSTS! + Join Date: Mar 2004 Location: Hollywood, CA Posts: 7,601 Blog Entries: 5	Would Smoot and Champ Baily have helped? It all boils down to the run... if you key on stopping the run or don\'t get anykind of rush, you are suspect for a passing attack. If you can shut down the run and FORCE them to throw you can hope for mistakes. The Bucs game the Saints were stopping the run and forcing them to throw and they made mistakes... INTs. They would not have helped us much if at all... we have to get a rush and we have to be dominate up front... DOME PATROL had a pass rush from hell. [Edited on 31/5/2004 by Euphoria]

05-31-2004, 01:37 PM	#3
SaintNik 100th Post Join Date: Jul 2003 Posts: 312	Would Smoot and Champ Baily have helped? Good point there Bill. No secondary can cover even the weakest offense all day long without having pressure up front. The best defenses year in year out are ones that first stop the run and then limit the time the QB has to throw the ball. Sacks are great but a defense doesn\'t have to lead the league in sacks to be highly effective. Consistent pressure that forces the QB to throw before he is ready leads to incompetions and interceptions. When teams practice going 7 on 7 the QBs and Wrs have the advantage. Add a great pass rush to the mix and things change in favor of the defense. This team has used 3 first round draft picks the past 2 years to acquire two players to bolster the defensive line along with bringing in Young via free agency. We have a youthful group of defensive linemen that (other than the rookie Smith) have NFL experience. We appear to be deep here and they should bring a lot of energy and have fresh legs for 4 quarters. We must improve from last year at stopping the run and putting pressure on the passer with the front seven and our pass defense will improve.
SaintNik 100th Post Join Date: Jul 2003 Posts: 312	Just Chillin Checking Out The B&G Forum While Waiting For My Ship To Come In http://img51.exs.cx/img51/4387/Santa_on_raft.jpg

06-01-2004, 08:06 AM	#4
coastalkid 100th Post Join Date: May 2003 Location: Spain Posts: 287	Would Smoot and Champ Baily have helped? Point well made Billy. There isn\'t a corner in the league that can cover the receivers in this league all day long. A good aggressive pass rush will make your corners better. Even a average or less than average corner will look better as long as he has a good pass rush by the d-line. It all starts in the trenches.

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