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Khiry Robinson runs nasty

this is a discussion within the Saints Community Forum; You guys are vastly overthinking this. Garbage time, not garbage time, this doesn't really matter. What really matters is what Robinson did with his limited touches, independent of anything else. First carry: Run right, Khiry takes the handoff, sees there's ...

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Old 09-24-2013, 09:25 AM   #71
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Re: Khiry Robinson runs nasty

You guys are vastly overthinking this.

Garbage time, not garbage time, this doesn't really matter. What really matters is what Robinson did with his limited touches, independent of anything else.

First carry: Run right, Khiry takes the handoff, sees there's nothing for him, sidesteps a little to the left. Mind you, he does all this in less than a second. Puts his head down, gets a few yards and makes something out of nothing. Whether the defense is gassed here or not is irrelevant; I suspect that if it had been in the second quarter with the score 7-7 it still would've been pretty much the same result.

Second carry: Run left, hits the hole hard, not much resistance but he shows a ton of speed here and really does a good job of using his blockers downfield to maximize the run.

Third carry: Run right. Again not a lot of resistance from the defensive line, but he breaks through the line quick, stiff-arms a safety down and drags a DB with him for a few extra yards.

Fourth carry: Run right, pretty much identical to the first carry, he cuts back against the grain. (This is pretty much PT's trademark move and is like 80% of the reason he is such a good back.) Robinson essentially makes 3 yards out of what should've been a 1 yard loss. He puts his head down, wriggles through one tackler and then absolutely destroys a linebacker to finish off the run.


To me, carries 1 and 4 are the most telling. You cannot say those runs were the result of bad defense. They were actually good defensive plays and it was only because of Robinson's creativity and instincts that they ended up being positive gains.

The problem with Ingram is not his size, speed, height or anything like that. It's his lack of instinct. You either have it or you don't. PT has it. Robinson has it. Deuce had it, then his legs gave out and he didn't have the physical ability to do what he wanted to anymore.

But Ingram definitely doesn't have it. I have NEVER seen Ingram cut back on a run in three years. If somebody thinks that makes me a hater, then I can live with that. The truth is I don't "hate" anybody but it is not hard to see why our other backs are successful while Ingram is not.
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Old 09-24-2013, 10:02 AM   #72
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Re: Khiry Robinson runs nasty

Originally Posted by xan View Post
I don't understand how anyone could be excited about the "performance" Robinson put out in the last, meaningless drive of a game that was over 2 series before. .
True.
He got some touches against a beaten second string D at the end of a blowout.

Let's give Payton a little credit; I think he knows our depth chart. Our top backs generated -6 yards rushing in the first half, but he still didn't put Robinson in. That tells me all I need to know.

Maybe he is the future, but right now he is serviceable as a 4th back and might have earned a jersey for next week.

PS- Cadet looked good on ST
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Old 09-24-2013, 11:25 AM   #73
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Re: Khiry Robinson runs nasty

Originally Posted by Jack Vegas View Post
You guys are vastly overthinking this.
Then you proceed to over-think it yourself.
Garbage time, not garbage time, this doesn't really matter. What really matters is what Robinson did with his limited touches, independent of anything else.
It does matter.
Again, I go to my example:
When a team runs the victory formation at the end of the game and the QB takes a knee, that counts as a running play, and counts as a defensive stop for a 2 yard loss. Is that the same as a 2 yard loss on a goal line stand? I don't think so.
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Old 09-24-2013, 11:36 AM   #74
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Re: Khiry Robinson runs nasty

Originally Posted by Tobias-Reiper View Post
Then you proceed to over-think it yourself.

It does matter.
Again, I go to my example:
When a team runs the victory formation at the end of the game and the QB takes a knee, that counts as a running play, and counts as a defensive stop for a 2 yard loss. Is that the same as a 2 yard loss on a goal line stand? I don't think so.
While I agree it matters the situation he was in, I also believe if that had been ingram he wouldn't have done as well. So ultimately, the point remains that we think Krob is better. Only way to prove it is to give him some touches.
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Old 09-24-2013, 12:07 PM   #75
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Re: Khiry Robinson runs nasty

Originally Posted by Tobias-Reiper View Post
Then you proceed to over-think it yourself.
How so? I am simply showing you what Robinson does that is good; if a baseball player has a really good swing, then he can probably hit home runs off of good pitchers too, not just bad ones. Does Robinson have a good swing? Sure looks like it from what we've seen.

Originally Posted by Tobias-Reiper View Post
It does matter.
Again, I go to my example:
When a team runs the victory formation at the end of the game and the QB takes a knee, that counts as a running play, and counts as a defensive stop for a 2 yard loss. Is that the same as a 2 yard loss on a goal line stand? I don't think so.
This analogy makes less than zero sense. I have re-read this sentence at least five times and I am still like "WTF is he talking about?" The two situations have absolutely nothing in common, except they are both things that take place on a football field.
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Old 09-24-2013, 12:32 PM   #76
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Re: Khiry Robinson runs nasty

Originally Posted by Jack Vegas View Post

This analogy makes less than zero sense. I have re-read this sentence at least five times and I am still like "WTF is he talking about?" The two situations have absolutely nothing in common, except they are both things that take place on a football field.

And Shiano doesn't recognize one of them LOL.
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Old 09-24-2013, 12:41 PM   #77
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Re: Khiry Robinson runs nasty

Obviously the coaching staff have their reasons for not starting KRob or playing him more right now. These are reasons none of us could know but it's easy for us fans to speculate. Majority on this board wished we would have traded Ingram instead of Ivory but where is Ivory at now? Hamstring injury again. Of course with Ingram also being injured that's not much of an argument but the point is the coaching staff and Loomis have their reasons for what they do and I think we just need to trust their decisions.
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Old 09-24-2013, 12:56 PM   #78
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Re: Khiry Robinson runs nasty

Here's my theory.. Khiry will get more playing time this Monday to let the staff know if they should or shouldn't go through with the trade or whatnot.

Me personally believe opportunity is opportunity. Especially when ur that 4th or 3rd guy trying to get noticed. Its how you earn your stripes and you are gonna start off small especially if you weren't a high draft pick. So those of you debating whether it mattered or not. It's just a taste of what may come. Just like preaeason.. Opportunity.
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Old 09-24-2013, 12:57 PM   #79
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Re: Khiry Robinson runs nasty

Originally Posted by saintsfan1976 View Post
Are these stats through 3 games of each season?
In the first three games of 2011
Pierre Thomas carried the ball 21 times for 100 yards for an average of 4.8 yards per carry
Darren Sproles carried the ball 8 times for 59 yards for an average of 7.3 yards per carry
Mark Ingram carried the ball 36 times for 129 yards for an average of 3.6 yards per carry

In the first three games of 2012
Pierre Thomas carried the ball 19 times for 121 yards for an average of 7.2 yards per carry
Darren Sproles carried the ball 7 times for 62 yards for an average of 8.9 yards per carry
Mark Ingram carried the ball 28 times for 79 yards for an average of 2.8 yards per carry
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Old 09-24-2013, 01:33 PM   #80
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Re: Khiry Robinson runs nasty

Originally Posted by Utah_Saint View Post
In the first three games of 2011
Pierre Thomas carried the ball 21 times for 100 yards for an average of 4.8 yards per carry
Darren Sproles carried the ball 8 times for 59 yards for an average of 7.3 yards per carry
Mark Ingram carried the ball 36 times for 129 yards for an average of 3.6 yards per carry

In the first three games of 2012
Pierre Thomas carried the ball 19 times for 121 yards for an average of 7.2 yards per carry
Darren Sproles carried the ball 7 times for 62 yards for an average of 8.9 yards per carry
Mark Ingram carried the ball 28 times for 79 yards for an average of 2.8 yards per carry
But do you have the stats on what personnel the defenses were playing? That's what most of us are missing out on. I'm willing to bet the first beer that Ingram faces more base defense with the front 7 made up of DL and LB's and also a safety in the box compared to the rest facing nickle and dime packages that employ more smaller DB's.
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