47 years ago today, the first New Orleans Saint was signed

hagan714 · 01-29-2014, 11:48 AM

at times he need a heck of a lot more. sorry i am an old timer and will always go down fighting when comes to archie and few other saints back then

RailBoss · 01-29-2014, 06:31 PM

I lived through the early days and when I see Archie on TV it always amazes me that he can walk straight. Watching Archie in those days was almost like watching Rocky getting beat up. To this day I will always support his kids as long as they are not playing against us. Oh and I almost punched out a grocery bagger back in New Jersey. Was wearing an old worn out Saints shirt and this dude proceeded to put a bag over his head and the fight was on. The generation of fans who came in around Mora's time probably could never believe how bleak things were early on.

WhoDat!656 · 01-29-2014, 07:11 PM

Originally Posted by TheOak

That is what I keep hearing and you can take it as you wish but I just do not see it. I see a lot of hypocrisy and misunderstanding when it comes to Archie and when compared to Drew coming from a passer stand point.

Fine, Archie got sacked a lot.

He didn't have the receivers.
He didn't pass as much and when he did he was an interception machine.

Completion % as a Saint
Archie 55.4
Drew 67.3

Interception %
Archie 4.7%
Drew 2.5%

If Archie has an offensive line he would have passed more and thrown more INTs.

Archie compared to Wilson.. Wilson was sacked more this season.
Archie Manning sack 9.3% INT% 4.7
Russell Wilson (2013) sack 9.8% INT 2.2%

If that doesn't clearly show what i am saying maybe this will.

Archie Manning as a Saint vs Oiler

Sack %
Saints 9.3%
Oilers 15.1%

INT%
Saints 4.7%
Oilers 6.6%

Archie got worse after he left the oh so horrible New Orleans Saints to go go the Houston Oilers... the Saints got better.

Minnesota before Manning 8-8, with Manning 3-13, after Manning 7-9
Houston Oilers before Manning 7-9, with Manning 1-8, after Manning 3-13

New Orleans Saints 1980/1981 with Manning 4-23
New Orleans Saints 1982/1983 with Stabler 11-11

I know i am committing a mortal and nonvenial sin but it was what it was.

How would any QB from any other team in that era have done playing for the Saints under the same exact conditions that Manning had to play under?

jeanpierre · 01-29-2014, 07:58 PM

Originally Posted by TheOak

I hunted with Hokie when I was 14.... I am very familiar with the Saints of the early 80s.

If you read my earlier post, I made a point that all the comments about all he needed was an offensive line were not so accurate.

What does "hunting with Hokie" have to do with watching the actual games and actually witnessing what was happening every week?!?

If it's ever available, geaux back and watch the games...

And it was a much different game then; comparing an aged, sick Archie finishing unceremoniously on the Oilers and Vikings with stats when he was younger and less "bruised" is illogical...

Utah_Saint · 01-29-2014, 08:00 PM

Originally Posted by TheOak

Minnesota before Manning 8-8, with Manning 3-13, after Manning 7-9
Houston Oilers before Manning 7-9, with Manning 1-8, after Manning 3-13

New Orleans Saints 1980/1981 with Manning 4-23
New Orleans Saints 1982/1983 with Stabler 11-11

On the other hand...

1970 Billy Kilmer with the Saints 2-9
1971 Billy Kilmer with the Redskins 8-4-1

maybe it was the Saints

hagan714 · 01-29-2014, 08:14 PM

go back and look at the roster in houston before and when manning arrived there. the city not just the fans was in an up roar over the manning trade. not that he got traded but traded to a team that was falling apart and heading south instead of a contender. it was unjust after all he did for the city and the team. that like trading Drew to the Jags. total disrespect.

MPLS out doors along with all the stadiums except detroit did little wonders for him. he was a shell of himself after the beating he took in houston and new orleans, kinda the same story line with pistol pete. by the time he got his shot at a ring he was a shell of his former self.

44Champs · 01-29-2014, 08:51 PM

Before there was Jerry Jones or Dan Snyder, there was John Mecom Jr, and unfortunately it was at his mercy that Archie was ultimately tied. I don't think it's fair to compare any other current or past QB to him. He had NOTHING for most of the time here except Muncie, Galbraeth and Brenner. The ONLY worthy O-lineman even worth mentioning was Conrad Dobler and he was torwards the end of his career. Maybe Stan Brock but I can't remember if Archie was already gone by then. Put in a crappy defense to boot then you have Archie always having to play catch up. I'm not saying he would've been better than Drew or any of his sons, but I'm saying that he would've had significantly more success if he would've been surrounded by more talent.

RailBoss · 01-30-2014, 01:01 AM

Indeed ! Listening to Drew talk about how much support Archie offered him was amazing. Archie bled Black & Gold literally!!

hagan714 · 01-30-2014, 04:07 AM

Muncie lmao the man with 1000 reasons not to make it to the airport to fly with the team. what a waste of talent

jeanpierre · 01-30-2014, 05:07 AM

Understand Business can be a cold-blooded, jealous mistress...

And I don't like to say this idly...

But for me, Archie Manning being traded was personal, and I've hated Bum Phillips every since then...

01-29-2014, 11:48 AM	#11
hagan714 LB Mentallity Join Date: Dec 2005 Posts: 15,870 Blog Entries: 68	Re: 47 years ago today, the first New Orleans Saint was signed at times he need a heck of a lot more. sorry i am an old timer and will always go down fighting when comes to archie and few other saints back then RailBoss, jeanpierre, WhoDat!656 and 1 others like this.

01-29-2014, 06:31 PM	#12
RailBoss 5000 POSTS! + Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: South Of The Mason Dixon Line Posts: 7,113	Re: 47 years ago today, the first New Orleans Saint was signed I lived through the early days and when I see Archie on TV it always amazes me that he can walk straight. Watching Archie in those days was almost like watching Rocky getting beat up. To this day I will always support his kids as long as they are not playing against us. Oh and I almost punched out a grocery bagger back in New Jersey. Was wearing an old worn out Saints shirt and this dude proceeded to put a bag over his head and the fight was on. The generation of fans who came in around Mora's time probably could never believe how bleak things were early on. jeanpierre and Rickh like this.

01-29-2014, 07:11 PM	#13
WhoDat!656 10000 POST CLUB Join Date: Nov 2010 Location: Shreveport,Louisiana Posts: 16,001	Re: 47 years ago today, the first New Orleans Saint was signed Originally Posted by TheOak That is what I keep hearing and you can take it as you wish but I just do not see it. I see a lot of hypocrisy and misunderstanding when it comes to Archie and when compared to Drew coming from a passer stand point. Fine, Archie got sacked a lot. He didn't have the receivers. He didn't pass as much and when he did he was an interception machine. Completion % as a Saint Archie 55.4 Drew 67.3 Interception % Archie 4.7% Drew 2.5% If Archie has an offensive line he would have passed more and thrown more INTs. Archie compared to Wilson.. Wilson was sacked more this season. Archie Manning sack 9.3% INT% 4.7 Russell Wilson (2013) sack 9.8% INT 2.2% If that doesn't clearly show what i am saying maybe this will. Archie Manning as a Saint vs Oiler Sack % Saints 9.3% Oilers 15.1% INT% Saints 4.7% Oilers 6.6% Archie got worse after he left the oh so horrible New Orleans Saints to go go the Houston Oilers... the Saints got better. Minnesota before Manning 8-8, with Manning 3-13, after Manning 7-9 Houston Oilers before Manning 7-9, with Manning 1-8, after Manning 3-13 New Orleans Saints 1980/1981 with Manning 4-23 New Orleans Saints 1982/1983 with Stabler 11-11 I know i am committing a mortal and nonvenial sin but it was what it was. How would any QB from any other team in that era have done playing for the Saints under the same exact conditions that Manning had to play under?

01-29-2014, 07:58 PM	#14
jeanpierre Site Donor 2018 Join Date: Mar 2008 Location: Thibodaux Posts: 43,543 Blog Entries: 39	Re: 47 years ago today, the first New Orleans Saint was signed Originally Posted by TheOak I hunted with Hokie when I was 14.... I am very familiar with the Saints of the early 80s. If you read my earlier post, I made a point that all the comments about all he needed was an offensive line were not so accurate. What does "hunting with Hokie" have to do with watching the actual games and actually witnessing what was happening every week?!? If it's ever available, geaux back and watch the games... And it was a much different game then; comparing an aged, sick Archie finishing unceremoniously on the Oilers and Vikings with stats when he was younger and less "bruised" is illogical...
	Last edited by jeanpierre; 01-29-2014 at 08:03 PM..

01-29-2014, 08:00 PM	#15
Utah_Saint Site Donor 2019 Join Date: Jan 2012 Location: Salt Lake City, Utah Posts: 3,521	Re: 47 years ago today, the first New Orleans Saint was signed Originally Posted by TheOak Minnesota before Manning 8-8, with Manning 3-13, after Manning 7-9 Houston Oilers before Manning 7-9, with Manning 1-8, after Manning 3-13 New Orleans Saints 1980/1981 with Manning 4-23 New Orleans Saints 1982/1983 with Stabler 11-11 On the other hand... 1970 Billy Kilmer with the Saints 2-9 1971 Billy Kilmer with the Redskins 8-4-1 maybe it was the Saints

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01-29-2014, 08:14 PM	#16
hagan714 LB Mentallity Join Date: Dec 2005 Posts: 15,870 Blog Entries: 68	Re: 47 years ago today, the first New Orleans Saint was signed go back and look at the roster in houston before and when manning arrived there. the city not just the fans was in an up roar over the manning trade. not that he got traded but traded to a team that was falling apart and heading south instead of a contender. it was unjust after all he did for the city and the team. that like trading Drew to the Jags. total disrespect. MPLS out doors along with all the stadiums except detroit did little wonders for him. he was a shell of himself after the beating he took in houston and new orleans, kinda the same story line with pistol pete. by the time he got his shot at a ring he was a shell of his former self. jeanpierre likes this.
	"We may have lost the game, but you'll be hurting tomorrow." Doug Atkins

01-29-2014, 08:51 PM	#17
44Champs Site Donor Join Date: Dec 2010 Posts: 2,589	Re: 47 years ago today, the first New Orleans Saint was signed Before there was Jerry Jones or Dan Snyder, there was John Mecom Jr, and unfortunately it was at his mercy that Archie was ultimately tied. I don't think it's fair to compare any other current or past QB to him. He had NOTHING for most of the time here except Muncie, Galbraeth and Brenner. The ONLY worthy O-lineman even worth mentioning was Conrad Dobler and he was torwards the end of his career. Maybe Stan Brock but I can't remember if Archie was already gone by then. Put in a crappy defense to boot then you have Archie always having to play catch up. I'm not saying he would've been better than Drew or any of his sons, but I'm saying that he would've had significantly more success if he would've been surrounded by more talent. hagan714 and jeanpierre like this.
44Champs Site Donor Join Date: Dec 2010 Posts: 2,589

01-30-2014, 01:01 AM	#18
RailBoss 5000 POSTS! + Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: South Of The Mason Dixon Line Posts: 7,113	Re: 47 years ago today, the first New Orleans Saint was signed Indeed ! Listening to Drew talk about how much support Archie offered him was amazing. Archie bled Black & Gold literally!! hagan714 and jeanpierre like this.

01-30-2014, 04:07 AM	#19
hagan714 LB Mentallity Join Date: Dec 2005 Posts: 15,870 Blog Entries: 68	Re: 47 years ago today, the first New Orleans Saint was signed Muncie lmao the man with 1000 reasons not to make it to the airport to fly with the team. what a waste of talent

01-30-2014, 05:07 AM	#20
jeanpierre Site Donor 2018 Join Date: Mar 2008 Location: Thibodaux Posts: 43,543 Blog Entries: 39	Re: 47 years ago today, the first New Orleans Saint was signed Understand Business can be a cold-blooded, jealous mistress... And I don't like to say this idly... But for me, Archie Manning being traded was personal, and I've hated Bum Phillips every since then... Boutte likes this.

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