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The Big 2014 Changes thread (Non Draft)

this is a discussion within the Saints Community Forum; I am on the fence about Ingram and it is not so much to do with past years or earlier this season. He has preformed well sinc3e the BYE week. A huge part of the reason we gave 6 "rock ...

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Old 01-13-2014, 09:39 AM   #11
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Re: The Big 2014 Changes thread (Non Draft)

I am on the fence about Ingram and it is not so much to do with past years or earlier this season. He has preformed well sinc3e the BYE week.

A huge part of the reason we gave 6 "rock toaters" on the roster is because of injury. Ingram has recurring plantar fasciitis (Turf Toe). It pulled him out of the line up in 2011 and 2013.

I trust mark Ingram more than I trust his foot, and if we are going to carry depth as deep as we do, it shouldn't be at RB.
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Old 01-13-2014, 10:02 AM   #12
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Re: The Big 2014 Changes thread (Non Draft)

Turn our O into a potent ground and pound team, beef up the O-line let Robinson, Ingram tote the rock, let Graham walk and get a TE like Dallas Clark type to take his place (you would never know Graham was gone), get a speedster in to go with Stills and one to take Moores place and let Brees manage the game. I love the circus high-wire passing attack when it worked but it aint' there no more., time for sound, hard-nose football,it has endless possibilities with Brees at the helm and would keep him up-right the majority of the time.
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Old 01-13-2014, 10:07 AM   #13
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Re: The Big 2014 Changes thread (Non Draft)

Originally Posted by halloween 65 View Post
Turn our O into a potent ground and pound team, beef up the O-line let Robinson, Ingram tote the rock, let Graham walk and get a TE like Dallas Clark type to take his place, get a speedster in to go with stills and one to take Moores place and let Brees manage the game. I love the circus high-wire passing attack when it worked but it aint' there no more., time for sound, hard-nose football,it has endless possibilities with Brees at the helm and would keep him up-right the majority of the time.
Yep, build the 2009 team but this go round, one hell of a lot better defense. Most seem to forget our best TE in 2009 was Shockey
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Old 01-13-2014, 10:22 AM   #14
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Re: The Big 2014 Changes thread (Non Draft)

Originally Posted by lee909 View Post
Having a look at this bwhile pretending to work.


Keep

QB
Brees 18.4
Griffin 0.495

RB
Ingram 2.4
Robinson 0.495

WR
Colston 8.3 (cut in 2015/16 for savings off 4.3/7.8 after dead money)
Stills 0.540
Toon 0.671

TE
Hill 0.495
Watson 1.7

O-Line
Evans 11 (cuts restructure next year saving 6ml after dead money in 2015)

Grubbs 9.1 (cuts restructure next year saving 3.6/7.3ml after dead money in 2015/16)

Armstead 0.68
Lelito 0.495
Drescher 0.875

P
Moorstead 3.3

Dead Money
Moore 2.5
Sproles 0.75
Thomas 0

Breakdown per position

QB 18.895ml
RB 2.895
WR 9.511
TE 2.195
OL 22.151
P 3.3
Dead 3.3ml

Total $62ml

Would be in need of a starting RT, C and WR/TE as well as depth.


Defense

DB
K Lewis 4.5
Vaccaro 2.1
C White 0.614
Peterson 2.39

DL
Bunkley 6.1
Jordan 2.4
Hicks 0.718
J Jenkins 0.656
Foster 0.497
Walker 0.571

LB
Lofton 5.2
Hawthorne 3.5
Galette 2.9
Butler 1.8
Reddick 0.496
R Johnson 0.420

Cuts Dead money

W Smith DM 2.35
J Greer DM 2.65 (save 3.175ml)
R Harper DM 3.69 (save 2.1)


Totals
DB $9.604
LB $ 14.316
DL $10.942
Dead 8.69

Defense $43.552
Offense $63ml

Total 106.5ml
Leaves around $20ml to resign players on tenders/contracts etc and FA/draft.

Id take Greer, Moore one of Harper/Jenkins for the right money. Not as bad as the media have made it out to be.



A fee figures could be off as m working and Moore, Sproles could even be traded.
Who is Peterson? Is this a rookie you propose we draft?
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Old 01-13-2014, 10:24 AM   #15
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Re: The Big 2014 Changes thread (Non Draft)

Sorry meant Robinson, brain fart or auto correct im not sure.Id swap him for Patrick Peterson mind you
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Old 01-13-2014, 10:48 AM   #16
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Re: The Big 2014 Changes thread (Non Draft)

QB-Restructure Brees, promote Griffin to #2, say goodbye to McCown

RB-I agree with letting Sproles go. I would also let Ingram go, nothing against him or his performance but his contract is too much for a relatively one-dimensional back. We should be able to get good value for both guys in trades. I would keep Thomas, Robinson and draft Jeremy Hill or somebody like him (and I'm no LSU fan but that guy is a freaking stud). Cadet can go as well, he's been a waste of a roster spot.

FB-keep Collins

WR-Let Moore go, love the guy, he costs too much and Stills is the same player but younger and cheaper. Meachem is fairly dependable, a good blocker and cheap. Keep Colston/Stills/Meachem/Toon/Morgan. If Joe Morgan can still play he's in the mix for a big role. I also think we might see Tanner making moves, he could contribute as a slot guy and would not be any kind of downgrade from Moore this year. Colston's knees are the big question mark to me here. If he is 100% we are good to go here.

TE-Sign Graham long-term, keep Watson he's good. Hill should have a bigger role, he looks like a good young player.

OL-Restructure Grubbs, he is not worth 1/3 of his salary. Draft a center to compete with DLP. Otherwise keep everything about the same in the starting 5. Brown may not have cut it as a starter but he is good cheap depth and can play either tackle. Harris and Lelito also look like good depth guys. Our OL struggles this year had nothing to do with lack of talent, they had to do with new coach/new scheme and facing an inordinate amount of really good defensive lines. Don't overreact. We have good guys on the OL.

DL-Looks good, keep the same guys, maybe draft a pass rush type another in the Foster/Walker mold and let T. Johnson go.

LB-Hawthorne/Lofton are great run defenders but lack a little bit of speed sideline to sideline. But I'm not sure this is a position you want to get too gung-ho about "upgrading" because you might end up regretting it. Humber and Reddick need more playing time IMO. Galette/Haralson/Butler should be a fine rotation on the outside.

CB-Let Greer go, love him but see Lance Moore situation. Lewis/Robinson/White is a fine starting point, draft a couple young guys and see who turns out. We could use a true nickel/slot guy in the Greer mold, somebody who is more agile and quick to cover those little squirt receivers that give us trouble sometimes.

S-Keep either Harper or Jenkins, let the other go. Bush and Vaccaro are your starters. We could also see White in the mix at safety but that would necessitate finding another corner.

ST-Keep Graham for another year, he's fine. Need changes on STs in general when it comes to kicking and returns. Coverage teams are pretty much OK, could use a little more youth/speed though.


In summary basically I don't think we need much change. We need Brees to get his act together and be in top form next year. We need some young guys to continue developing and take on bigger roles. And we need to shake some thing up on offense, that means work on schemes and playbooks, not necessarily blowing it up personnel wise.

Money-wise, I looked at the numbers a few weeks back and we're in OK shape with the Smith cut and Brees restructure. A few more moves (Greer, Moore, Sproles, restructuring of a couple more big deals) gives us plenty of wiggle room to re-sign Graham and others and maybe even look at some outside free agents. Not worried about cap room, it's not even an issue.
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Old 01-13-2014, 11:06 AM   #17
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Re: The Big 2014 Changes thread (Non Draft)

Originally Posted by Jack Vegas View Post
QB-Restructure Brees, promote Griffin to #2, say goodbye to McCown

RB-I agree with letting Sproles go. I would also let Ingram go, nothing against him or his performance but his contract is too much for a relatively one-dimensional back. I would keep Thomas, Robinson and draft Jeremy Hill or somebody like him (and I'm no LSU fan but that guy is a freaking stud).

FB-keep Collins

WR-Let Moore go, love the guy, he costs too much and Stills is the same player but younger and cheaper. Meachem is fairly dependable, a good blocker and cheap. Keep Colston/Stills/Meachem/Toon/Morgan. If Joe Morgan can still play he's in the mix for a big role. Colston's knees are the big question mark to me here. If he is 100% we are good to go here.

TE-Sign Graham long-term, keep Watson he's good. Hill should have a bigger role, he looks like a good young player.

OL-Restructure Grubbs, he is not worth 1/3 of his salary. Draft a center to compete with DLP. Otherwise keep everything about the same in the starting 5. Brown may not have cut it as a starter but he is good cheap depth and can play either tackle. Harris and Lelito also look like good depth guys. Our OL struggles this year had nothing to do with lack of talent, they had to do with new coach/new scheme and facing an inordinate amount of really good defensive lines. Don't overreact. We have good guys on the OL.

DL-Looks good, keep the same guys, maybe draft a pass rush type another in the Foster/Walker mold and let T. Johnson go.

LB-Hawthorne/Lofton are great run defenders but lack a little bit of speed sideline to sideline. But I'm not sure this is a position you want to get too gung-ho about "upgrading" because you might end up regretting it. Galette/Haralson/Butler should be a fine rotation on the outside.

CB-Let Greer go, love him but see Lance Moore situation. Lewis/Robinson/White is a fine starting point, draft a couple young guys and see who turns out. We could use a true nickel/slot guy in the Greer mold, somebody who is more agile and quick to cover those little squirt receivers that give us trouble sometimes.

S-Keep either Harper or Jenkins, let the other go. Bush and Vaccaro are your starters. We could also see White in the mix at safety but that would necessitate finding another corner.

ST-Keep Graham for another year, he's fine. Need changes on STs in general when it comes to kicking and returns. Coverage teams are pretty much OK, could use a little more youth/speed though.


In summary basically I don't think we need much change. We need Brees to get his act together and be in top form next year. We need some young guys to continue developing and take on bigger roles. And we need to shake some thing up on offense, that means work on schemes and playbooks, not necessarily blowing it up personnel wise.

Money-wise, I looked at the numbers a few weeks back and we're in OK shape with the Smith cut and Brees restructure. A few more moves (Greer, Moore, Sproles, restructuring of a couple more big deals) gives us plenty of wiggle room to re-sign Graham and others and maybe even look at some outside free agents. Not worried about cap room, it's not even an issue.
DLP is a free agent, you resigning him to bring on a +1 to compete with him?
Greer and Jenkins can both go, agreed.

Now after reading you are keeping as much depth as we have starters? As I read your reply we will have Grubbs, DLP, +1 C, Brown, Harris, Lelito, Evans, Strief, Armstead, Nsekhe... Thats 10 offensive linemen, we only carried 8 this year.

No one in the organization has any leverage what so ever to force a restructure on Brees. I wouldn't factor it in to any equation, if it happens fine but there is nothing that can be done if he doesn't agree.

If you play stupid games, you win stupid prizes.

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Last edited by TheOak; 01-13-2014 at 11:09 AM..
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Old 01-13-2014, 11:08 AM   #18
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Re: The Big 2014 Changes thread (Non Draft)

We should also keep in mine that we have 3 players already signed to 2014.
Derrius Brooks CB
Derek Dimke Place Kicker
Nsekhe, Ty OT
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Old 01-13-2014, 11:15 AM   #19
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Re: The Big 2014 Changes thread (Non Draft)

Unless we feel 2014 is our last shot for a superbowl with Brees, this isn't the year he restructures. 2015 and 2016 is when he kills the cap. He needs to stay the same 2014 and restructure 2015. What we really need is upgrade at C and WR that will go over the middle and take a hit like Colston. Let Smith go and restructure a few others like Bunkley, Grubbs and Evans. RB's stay like they are, I believe Sproles is still suffering from his concussion which has made him a little tentative on returns. PT is still our best screen back. Ingram, Cadet and Robinson have all dropped potential big plays in the screen game. Meachem still has speed and great concentration on the football, he beat 2 guys in coverage and caught the tipped ball. I believe he stays at a reasonable price. Playcalling does need an overhaul.

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Old 01-13-2014, 11:34 AM   #20
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Re: The Big 2014 Changes thread (Non Draft)

We didn't have any success in passing until the 4th Qtr... Seattle went to prevent defense.

This one?
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