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-   -   Spags: I hope hes canned (https://blackandgold.com/saints/54202-spags-i-hope-hes-canned.html)

spkb25 12-31-2012 07:22 PM

Re: Spags: I hope hes canned
 
Man I must be the only one hoping he stays. I thought the D really showed a lot of improvement.

ST coach may need to go or WR coach or DLine coach.

Jamessr 12-31-2012 07:25 PM

Re: Spags: I hope hes canned
 
I'm not sure how I feel about this one tbh.

The guy came into alot of issues with the GM, assistant head coach and the Head Coach being suspended.

However this guy isn't a rookie coach. I still personally blame him for not judging his guys to see how much of the new scheme was working. It wasn't until Vilma came back that some blitz were used. And we had somewhat good results.

As far as the player quaility... I'm not sure about that either.

westbankdaze 12-31-2012 07:52 PM

We have probs with personnel and coaching. Our defense has ranked in the bottom for the last 4 seasons with the exception of 2010. I still can't figure out what we were doing that season that made the def click but it does seem to show that we might be able to get it done with the players we have.

Still I don't think spags zone defense works for our guys. GW knew how much are players blew that's why he threw so many blitzes during his tenure.

I'm not a fan of spags - not with his record the last few seasons as a HC or a def coach. I gave him the benefit of the doubt at season's start but the scheme has just plain stunk all season.

I really think MJ is a bust and as much as I loved Harper in the day he just isn't there any more. We need a polamalu big time back there.

Our corners I think can improve and I am not sold and letting them all go.

The defensive line could get better but we need some freaking linebackers big time. I think lofton is good but I don't know what we are going to to do about the other two positions.

Part of me would like to see us get a 3-4 defense back like the ole days but how many players do we need to get to do that?

pumpkindriver 12-31-2012 09:35 PM

Re: Spags: I hope hes canned
 
As bad as our defense was this season, there were flashes of briliance. In the SP era, we've always given up tons of yardage. I don't think we really have the personnel atm to be effective in Spag's scheme but with some key moves in the off season and perhaps drafting some good young talent maybe we can turn the corner defensively next year. We all have our opinions, mine is for keeping Spags for one more season, but ML,SP and the rest of the front office will decide what they think is best. All we can do is go "Wahhhhhh" if we don't like or agree with it.

st thomas 12-31-2012 09:49 PM

Re: Spags: I hope hes canned
 
Just how many of us would really be pissed off hurt is he did get canned?

RaginCajun83 12-31-2012 10:11 PM

Re: Spags: I hope hes canned
 
Spags isn't leaving, Payton signed off on him coming in so let's see what happens next season after some of the underachieving overpaid POS's on defense are gone. If the defense breaks the yardage record again then cut ties with the whole defensive coaching staff

QBREES9 12-31-2012 11:11 PM

Re: Spags: I hope hes canned
 
He had an off year.

jlouhill 12-31-2012 11:43 PM

Re: Spags: I hope hes canned
 
I'm not for canning him after one year. Let's see what he can do hopefully with a few different players. Now if the D doesn't continue to improve into next year then he needs to go.
Now the special teams coach, He needs to GO!

Vrillon82 01-01-2013 12:24 AM

Re: Spags: I hope hes canned
 
I find it hard to blame Spags in this debacle.

I think the problem is the players on Defense side is just not that great.

I mean look at players who were starting on our Defense that had left for other teams, they never really made it out of 2nd string status except Tracy Porter, and Porter got burned repeatedly in Denver.

SloMotion 01-01-2013 05:57 AM

Re: Spags: I hope hes canned
 
I consider the way NFL defenses are structured today. You have a bunch of role players with one, two, maybe standout players in key positions. Other than SFran, who really has more than that? Green Bay is a perfect example. Take out Woodson and/or Matthews and the defense suffers.

New Orleans didn't have those key players, as has been pointed out. I think in light of that and everything else that went on, you have to give Spags at least another season.

There's also the wording to consider. The Saints allowed the most points, they're not historically the worst defense ever this season. Tennessee actually ranked below New Orleans this season. I've brought this up before ... the NFL is all about winning or losing.

IMO, any team with a worse win/loss record this season, had a worse defense than the Saints. The title of "Worst defense in history" would then be awarded to the 2008 Detroit Lions (0-16) with the '77 Buccaneers(2-12) coming in a close second for their inaugral 0-12 run.

Spags ain't going anywhere anyway, so just start thinking happy thoughts for next season, :mrgreen:.

biloxi-indian 01-01-2013 06:36 AM

Re: Spags: I hope hes canned
 
Wrong strategy on Spags. Let's blame the players and promote Spags as the best DC in the league. This would entice one of the owners who just fired a HC to consider Spags as his next SAVIOR.

Then we can bring in another DC and really confuse professional players making millions who neither fit into either round holes or square pegs.

Sarcasm off.

insidejob 01-01-2013 07:14 AM

He should be given the chance to hire his own position coaches and draft some players before any changes are made. Also, Payton isn't going to get rid of the guy before he even gets to work with him.

SloMotion 01-01-2013 07:28 AM

Re: Spags: I hope hes canned
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by biloxi-indian (Post 469228)
Wrong strategy on Spags. Let's blame the players and promote Spags as the best DC in the league. This would entice one of the owners who just fired a HC to consider Spags as his next SAVIOR.

Then we can bring in another DC and really confuse professional players making millions who neither fit into either round holes or square pegs.

Sarcasm off.

... a bit confusing, but after reading through it a few times, I got it, :lol:.

SaintsBro 01-01-2013 07:46 AM

Re: Spags: I hope hes canned
 
Well, I look back to the worst of the worst, maybe it was the Chiefs or the Packers game, 0-4, or a little bit after that. And Spags had this press conference barely ten minutes after the game ended, where he was clearly fed up with it all, and you could tell he was pulling his hair out over it, he was like, "honestly, I don't know what it all is, it's a bunch of different things, but we're going to figure it out, and we will fix it."

And certain people on here in this forum had a complete COW over that, they took that one little bit of what he said out of context and went ballistic over it -- "he doesn't KNOW what the problem is! He's INCOMPETENT!" and they just threw Spags under the bus like so much hot garbage, four or five weeks in. They demanded he "take responsibility," ignoring the fact that he already DID take responsibility, two sentences earlier at the podium, and he already said it was unacceptable and that he wasn't happy with it. But certain people just wrote the ticket on him, punched it, and that was it.


And then he did fix it. Sort of. Kind of. They got better. A little bit. Well not as much as we'd like, but hey. That Eagles and Buccaneers games were kinda fun to watch on defense. Some of it in the last half of the year was not entirely painful.

I think Spags literally learned what he had to work with, while wearing his hard hat on the job site, with out-dated blueprints and no architect to guide him, and whatever you build under those kind of ridiculous conditions is probably not going to be this enormous towering monumental edifice of impregnable defense, like some people here seem to expect.

We're an OFFENSIVE team with a leaky defense. Not very likely going to have a dominant skull-crushing defense anytime soon, until Payton leaves. You go 10+ wins for a bunch of years, in a row like that, WINNING, it hurts the quality of your draft picks that are on the board when you get to pick in the draft, and that shows. This was a transition year anyway, and with no head coach, it came out worse than expected. Ugh.

Tobias-Reiper 01-01-2013 09:34 AM

Re: Spags: I hope hes canned
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by skymike (Post 469161)
You know, Mike Ditka won a super bowl, and was the hottest thing in Chicago since fire. Then he came here.

Just an observation: Mike Ditka was never a good coach in Chicago. It was Buddy Ryan's defense who carried that team.

RailBoss 01-01-2013 12:22 PM

Re: Spags: I hope hes canned
 
Another one is Jim Haslett who had a pretty good D while he was Head Coach here but couldn't get the whole package right. He winds up in Washington and is doing a solid job even with a lot of injuries.

Wilde18 01-01-2013 12:28 PM

Anything to make the defense work will work. If that means to kick him, go ahead!

Belair57 01-01-2013 01:13 PM

Re: Spags: I hope hes canned
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by QBREES9 (Post 469198)
He had an off year.

if by off year,you mean he sucked..then yes.
He didnt do anything in St louis, he didnt do anything last year, he hasnt did anything since the superbowl....these same round players in square holes were not the worst D in nfl history last year.....good ridance

Budsdrinker 01-01-2013 06:23 PM

Re: Spags: I hope hes canned
 
He did something that 90% of people on this board wanted and benched shanle the last 8 Weeks and the defense didn't improve. Personally I blame the new cba. It's his first year here and he has only so many practices with contact. I believe it took the whole year for him to really evaluate the players we have to work in his system. I'm willing to give him at least half of next year when he has a full coaching staff to see what he can do. Remember vitt is the Lb coach who wasn't able to fully apply himself to that position. If by game 6 of next year the d is still in the cellar then go ahead and can him but I think after all the distractions of 2012 he deserves more time.

hagan714 01-01-2013 08:04 PM

Re: Spags: I hope hes canned
 
LOVIE SMITH IS ALL I HAVE TO SCREAM

burningmetal 01-01-2013 08:10 PM

Re: Spags: I hope hes canned
 
Spagnuolo took a bad Giants defense, in his FIRST year there, and after a couple bad games to start that season he completely turned it around. Everybody says we don't have the Giants personnel... well, then why did they suck so bad before he took over? I'll concede that we don't have the pass rushers, but we have guys with potential who aren't getting any better (with the exception of Cam Jordan). The fact of the matter is you are expected to improve what you are given. We didn't have to be as good as his Giants defense, but we needed to be better than we were last year, not worse. Especially not MUCH worse. But I'm content with giving him another year, considering I really wanted the Saints to get this guy for years.

Let's see if we CAN get him some better players, and give him another shot.

darstep 01-01-2013 08:31 PM

Re: Spags: I hope hes canned
 
At the pro level, if nothing else, you should demand fundamentals.
GW couldn't get it out of this group and neither could Spagnuolo.
Give him some time to get "some" of the pieces he chooses, then let's judge results.
These guys were slow, couldn't cover, couldn't tackle, couldn't pass rush...
I wish I could buy him a drink.

The Dude 01-01-2013 08:56 PM

Re: Spags: I hope hes canned
 
Ill give him a pass this year. I want to see him in a year with our HC and no drama surrounding the team and some better personnel. Gregg Williams did not have to deal with near the amount of **** Spags had to deal with this year.

RaginCajun83 01-01-2013 09:40 PM

Re: Spags: I hope hes canned
 
Haslett is like Romeo Carnell and Norv Turner, as cordinators they look like God's gift to football yet they suck as head coaches. Not everyone can be Sean Payton

Vrillon82 01-01-2013 10:37 PM

Re: Spags: I hope hes canned
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Tobias-Reiper (Post 469265)
Just an observation: Mike Ditka was never a good coach in Chicago. It was Buddy Ryan's defense who carried that team.

Oh Hell no.


Like I said many times before, Ditka came here because Buddy D suggested as much. Buddy D did more to destroy the Saints than what most people believe or think to due to his relationship with Tom Benson.

Majsmith 01-01-2013 10:50 PM

Re: Spags: I hope hes canned
 
Shows how little you know about coaching football. All emotional reactions. If you knew what you were talking about, you would say keep him!

lee909 01-02-2013 01:59 AM

Re: Spags: I hope hes canned
 
He should get the year to sort things out.
He deserves the chance to get some players he wants in the draft.
The players and team would have been pretty lost last offseason.No head coach,LB coach taking control of the team then disappearing for 6 weeks.
He could not gameplan with Smith or Vilma as he never knew when he could use them.No pass rush,a secondary that couldnt cover a gandma.

Nobody performed this year and i wouldnt like to be any of them players when coach Payton walks through that door.Going to be some serious words thrown dished out.

I would like some much needed consistency through this year.
If its poor again this year then Payton and Loomis will make the changes needed.

I wouldnt be against Lovie Smith but
1) He wil get job offers
2)Even if he took the job we would be looking for a new DC next year,when he took another job.

Vrillon82 01-02-2013 04:16 AM

Re: Spags: I hope hes canned
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by RaginCajun83 (Post 469402)
Haslett is like Romeo Carnell and Norv Turner, as cordinators they look like God's gift to football yet they suck as head coaches. Not everyone can be Sean Payton

The thing about Haslett is, everyone saw this during his tenure here in New Orleans is that he can be a decent coach, but his staff on the other hand sucks, we would of been in the playoffs for years under Haslett if he would of got rid of the excess baggage known as Rick Venturi.

SmashMouth 01-02-2013 08:18 AM

Re: Spags: I hope hes canned
 
Looks like the Times Pic agrees with you...

New Orleans Saints player: Steve Spagnuolo should be fired as defensive coordinator | NOLA.com

vpheughan 01-02-2013 08:40 AM

Re: Spags: I hope hes canned
 
Haslett had Mike McCarthy as his OC. The team was decent under him. He made Delhome the QB he was. Haslett couldn't judge talent why else would he stay with Smiley so long!

TheOak 01-02-2013 08:44 AM

Re: Spags: I hope hes canned
 
To say Spags needs to go after this season is to admit that you are ignoring everything that has happened to this team in the last 6 months.

It also means you want to start 2013 having a defense learning a brand new coach and scheme the first 4-6 games again.

TheOak 01-02-2013 08:46 AM

Re: Spags: I hope hes canned
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by SmashMouth (Post 469489)

Read the title of the article and the article... The TP does not agree, "an unnamed player" agrees.

NOS2SB 01-02-2013 09:04 AM

Re: Spags: I hope hes canned
 
Lovie Smith for DC.

Belair57 01-02-2013 10:12 AM

Re: Spags: I hope hes canned
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by TheOak (Post 469505)
To say Spags needs to go after this season is to admit that you are ignoring everything that has happened to this team in the last 6 months.


It also means you want to start 2013 having a defense learning a brand new coach and scheme the first 4-6 games again.

so if the offseason drama screwed up this def why did it not affect our offense? Its spags, and now im reading players dont like the guy, its becoming even more evident what happened this year

TheOak 01-02-2013 10:19 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Belair57 (Post 469551)
so if the offseason drama screwed up this def why did it not affect our offense? Its spags, and now im reading players dont like the guy, its becoming even more evident what happened this year

Not sure what "offseason" drama you speak of, it was nearly all season... And it did effect our offense.

I suppose your also going to tell me that on a per player basis our defense is as equally talented as our offense?

NuNu318 01-02-2013 10:26 AM

Re: Spags: I hope hes canned
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Belair57 (Post 469551)
so if the offseason drama screwed up this def why did it not affect our offense? Its spags, and now im reading players dont like the guy, its becoming even more evident what happened this year

I'm sorry but I'm not taking the word of a unnamed player who's most likely won't be here next year anyway. I'm not gonna throw Spags under a bus because he has been stuck with a bunch of players that are low on IQ and talent. They were Low on those same things last year & just as bad but Brees & company put up 40 a game to cover that up. Its easy to look like you're competent when you up my at least 2 TDs everygame. It looks atrocious when the offense starts to sputter without a HC and you get exposed for the lack of talent you have.

Blame the scouts....blame Loomis for being for offensive oriented. Blaming a guy who hasn't even been here an entire 12months is a cop out.


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