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-   -   Post Jags Preseason: Cadet vs. Ivory? (https://blackandgold.com/saints/48495-post-jags-preseason-cadet-vs-ivory.html)

Halo 08-19-2012 03:56 PM

Post Jags Preseason: Cadet vs. Ivory?
 
After the 2nd Preseason game & HOF game, which player has played better and has the best shot at making the final roster:

Travis Cadet vs. Chris Ivory

Danno 08-19-2012 03:59 PM

Re: Post Jags Preseason: Cadet vs. Ivory?
 
Both

Ditch the 2nd FB since Dave Thomas is back.
Cadet can play multiple roles on offense and special teams.

Halo 08-19-2012 04:01 PM

Re: Post Jags Preseason: Cadet vs. Ivory?
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Danno (Post 429328)
Both

Ditch the 2nd FB since Dave Thomas is back.
Cadet can play multiple roles on offense and special teams.

I agree but I went for the all or nothing poll based on performance.
Remember, this is only a measure until this point and things can change quick.

Didn't want to do the "all of the above" answer....

Danno 08-19-2012 04:12 PM

Re: Post Jags Preseason: Cadet vs. Ivory?
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Halo (Post 429330)
I agree but I went for the all or nothing poll based on performance.
Remember, this is only a measure until this point and things can change quick.

Didn't want to do the "all of the above" answer....

If I had to pick only one, I'd say Cadet, although I love Ivory.

1-dimensional power backs like Ivory are a dime a dozen, but they're often injured and don't last long (reference Marion Barber).

Multi-skilled backs like Cadet don't come along as often and they fit our multi-dimensional offense better than Ivory ever could.

Its a very close call but I'd give the edge to Cadet, since he also plays 4 special teams units. He's 3 or 4 roster spots all in one player.

Halo 08-19-2012 04:15 PM

Re: Post Jags Preseason: Cadet vs. Ivory?
 
Ivory has kind of looked confused on what hole to hit when he gets the ball. It could be he's re-adjusting to being back there, could be no blocking formations. So far Cadet has been impressive, but I always root for Ivory and hope we keep both. Cadet vs. Ivory and Cadet has been the more impressive to this point.

Danno 08-19-2012 04:20 PM

Re: Post Jags Preseason: Cadet vs. Ivory?
 
There's a reason we gave Cadet an NFL record signing bonus for an undrafted player. He's done absolutely nothing to suggest we were wrong. There are probably 15 teams hoping we cut Cadet, and probably 10 teams hoping we cut Ivory.

An excess of riches we should be proud of.

|Mitch| 08-19-2012 04:30 PM

Re: Post Jags Preseason: Cadet vs. Ivory?
 
Since it's an all or nothing choice, I voted for Cadet. Just going off the preseason performances so far...

WhoDat!656 08-19-2012 04:34 PM

Re: Post Jags Preseason: Cadet vs. Ivory?
 
Cadet! More bang for the buck!!

4thqtrsaint 08-19-2012 04:44 PM

Re: Post Jags Preseason: Cadet vs. Ivory?
 
Dang Danno, are you a coach or GM? LOL Shrewd move and that's my vote!
Great call!

If its one or the other, I stick with Ivory, but not without several sleepless nights before making that decision. I just think Sproles and PT are closer to Cadet in style and Ivory closer to Ingram. If Ingram goes down, I'd want Ivory for the downhill running.

A case for Cadet actually makes more sense, but my gut says Ivory. I think Ivory is a 1,200 + yd runner on another team.

Danno 08-19-2012 04:48 PM

Re: Post Jags Preseason: Cadet vs. Ivory?
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by 4thqtrsaint (Post 429352)
A case for Cadet actually makes more sense, but my gut says Ivory. I think Ivory is a 1,200 + yd runner on another team.

Judging from Ivory's past (HS/College/Pro) he'd never last long enough to provide a team with 1,200 yards rushing. He's made of glass.

Vrillon82 08-19-2012 05:35 PM

Re: Post Jags Preseason: Cadet vs. Ivory?
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Danno (Post 429355)
Judging from Ivory's past (HS/College/Pro) he'd never last long enough to provide a team with 1,200 yards rushing. He's made of glass.

That and Ivory seems to only really be good as a pure breed RB with no multiple skill sets like say Cadet, PT, and Sproles is why Ivory could be the odd man out.

Plus Ingram to me is more versatile as a runner than Ivory is.

I dont know how many RBs are dressed on game day, but the roster could be:

Sproles
Ingram
PT
Cadet

Ivory will be cut, dont think he will make it to the PS, dont think he can go on it anyway, someone will pick him up.

halloween 65 08-19-2012 06:58 PM

Re: Post Jags Preseason: Cadet vs. Ivory?
 
I like the power that Ivory brings to the table, bad weather games are usually dominated by power backs, I take nothing away from Cadet and hopes he makes the team, but I'll take Ivory.

The Dude 08-19-2012 07:18 PM

Re: Post Jags Preseason: Cadet vs. Ivory?
 
Cadet for all the reasons Danno says. I also think we can keep both. Cadet fills more of our needs and is perfect for our offense. A lot of people arguing against him is because he hasn't shown much running up the middle. I saw enough of that from him in the Jags game to lead me to believe he can handle that just fine. Ivorys injury history doesn't help his case either, and a back with his running style isn't going to all of a sudden get more durable. Chances are he will only be good for about 8 games a season the way he plays.

Halo 08-20-2012 09:34 AM

Re: Post Jags Preseason: Cadet vs. Ivory?
 
Bump - need everyone to vote on this one!

Mardigras9 08-20-2012 09:42 AM

Re: Post Jags Preseason: Cadet vs. Ivory?
 
Cadet

Halo 08-20-2012 09:43 AM

Re: Post Jags Preseason: Cadet vs. Ivory?
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Mardigras9 (Post 429525)
Cadet

Be sure to vote in the actual poll forum above. People have been missing that.

TheOak 08-20-2012 10:30 AM

Re: Post Jags Preseason: Cadet vs. Ivory?
 
Cadet if we have to pick one of those two should stay... Much like Danno I have been a big fan of Ivory since the first time I saw him run... However..

Ivory being fairly one dimensional (I know everyone looks at if "he" goes down), pretty much seals his fate... Cadet is better suited to step in for Thomas, or Sproles if either of them are injured or Goodell finds a reason to suspend them. He also has places to go if someone gets hurt on special teams.

Ivory could step in for Ingram if needed but not the rest. He is not versatile enough. Also since PT or Ingram can punch it in like Ivory (for the most part) then he becomes the one that is easiest to back fill if he gets hurt.

We do not "need" two FB's or two place kickers. Give me 6 before 3 any day.

Tobias-Reiper 08-20-2012 10:53 AM

Re: Post Jags Preseason: Cadet vs. Ivory?
 
Who's this Travis Cadet you are talking about? :)

I posted this on Saints Revolution this morning: In 2 seasons and 18 regular season games played with the Saints, Ivory has had a grand total of one catch. In contrast, Jed Collins, a FB, had 11 last season alone. In an offense that not only throws the ball as often as Brees does, but that it distributes the ball as much as Brees does, it is mind boggling than in 18 regular season games played, an offensive player has had 1 catch only.

This preseason so far, Ivory has only 1 catch also.

Now, Ivory runs hard, no question, but when he's in the game, he isn't specially good at pass protection, and defenses now know he's not a threat like PT or Ingram or Sproles to chip the rush and then go out for a screen.

So, yes, if I have to decide between Chris Ivory and Travaris Cadet, in this offense, I'll go Cadet.

TheOak 08-20-2012 11:36 AM

Re: Post Jags Preseason: Cadet vs. Ivory?
 
Out of the box thinking:


Ivory is not a blocker but he runs and hits hard. Very hard.

Ivory for Shanle?

I bet Ivory can not only take down a RB by him self but knock the piss, helmet, and ball out of the RB in the process.

If he happens to recover/strip and gets the ball into his hands.... Whoahhh buddy!

sharke 08-20-2012 11:48 AM

Re: Post Jags Preseason: Cadet vs. Ivory?
 
My answer has already been taken but Cadet. That's not to take anything away from Ivory as I've been a big fan of his but damn, has the dude ever completed a season injury free? Maybe I'm spoiled by PT & Sproles though.

the-commish 08-20-2012 12:24 PM

Re: Post Jags Preseason: Cadet vs. Ivory?
 
I voted Cadet. But I hope we can find a way to keep them both. I like Ivory's battering ram style, and I also like Cadet's versatility. I think Korey Hall is the odd man out here, since Dave "Wendys" Thomas can play H-back.

And also, I agree that Cadet WILL NOT make it through the 24-hour waiver period.

Rugby Saint II 08-20-2012 12:46 PM

Re: Post Jags Preseason: Cadet vs. Ivory?
 
Cadet has the edge because he is more versatile as has been pointed out. I believe that Ivory is more important than a 2nd full back. If Ingram goes down we don't have a back with his style of running to replace him with. So, Ivory has the edge over the 2nd full back.

The Dude 08-20-2012 01:14 PM

Re: Post Jags Preseason: Cadet vs. Ivory?
 
I dont give a crap anymore who makes the roster. Hell my mom could start for all I care. I just want the player that can contribute the most and help us win playoff games. Both the Billy Joes can come in and suit up and I wouldnt give a ****.

SaintsBro 08-20-2012 01:29 PM

Re: Post Jags Preseason: Cadet vs. Ivory?
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by The Dude (Post 429602)
I dont give a crap anymore who makes the roster. Hell my mom could start for all I care. I just want the player that can contribute the most and help us win playoff games. Both the Billy Joes can come in and suit up and I wouldnt give a ****.

I'm with you Dude. And also the draft. I completely trust the FO and don't even care knowing who else is out there that we might pick. Loomis could draft some guy from Hogwarts or from Barnum & Bailey Clown School, or sign a free agent UPS driver off the street, and I'd be totally down with the pick and looking forward to seeing them suit up.

TheOak 08-20-2012 01:38 PM

Re: Post Jags Preseason: Cadet vs. Ivory?
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by SaintsBro (Post 429606)
I'm with you Dude. And also the draft. I completely trust the FO and don't even care knowing who else is out there that we might pick. Loomis could draft some guy from Hogwarts or from Barnum & Bailey Clown School, or sign a free agent UPS driver off the street, and I'd be totally down with the pick and looking forward to seeing them suit up.

The Bud man worked out well

AlaskaSaints 08-20-2012 01:43 PM

Re: Post Jags Preseason: Cadet vs. Ivory?
 
Even I voted Cadet. Based solely upon what I've seen so far this pre-season.

Everyone knows that when the rubber hits the road in regular season, Ivory will prove to be a beast.

I'm just going to have to sit back and watch for what happens. I want the best for the Saints, not my likes or dislikes.

Searching for a new avatar...

Alaska

TheOak 08-20-2012 03:13 PM

Re: Post Jags Preseason: Cadet vs. Ivory?
 
To be quite honest, I do not trust any of the stats from the HoF game or first preseason game.... They both have dreads covering their names and more times than not, Cadet was called Ivory and vice versa.

SloMotion 08-22-2012 07:12 AM

Re: Post Jags Preseason: Cadet vs. Ivory?
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by x626xBlack (Post 429643)
To be quite honest, I do not trust any of the stats from the HoF game or first preseason game.... They both have dreads covering their names and more times than not, Cadet was called Ivory and vice versa.

... and that, in part & upon further review, is why I was thinking I may have been so impressed with Cadet at the start ... the dreads were making it hard to tell the two apart ... I still voted 'Cadet' though because he fits the offensive scheme better & plays special teams.

Utah_Saint 08-22-2012 07:58 AM

Re: Post Jags Preseason: Cadet vs. Ivory?
 
If I could only choose one, Cadet.

But I'd rather not choose just one.

DamondT 08-22-2012 07:49 PM

Re: Post Jags Preseason: Cadet vs. Ivory?
 
I think one is going to be gone for sure, the Saints should start showcasing Ivory more so they can trade him. I think that is the smart thing

DamondT 08-22-2012 07:58 PM

Re: Post Jags Preseason: Cadet vs. Ivory?
 
I agree with Utah Saint, I would like to keep them both too

Budsdrinker 08-22-2012 10:37 PM

Re: Post Jags Preseason: Cadet vs. Ivory?
 
I picked Cadet because he's younger and hasn't had the history of injuries like Ivory. However I would prefer they keep both and let Hall go because all Hall does is play ST and Cadet can do that.

Saintswrath 08-23-2012 05:09 AM

Re: Post Jags Preseason: Cadet vs. Ivory?
 
Cadet.. I like Ivory he still run's hard but his inability to break tackles worries me.. he hits a pile with everything but that shortens his career with every hit, cadet seem's to play smarter and get the most out of his run's.

TheOak 08-26-2012 07:03 AM

Re: Post Jags Preseason: Cadet vs. Ivory?
 
Ok after watching last nights game I still think Cadet provides a better overall value with his special teams etc.... This is however the reason I have changed my decision if I had to pick one of the two.... We already have someone just like that... He is called Sproles... They are both All purpose yardage masters.

I am going with Ivory.. ESPECIALLY after I saw him get up and walk away from the hit he took on the opening drive against the Texans.

He is anything but fragile. He is a freight Train... If I had the cure for cancer riding on one play and needed 2 yards, he is the man i would give the ball to.

While his value is narrowed he provides something not many others can.... We can also get a whole lot more for Cadet.

Utah_Saint 08-26-2012 10:45 PM

Re: Post Jags Preseason: Cadet vs. Ivory?
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by x626xBlack (Post 431438)
If I had the cure for cancer riding on one play and needed 2 yards, he is the man i would give the ball to.

Two yards?

For a cure for cancer?

I don't know man, I think you found the right guy the other day.

"The House"!!

He might be exhausted, completely winded, but after 3 feet of hard running, he could just fall forward. (hopefully not on top of anybody)


QBREES9 08-26-2012 10:56 PM

Re: Post Jags Preseason: Cadet vs. Ivory?
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Danno (Post 429328)
Both

Ditch the 2nd FB since Dave Thomas is back.
Cadet can play multiple roles on offense and special teams.


Great point !

FinSaint 08-27-2012 05:28 AM

Re: Post Jags Preseason: Cadet vs. Ivory?
 
Cadet simply because he seems to be more versatile and Ivory has an injury-ridden past that would make any GM uncomfortable.

That being said, if they can't fit both of these guys within the 53, I hope they'll try to trade Ivory to get something in return for him - perhaps get the pick back they gave up in the Ruud trade.

Oh, and while I'm in the minority with this one, I'd probably take Hall over Ivory when discussing roster spots, because he is one of the best ST players the Saints have, and because of that I don't think they want to cut him.

Danno 08-27-2012 08:08 AM

Re: Post Jags Preseason: Cadet vs. Ivory?
 
After reading a zillion posts about Cadet vs Ivory, one thing is obvious to me. You can't cut either one. Just face the music and keep both. Every one of our RB's is apparently made of glass (some glassier than others).

So I don't think its a bad idea to keep 5, especially when one of them can also play all 4 special teams units, WR in an emergency, our 3rd QB if an emergency arises during a game, and be a "slash" type weapon on gadet plays as he develops further.

Besides, Cadet probably comes closest to Sproles skillset than any other back we have.

TheOak 08-27-2012 08:42 AM

Re: Post Jags Preseason: Cadet vs. Ivory?
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Utah_Saint (Post 431671)
Two yards?

For a cure for cancer?

I don't know man, I think you found the right guy the other day.

"The House"!!

He might be exhausted, completely winded, but after 3 feet of hard running, he could just fall forward. (hopefully not on top of anybody)

ROFLMAO.... Are you saying the guy has a 4' time because he cant finish the 40?

Boutte 08-27-2012 08:53 AM

Re: Post Jags Preseason: Cadet vs. Ivory?
 
If we have to pick one or the other I guess I'll go with Cadet. I'd hate to us lose Ivory though, the guy can run.


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