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View Poll Results: What Priorities Must the Saints Address Early In The Draft?
Offensive Tackle 15 13.64%
Defensive End 30 27.27%
Outside Linebacker 22 20.00%
Defensive End 18 16.36%
Safety 10 9.09%
Cornerback 15 13.64%
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2013 NFL Draft - Saints Big Board

this is a discussion within the Saints Community Forum; nice picks Originally Posted by jjasso007 Round 4: Leon McFadden - CB - San Diego State - A shade under 5'10, but a great cover corner who can stick to receivers. Did great at the Senior Bowl hmmmmm i am ...

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Old 02-08-2013, 02:07 PM   #361
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Re: 2013 NFL Draft - Saints Big Board

nice picks

Originally Posted by jjasso007 View Post
Round 4: Leon McFadden - CB - San Diego State
- A shade under 5'10, but a great cover corner who can stick to receivers. Did great at the Senior Bowl
hmmmmm i am so tired of 5'10" cb. on the fence with the pick

Michael Williams, TE, Alabama?

put a few pounds on him and he could be a RT. tackle eligible all game long anyone? first tackle middle screen in nfl history? We need a blocking TE


Originally Posted by jjasso007 View Post
Round 7: Mychal Riviera - TE - Tennessee
- doesn't have the "elite" TE height (only 6'3), but is a good receiver and improving blocker who isn't afraid to mix it up and won't back down.
We need to get depth and solid prospects at OT asap. ones without an IR history that fills a book

Luke Marquardt, OT, Azusa Pacific ?

ok out of the blue project player

Last edited by hagan714; 02-08-2013 at 02:11 PM..
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Old 02-08-2013, 02:29 PM   #362
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Re: 2013 NFL Draft - Saints Big Board

He can be 5'10"... He also better be able to run a 4.2 40 and have a 50" vertical leap.
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Old 02-08-2013, 07:56 PM   #363
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Re: 2013 NFL Draft - Saints Big Board

going to take a closer look at this kid.

i went into this off season wanting the saints to get bigger and nastier in the secondary
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Old 02-09-2013, 05:08 AM   #364
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Re: 2013 NFL Draft - Saints Big Board

An actual well thought out article from Bleacher Report today.
Ive posted it here as it covers the draft but also Trading Harper and cutting/signing players
I wont post the whole article but its breaks down as

Trade Harper to Rams/Titans as he fits systems(Greg Williams) for a 3rd and 7th round pick.(Not sure we would get a third)

Cut
Getting rid of Harper's salary coupled with making some of the older Saints cap casualties would be a great start to this offseason.

Will Smith, Jonathan Vilma and Jabari Greer are all on the downside of their careers, and all three of them are are hamstringing a salary cap that is already $14 million over before the offseason has begun. The trio, or some combination of them, could be brought back at discounted rates later in training camp.After making these four moves, the Saints salary cap number would go from deep in debt to $22 million in the black after clearing $36 million off the books.

would we cut that much?
Seems high to me


Sign
The moves to make would be signing Dallas OLB Anthony Spencer, Baltimore CB Cary Williams, ILB/ST Larry Grant, Chicago WR/ST Johnny Knox and Atlanta OT Sam Baker.

I think there are some better options for depth than he has on here personaly


Re-sign
Making these moves, worth about $15 million, as well as re-signing Chase Daniel, Junior Galette, Brian de la Puente, Rafael Bush and Elbert Mack, could be the foundation for a very good draft.

His draft
First Round: Kenny Vaccaro, S, Texas

Third Round: Brandon Williams, NT, Missouri Southern

Third Round (from TEN/STL): Gavin Escobar, TE, San Diego St.

Fourth Round: David Quessenberry, OT, San Jose St.

Fifth Round: William Gholston, DE, Michigan St.

Sixth Round: Meshak Williams, OLB, Kansas St.

Seventh Round: Terrence Brown, CB, Stanford

Seventh Round (From TEN/STL): Quanterus Smith, OLB, Western Kentucky





Looking through it im not sure on that draft personally and would try to move back in the first round(trade with Bengals,the can move up to get needed LB,WR,S)we get a 3/5.

1(Trade back Bengals 3&5th) Kevin Minter/Alex Ogletree/Arthur Brown LB
3(Titans) Baccari Rambo S
3 Brandon Williams NT
3(BEN) Jordan Reed/Gavin Escobar TE
4 B.W. Webb/Blidi Wreh-Wilson/Leon McFadden CB
5 Terron Armstead/Xavier Nixon OT
BPA
5 Rodney Smith(Florida St WR / JJ Wilcox FS
6 Micah Hyde CB/ David Bass OLD,DE
7 Reid Fragel LOT/ Josh Boyd DT / (Ten/Rams) Philip Lutzenkirchen TE
7 BPA

3rd
Gavin Escobar TE 6'6" 255lb San Diego St.
Gavin Escobar Draft Profile

Jordan Reed TE 6'3" 225lb Florida St.
Jordan Reed Draft Profile


4th
B.W Webb CB 5'11" 180lb William & Mary
B.W. Webb Draft Profile

Blidi Wreh-Wilson CB 6'2" 190lb Connecticut
Blidi Wreh-Wilson Draft Profile

Leon McFadden CB 5'10" 185lb San Diego St.
Leon McFadden Draft Profile



5th
Terron Armstead OT 6'5" 304lb Arkansas-Pine Bluff
Terron Armstead Draft Profile

Xavier Nixon 6'6" 309lb Florida
Xavier Nixon Draft Profile

Rodney Smith WR 6'6" 219lb Florida St.
Rodney Smith Draft Profile

J.J Wilcox FS 6'0" 215lb Georgia Southern
J.J. Wilcox Draft Profile


6th
Micah Hyde FS 6'1" 190lb Iowa
Micah Hyde Draft Profile

David Bass DE/OLB 6'5" 275lb Missouri Western
David Bass*|*Missouri Western,*DE*:*2013 NFL Draft Scout Player Profile

7th

Reid Fragel LOT 6'8" 298lb Ohio St.
Reid Fragel Draft Profile

Josh Boyd DT 6'2" 300lb Mississippi St.
Josh Boyd Draft Profile

Philip Lutzenkirchen TE 6'5" 250lb Auburn
Philip Lutzenkirchen Draft Profile

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Old 02-09-2013, 05:58 AM   #365
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Re: 2013 NFL Draft - Saints Big Board

Originally Posted by lee909 View Post
Trade Harper to Rams/Titans as he fits systems(Greg Williams) for a 3rd and 7th round pick.(Not sure we would get a third)

Cut
Getting rid of Harper's salary coupled with making some of the older Saints cap casualties would be a great start to this offseason.

Will Smith, Jonathan Vilma and Jabari Greer are all on the downside of their careers, and all three of them are are hamstringing a salary cap that is already $14 million over before the offseason has begun. The trio, or some combination of them, could be brought back at discounted rates later in training camp.After making these four moves, the Saints salary cap number would go from deep in debt to $22 million in the black after clearing $36 million off the books.

As has been said here before - by f.e. Danno - Harper probably fits the new defensive system better, because in all likelihood it'll have a clear FS/SS division of labor, which would place Harper closer to the LOS (i.e. his strength).

And Bleacher report once again shows how poorly the people writing the articles know how things actually work in the real world!

The writer claims: "After making these four moves, the Saints salary cap number would go from deep in debt to $22 million in the black after clearing $36 million off the books". The four moves correlate with Harper being traded, which would naturally transfer his contract and all its responsibilities to the new club, and would, therefore, clear up the $7.1M. But when stating the clearing off of $36M from the cap - it would mean that the trio of Smith, Vilma, and Greer would all need to also be traded, because if they're cut, it wouldn't mean that all of their salaries would clear off the cap.

Cutting Smith would free up $7.7M, cutting Vilma would free up $6M, and cutting Greer would free up $1.45M (according to my calculations). So, while all of their cap hits for 2013 would add up to almost $36M - the moves the writer is proposing would only free up little over $22M, so there's a $14M gap between the real life world and the hypothetical world the writer apparently lives in.
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Old 02-09-2013, 06:03 AM   #366
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Re: 2013 NFL Draft - Saints Big Board

I didnt think his his sums added up with regards to the contracts.
Personally i would not be against trading Harper,or opposed to keeping him if he restructures his contract.Do you think we could get a third and seventh for him?
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Old 02-09-2013, 06:09 AM   #367
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Re: 2013 NFL Draft - Saints Big Board

Originally Posted by lee909 View Post
I didnt think his his sums added up with regards to the contracts.
Personally i would not be against trading Harper,or opposed to keeping him if he restructures his contract.Do you think we could get a third and seventh for him?

Probably with the right trading partner - not saying it's probable, but anything is possible under the right circumstances.

I'm in the same boat with you on Harper, I wouldn't be against him sticking around, but he would need to renegotiate his contract in that case. But if a team offered a 3rd and a 7th along with taking his contract over - it would be difficult to not jump on that offer.
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Old 02-09-2013, 08:04 AM   #368
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Re: 2013 NFL Draft - Saints Big Board

would we cut that much?

i would not be surprised if we do gut a lot of the cap heavy players on defense. real question will it be done in one year? thats a lot of cap carry over still.

Trades? sure i can see Harper trade with Greg Williams but that would be a hard sell with that contract. the odds of two picks is slim and a 3 rd is a reach. 4th maybe with a restructured deal much like with the bush trade.

Mickey always surprises us and i am sure he has more than one game plan already drawn up

I do like the baby steps down the draft and getting picks

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Old 02-09-2013, 08:38 AM   #369
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Re: 2013 NFL Draft - Saints Big Board

Originally Posted by FinSaint View Post
The writer claims: "After making these four moves, the Saints salary cap number would go from deep in debt to $22 million in the black after clearing $36 million off the books". The four moves correlate with Harper being traded, which would naturally transfer his contract and all its responsibilities to the new club, and would, therefore, clear up the $7.1M. But when stating the clearing off of $36M from the cap - it would mean that the trio of Smith, Vilma, and Greer would all need to also be traded, because if they're cut, it wouldn't mean that all of their salaries would clear off the cap.
All the signing bonus money would still count against our cap.

The Titans would be responsible for his yearly salary and all the incentive clauses, work-out bonuses, roster bonuses, but the signing bonus is still on us. It has already been paid to Harper the day he signed the contract.

We'd have 3.5 million on his signing bonus count against our 2013 cap. ( I think there's a way we can spread it out over two years, but not sure), so cutting Harper only saves us his salary and roster bonuses (6.25 mill) minus the signing bonus escalation and we end up with only saving 2.75 million.

Trading Harper only saves us 2.75 million, not the 7.1 million the author implies. Then again, the new CBA may have changed that, but I don't think it did.


I asked the Commish...
Question 1.12
What happens if a player is traded or retires?


Answer: We already know that if a player is waived on or before June 1, the remaining signing bonus that has not been included in salary “accelerates” and is included in that year’s team salary. Acceleration also occurs when a player is traded or waived and picked up by another team. The new team is not responsible for any of the original signing bonus. The team that waived or traded the player is responsible for the accelerated signing bonus (in the same manner as described above).

In most cases, if a player retires, the remaining signing bonus that has not been included in salary “accelerates” and is included in that year’s team salary. Thus, the team will take an immediate salary cap hit of the remaining signing bonus.
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Old 02-09-2013, 10:01 AM   #370
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Re: 2013 NFL Draft - Saints Big Board

Originally Posted by Danno View Post
All the signing bonus money would still count against our cap.

The Titans would be responsible for his yearly salary and all the incentive clauses, work-out bonuses, roster bonuses, but the signing bonus is still on us. It has already been paid to Harper the day he signed the contract.

We'd have 3.5 million on his signing bonus count against our 2013 cap. ( I think there's a way we can spread it out over two years, but not sure), so cutting Harper only saves us his salary and roster bonuses (6.25 mill) minus the signing bonus escalation and we end up with only saving 2.75 million.

Trading Harper only saves us 2.75 million, not the 7.1 million the author implies. Then again, the new CBA may have changed that, but I don't think it did.


I asked the Commish...
Question 1.12
What happens if a player is traded or retires?


Answer: We already know that if a player is waived on or before June 1, the remaining signing bonus that has not been included in salary “accelerates” and is included in that year’s team salary. Acceleration also occurs when a player is traded or waived and picked up by another team. The new team is not responsible for any of the original signing bonus. The team that waived or traded the player is responsible for the accelerated signing bonus (in the same manner as described above).

In most cases, if a player retires, the remaining signing bonus that has not been included in salary “accelerates” and is included in that year’s team salary. Thus, the team will take an immediate salary cap hit of the remaining signing bonus.

OK, I wasn't totally sure about it, so I checked a CBA FAQ thread before posting, and there it said that all contract responsibilities are transfered to the team that'll hold the players rights after the trade. And I took that to mean that they'd have to take on the cap hits from the prorated bonuses and etc, even though the signing bonus has naturally been already paid to the player. It was my mistake to jump to that conclusion, and I probably should've taken a closer look at the actual CBA.
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