Mark ingram and running game
 

Do you guys feel that mark Ingram could be the featured back this playoffs now in the playoffs and next year if he could stay hungry?Also can Ingram and robinson be the one two punch next year and we release or trade PT?

Re: Mark ingram and running game
 

Welcome. I know Ingram had a good game but seriously release Pierre Thomas? Why would we do that? I don't understand what you're saying or why you would theorize that.

Re: Mark ingram and running game
 

Yea the guy has had maybe 3 good games in 3 years. I don't think even a good playoff run could give the FO the confidence needed to get rid of PT, who has proven many, many times that he can run the ball AND is excellent at the screen pass. I do think it may be enough for him to keep his job though. I think they were just about ready to trade him.

Re: Mark ingram and running game
 

Too release so cap space maybe . Or we just release cadet cause i feel theres no need to have a crowed back field again. Just looking for opinions


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Re: Mark ingram and running game
 

Releasing PT may actually hurt our cap more than help it.

Re: Mark ingram and running game
 

It was only a matter of time before the PT release ended up on this forum.. Ive seen it every where.. Look ingram has been playing great,but i think all of us know payton prolly wont run the ball all the time from now on like he did vs philly so in that case never ever loose pt.. Plus hes a great runner 2.. Btw anybody know whats wrong with him they said chest but then i heard rib from the sideline reporter

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Re: Mark ingram and running game
 

I think someone messed up about his injury or something. Also that kinda gets me mad cause i too believe we might not run the ball like that unless we are blowing another team out


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Re: Mark ingram and running game
 

im hoping that this is just the tip of the iceberg for ingram.

i told my buddy about 5 min before the game started that ingram needed to channel his inner duece mcallister, circa 2006 divisional championship game against the eagirls.

there were definitely some duece-like runs, thats for sure

Re: Mark ingram and running game
 

Ingram did look very Deuce last night. I have to say it was his best performance as a Saint. Every time he ran the ball and gashed holes I screamed my lungs out. It's exciting to see him come into his own.

Re: Mark ingram and running game
 

Naturally, props to Ingram -- but he has a lot of make up work to do. One or two games is not going to do it for me. OK, if he wins the game in Seattle for us -- goes for 200 yards -- I'll roll out the red carpet for him.

Re: Mark ingram and running game
 

Did someone say duece? lol PT will be around for a while hes the most consistent rb I do see Khiry filling his role in the future. MI does what he did vs the eagles this Saturday I see him getting more carries nxt year.

Re: Mark ingram and running game
 

In honesty I think we have 1 too many rb.'s. If I would trade 1 it would be Sproles, I like Sproles but like Bush he is getting less effective in schemes. He is still a good player but I would trade him. We could use the picks and get players we are thin at a certain position. Between PT, Ingram, and Robinson our backfield would still be stout. I just feel that being overcrowded has hurt us more than it has helped. Another deep threat stud reciever to go along with Stills could ease a lot of pain.

Re: Mark ingram and running game
 

We also have to give him the ball more.. Adrian petterson said if i dont get 15 touches i never get into a rhythm

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Re: Mark ingram and running game
 

Just when I was longing for the smash mouth rushing days of Deuce in the back field. MAN did I get a warm fuzzy chuckle listening to Eagles fans cringe at Ingram gashing their D. I have renewed faith this team can be more than just a 'pass first' type team! Love it!

Re: Mark ingram and running game
 

Who would think we would come out knocking heads and shoving the ball down da eagles face. Very stoked about this.

Re: Mark ingram and running game
 

My take is that right now, with Ingram running the rock consistently... we are a much better team than we were in prior weeks, especially on the road. Pierre Thomas not playing may have been a blessing in disguise.

The problem with saying this though is that Pierre Thomas is an amazing football player, and there's no point in getting rid of amazing football players... especially when they contribute something vital to your team. Sean Payton needs take a big long look at the offense, figure out how to properly utilize both Ingram and Thomas in a way in which Ingram can get consistent carries and still allow Thomas to be effective in the screen game.

One thing that would make this much easier to accomplish is if Ingram became a larger threat in the passing game, as I think the way that we switch Ingram and Thomas in and out makes our offense somewhat predictable in what we are doing. Also I think the backs need bigger chunks of play time instead of switching in and out repeatedly. Several different changes that probably need to occur but all in all a different formula is needed.

Re: Mark ingram and running game
 

Ive debunked that "rhythm" myth many times. Its like saying "give me the ball more and I will put up more yards".. No Schit, ya think?

If the Texans played the Jaguars more they would eventually beat them.

If rhythm was a requirement First Qtr. rushing stats would be horrible.

Re: Mark ingram and running game
 

I don't think the having 15 rushes thing is the problem. It's more about having plays clustered together. When you go in there, run the ball... and don't get to rush again until a series or 2 down the road... you are going to run into a "rhythm" problem.

Think that we over-substitute at times, got too many moving pieces. The idea is to keep people fresh and get mismatches... but it has some unintended consequences.

Re: Mark ingram and running game
 

I could maybe change this to my quote...
It's about as ignorant as trading Drew Brees

Re: Mark ingram and running game
 

I agree about the "one too many backs" concept and have thought that for a while. But I'm not sure if Sproles is the odd man out. He's so dangerous out of the backfield and is a match up nightmare in the passing game. I'm glad I don't have to make that decision.

Re: Mark ingram and running game
 

A bizarre scenario but not ridiculous. PT hasn't looked like his old self. Is it the 30 year wall? Has he lost a step? Was there some nagging injury we aren't aware of? Or did the O-line troubles affect him more than we realize?

There's no value in a trade, he's 30 years old and has never been a feature back. Releasing him frees up a much needed 3 million in cap space, no dead money at all.

Loomis never releases his players until its painfully obvious it needs to be done. PT isn't there yet. I'll bet we ride out his final year.

Re: Mark ingram and running game
 

Again.. the "rhythm" problem is a myth.

Lynch ave 18 caries/game. Against Tampa he had 24.

Go through the play by play, other than the opening drive he had about 2-3 carries per possession. Any mythical rhythm gained by 3 carries is gone after the defense takes the field..

Watch Tampa Bay Buccaneers vs. Seattle Seahawks [11/03/2013] - NFL.com

The "I need a minimum of x carried per game" is what people that want the ball more say, and lets face it. All RBs and Receivers want the ball more.

You know why I hope we never have this "show case" running back? Jamal Charles went out of the game and their game plan was never the same. Davis was able to run but he was no J. Charles and that hurt them in the 4th qtr.

I would rather have two 7 (out of 10) running backs than a 10 and a 4 and have the 10 go down.

Sean Payton learned that lesson years ago.

Re: Mark ingram and running game
 

Mark ingram good game, what ya got next week.

Re: Mark ingram and running game
 

After the first drive, he didn't get a run again until the 2nd quarter, and only had 2 more runs for the entire half. That's only a portion of the equation though, as scheme differences come into play, as TB may have made adjustments.

Now I do think multiple backs is important in the NFL. Keeps the players fresh while the D-line gets exhausted, but if you think that a back can just walk onto the field after a long wait and roll off a 10 yard run, just as easily if he's in the game rhythm.... I just can't see it. A big part of being a running back is getting a feel for how the defense moves and what will be available to you.

Re: Mark ingram and running game
 

If that much BS goes into whether a RB can run the ball effectively he needs to go go Canada. A good RB only needs blocking, and even that some times isn't needed.

My point is that Marshawn Lynch doesn't need this mythical rhythm to be a damn good effective running back..

Enough with the excuses. Khiry Robinson apparently doesn't need Unicorn-rhythm.

Re: Mark ingram and running game
 

That's like saying that because Colin Kaepernick plays a team and throws a touchdown on the first play of the game, has a lot of success in the first quarter and Drew Brees struggles early, that Brees won't come on later, find a rhythm and win a game that Kaepernick would lose.

Playing RB isn't just grabbing the ball and running through a hole. Good running backs create holes, they maneuver their way through the defense. It's about knowing what's being offered and figuring out how to exploit it. Having multiple touches is going to affect the internal reasoning that you have as a RB when you approach a defense.

Re: Mark ingram and running game
 

QBs "rhythm" is not against defenses but with their receivers; snap, step, step, read, throw. Apples to oranges.

Yes, playing RB is about taking the hand-off and finding a hole. As far as the rest, you either have vision or you do not and it has nothing to do with rhythm.

Rhythm - a regular, repeated pattern of sounds or movements. : a regular, repeated pattern of events, changes, activities, etc.

There is no repetitive pattern in a football game for a RB. From where he lines up; to blocking, holes, defensive fronts, all change. Your more than welcome to keep replying, it will not effect the definition of rhythm or that it is a myth that RBs need it.

I realize you do not visit a whole lot but there is a thread on this already.. been discussed, been debunked.
http://blackandgold.com/saints/58685...hm-ingram.html

Re: Mark ingram and running game
 

That research is rather meaningless and has nothing to do with what people talk about when they say that Ingram needs to get into a rhythm.

The more times in a row a running back runs the football, the more likely it is for the defense to play the run.

There is a reason that we run the full back or do a QB sneak on 4th and 1, because they know the run is coming. With each successive run, a team is forced to play tighter defense. If anything, I'd like to see this research be taken and combined with passing the ball via play action after successive runs.

Re: Mark ingram and running game
 

Ingram definitely looks more confident..

Re: Mark ingram and running game
 

Are you changing you handle to markloose? :D

Re: Mark ingram and running game
 

ha lol knaa my toe hasn't had enough problems.

Re: Mark ingram and running game
 

he stepped up big time

Re: Mark ingram and running game
 

I agree Ingram seems to be seeing the holes much better. He doesn't seem to run up into the linemans back as much. Whatever the change, I'm glad he decided to start now and hope it continues.

Re: Mark ingram and running game
 

Maybe there saying that cause PT off the three or four is making the most cheese

Re: Mark ingram and running game
 

NOBODY runs screens as good as Pierre.

Re: Mark ingram and running game
 

Pierre Tied his season high 2009 rushing attempts with 147. Blew his receptions out of the water with 77.

However, the question still remains. Is he declining, playing hurt, offensive line not blocking... There is a reason.

3.7 YPC is an all time low for PT for his healthy seasons.
Pierre Thomas: Career Stats at NFL.com

Same story for Sproles
Darren Sproles: Career Stats at NFL.com

I am going to go with either age decline or o-line blocking.

Re: Mark ingram and running game
 

I took a while, but I am officially a big fan of Ingram now. He can see finally.

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Only problem is that the Hawks ate our screens alive.

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That first game, they ate everything alive... Hopefully we have a stronger O-Line this time around

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We just need all of our players to produce when called upon due to injury. Ingram did a good job of this. I don't think he will do the same against Seattle though. The eagles weren't ready for him. Seahawks will be.