Whats wrong with our Defense ( Visual Proof )
 

After about 10 Minutes of explaining to my Fiance what is wrong with the saints and people blaming Spags I decided to take proof that it is not his fault but our own . Our Problem Is Our D Line and Our Line Backers ...

Watch This Play ( again ) and pause @ 1:04
#95 is Clearly Getting Blown Back ( which leads to him being held )

and more than that Linebacker # 54 has a Clean shot to Knock Jamaal Charles Out For a Loss ...

Instead of taking the straight path in the gap and hitting for a loss ...

He takes a poor angle and #95 is getting beat so bad , he cuts off the linebackers angle to the RB ... And they got a big play.

Want to see How it should work ?


Ray Lewis ( Not Because He is any Stronger or Faster than our LB ) Takes the Gap and makes a clear strong formed tackle and It's a 5 Yard Loss and Game Over.

Another You Say ?


@ 4 Seconds Exactly You'll see a Linebacker is late Filling The Gap and makes a poor tackle ( as a result of being late and not filling properly ) and now a play that should have been a 5 Yard loss , dethrones the Saints as Superbowl Champs ...

More You Say ?

Aldon Smith Of the San Francisco 49'ers Is the Only Defensive Lineman to Beat his man at the line of scrimmage ... And it's more than enough to Stop This play ...


Our D Line Play - Hurts The Line Backing Play - Destroys Our Coverage , Destroys our Defense ... Keeps Drew Off The Field , That's why we are 0-3

Re: Whats wrong with our Defense ( Visual Proof )
 

The problem is. We have a bunch of underachievers. Who don't play till the whistle blows. I'm 110% convinced that our second string D is at least 5 of not 10x better than our first stringers. Our D ALWAYS gets gashed for a big play. It never fails. Week 1 against Washington. garçon. Week 2 against Carolina. Too many to count. Week 3 jammal Charles looked like it was his last game. Week 4 Cedric benson will gash us too along with Rogers. Our D won't do what the seahawks D did. (get pressure)

Re: Whats wrong with our Defense ( Visual Proof )
 

I still say it's our talent. Mix it in with coaching = 32nd in the league
I would be willing to say our d is probably 33 in the league, I'm sure there is a team with back ups better that what we have on the field now

Re: Whats wrong with our Defense ( Visual Proof )
 

No No No as I illustrated we are one or two tiny but crucial things away from being solid.

D Line needs to be Hyper Aggressive

LB need to make the right Reads ...

And we all need to tackle like we mean it.

Re: Whats wrong with our Defense ( Visual Proof )
 

Hey let me say welcome abroad Saintso. Coaching is a huge part, and you are right about that. But Shanle? how many years we have to watch this guy. Our backfield now is down, Our Safety play is horrendous. Our line is slow... We could inject them with crystal meth before a game, and that wouldn't even get the "Hyper aggressive" you are looking for

Re: Whats wrong with our Defense ( Visual Proof )
 

Lol If You can't make that read you don't need to be in the NFL ...

Re: Whats wrong with our Defense ( Visual Proof )
 

Well yeah...but...when we do that Roger fines and suspends us..

:banana:

Re: Whats wrong with our Defense ( Visual Proof )
 

At this point I'll take a fine for a W anyday

Re: Whats wrong with our Defense ( Visual Proof )
 

I think there's going to be a lot of changes after this season. Once Payton is back with the notes that he's taken watching these games and Spag's has another offseason to get the defensive players he wants... Our defense will look quite a bit different.

Re: Whats wrong with our Defense ( Visual Proof )
 

I was reading in another thread that the reason JC went for 91 yards is because Wilson was held, I'm glad that there is visual proof here that shows that other players had the chance to make the tackle and just missed or was slow getting over to seal the corner.

Re: Whats wrong with our Defense ( Visual Proof )
 

"Big" Sedrick Ellis should be packing already!

Re: Whats wrong with our Defense ( Visual Proof )
 

His contract will be up and I agree, he's gone. There was a reason we drafted Hicks. Throw Bushrod in as well because I'm 100% convinced we won't be resigning him and drafting his replacement with our 1st round pick.

Re: Whats wrong with our Defense ( Visual Proof )
 

Spags knows exactly what they SHOULD be doing.
Next season will be his draft and FA to get him the personnel he needs.
His 4-3 has to have pressure from the front four to be successful.
It was said earlier, front 4 is dragging down the next 3 and not giving the last 4 chances to make plays.
Giving up big plays every week has nothing to do with Spagnuolo.
Greg Williams group did the exact same thing last year.
One or two guys are going to have to step up, lead the way, make some things happen in the moment.
I believe the rest of the guys will begin to add to the high level of play and expectation.
Tackling is still a mixed bag. Makes me sick! Especially at this level.
We've scored enough points every week to be 3-0, and the O isn't even clicking yet.
We've got to get some stops and get off the field on 3rd and +7, or we really are done.

Re: Whats wrong with our Defense ( Visual Proof )
 

Starts on the line. The D Line is bad, bad. But when Hicks is in there, he tends to be throwing off the timing or making a hit. Galette also had 2 sacks last game.

Our second string is playing better than our first, and I'd take Jordan, Hicks, anybody-but-Ellis, & Galette as my front four with the most reps. Smith/Tez can help spot Jordan/Galette, and rotate Bunkley/Walker/Johnson, and Ellis can just spot the next next bus to a team that will overpay him (Seattle with his ol' USC HC tool).

Hopefully we can trade for a pick in exchange for the taterhead Ellis.

Re: Whats wrong with our Defense ( Visual Proof )
 

Defense! Defense??? Don't talk to me about ... defense???

http://www.bleachernation.com/wp-con...-playoffs.jpeg

Re: Whats wrong with our Defense ( Visual Proof )
 

Fully agree. Spags has a good scheme, we just don't have the personnel to run it. As a result we are taking many steps backwards. I think they wanted a guy whose scheme stopped giving up the big play, which we did a ton with Gregg Williams' aggressive blitzing. Unfortunately our team was set up to throw people at the line gaps and in doing so be fair versus the run and allow the rest to man up on people. Big risk, sometimes big rewards, and sometimes big burns. Now we have guys trying to play zones when their instincts tell them otherwise, linemen used to playing gap control and not just going forward and failing miserably to get there. Linebackers who relied on pressuring QB's or shooting gaps in blitzes now having to be more responsible for areas of the field. We have a talent breakdown, players who just can't grasp the new concept, and players who will never fit this scheme. We are in for a long road before it gets better.

Re: Whats wrong with our Defense ( Visual Proof )
 

Was there supposed to be some kind of video with this post???

Re: Whats wrong with our Defense ( Visual Proof )
 

Yeah I posted them a up , now they're gone ...

Re: Whats wrong with our Defense ( Visual Proof )
 

It's all the coaches and players you have suspended. You could also upgrade the defense some (even the starting D). You got plenty of offense. So you get a high 1st for 2013 and a high 2nd for 2013 too. Use them both on Defense. You got plenty enough on offense. You don't need help there.

Re: Whats wrong with our Defense ( Visual Proof )
 

Also, on the defensive side of the ball we only have 5 SEC folks (Hicks could be considered w/his LSU ties).

SEC knows defense, yet we get defenders from the Fluffy PAC-"who cares" and the Slow & Sloppy Ten 10. Just saying...

Sincerely,

An SEC Homer

Re: Whats wrong with our Defense ( Visual Proof )
 

Been saying the LB's have been horribly out of position all year. Is it the scheme or the lack of talent (except Shanle, I already know that answer)?

Re: Whats wrong with our Defense ( Visual Proof )
 

Mostly scheme I'd guess. I've read some skilled analysts comment that our LB's aren't dropping back far enough in coverage and opposing QB's are killing us with the short crossing throws just over the LB's and in front of our safeties.

It may have something to do with talent, but for the last 3 years we ran mostly man. Zone with 2 high safeties is relatively new to a lot of our players. But its not like they've never had to play freaking zone before.

I'd guess 60% scheme, 40% talent.

Re: Whats wrong with our Defense ( Visual Proof )
 

Nothing like a good RCA (root cause analysis)..

Why are they not dropping back far enough? No confidence that the line can stop the run? Being told to stay closer to the line or scrimmage?

In Shanle's case its just where he is when the ball is snapped.... He does not "move good".

Re: Whats wrong with our Defense ( Visual Proof )
 

THIS.

I'm amazed when I hear that the defense "needs time to adjust to the new scheme," and its something like playing zone defense.

Have they never run a zone d before? From Pop Warner, to high school, college, and then pre-season I am amazed at the learning curve many of these gents display.

These men are supposed to be professional, masters of their craft, literally the most capable people on the planet, and they can't figure out how to execute a)clean tackles and b)coverage responsibilities in a zone scheme. (and please don't respond with "they're not hired to be smart, etc") because lots of these guys are very intelligent men.

I mean c'mon, there's only so many ways to put men in motion before the snap to disguise/reveal coverage duties

Someone please help me out if I'm missing something here

Re: Whats wrong with our Defense ( Visual Proof )
 

BINGO! Thats the same thing I say when I hear "dome team", or "Turf team"... I know they have played outdoors on grass as some point... and probably more than three times.

Re: Whats wrong with our Defense ( Visual Proof )
 

our defense is pathetic...not much more to say about it. we can scratch our heads all day long. at the end of the day...they are not good, havent been for years with 3 different coordinators. not the coordinator, its the poo players.

Re: Whats wrong with our Defense ( Visual Proof )
 

Of the players that Spags drafted this year, two are starting/in the active rotation

I'll take that as a good sign and hope the fishing is even better next year

Re: Whats wrong with our Defense ( Visual Proof )
 

This is true, but our D has been our biggest problem since '07. Offense wins in the regular season, but defense wins in the playoffs. The reason we lose all those road playoff games is that the D can't shut it down and carry us when the going gets rough. The root of the problem is that ~65% of our salary cap is tied up in offensive players, so the only way we will get a good defense is by drafting great players and keeping them on their cheap rookie contracts for a few years, but our scouting department has been disappointing in finding college talent for the defense. I think if we can hire some really good scouts (and maybe Spags brought some with him) then we could make some strides, but until we find a way to get better talent out of the draft, I just don't know.

Re: Whats wrong with our Defense ( Visual Proof )
 

So our defense stinks?

Re: Whats wrong with our Defense ( Visual Proof )
 

Coaches and players have both said that Scott Shanle is the smartest man on our defense.

Re: Whats wrong with our Defense ( Visual Proof )
 

Yikes.

I think I'm gonna go throw up now...

Re: Whats wrong with our Defense ( Visual Proof )
 

We don't get a 2013 2nd rounder :doh:

thanks rog, I hope you trip and fall down in front of lots of people

Re: Whats wrong with our Defense ( Visual Proof )
 

And he probably is. Thats why he was voted defensive MVP by our own players.

Re: Whats wrong with our Defense ( Visual Proof )
 

Stil,l I can't help but wonder how would our defense be if Payton was at the helm now. He expects more than we are currently getting from them to date.

Re: Whats wrong with our Defense ( Visual Proof )
 

Stephen Hawking is awfully smart, but probably wouldn't be a very good LB either ...

Re: Whats wrong with our Defense ( Visual Proof )
 

So this dude is smart, he's a defensive MVP on the team, and a perennial starter for three different defensive coordinators.

So why all the Shanle hate all the time? And not necessarily from you Danno, but I feel like I see a lot of it around

If the dude is so smart and so capable, there should be no reason for people to throw all the hate his direction. I'm confused.

Re: Whats wrong with our Defense ( Visual Proof )
 

No one said that he was smart... only that he was the smartest.

To me, there's a huge difference! ;-)


Oh, and the main reason why I complain about Shanle being a starter is that he is sooooo slow compared to the players he is supposed to be tackling that it makes it very painful to watch him play, and he doesn't have the natural positional instincts to cover his lack of speed and movement skills in general.

Re: Whats wrong with our Defense ( Visual Proof )
 

That distinction is pure gold :lolup:

Re: Whats wrong with our Defense ( Visual Proof )
 

I said smart, but I didn't say capable:p. He has an all-pro brain, but mediocre talent.

The total package equates to about NFL average for an OLB, maybe slightly below.

The main problem is we haven't acquired anyone better. Until someone surpasses him, he will and should remain the starter.

And its not like we haven't tried. Herring, Casillas, Hawthorne, Chamberlain, Arnoux, Wilson, Bussey, that Jax LB that GW liked, and probably a few others I can't recall.

Re: Whats wrong with our Defense ( Visual Proof )
 

Chamberlain looked surprisingly good before he got hurt, and he might've been able to give Shanle some honest competition, if he hadn't had to go and do the "Herring" on us.