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KC beat us and we still won...

this is a discussion within the Saints Community Forum; Can you honestly say you would pull for the Saints to lose and finish 7-9? Honestly, very hard to say. Normally, absolutely not, but in this case I want Haslett out so bad I think I might root against my ...

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Old 11-17-2004, 06:47 PM   #61
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KC beat us and we still won...

Can you honestly say you would pull for the Saints to lose and finish 7-9?
Honestly, very hard to say. Normally, absolutely not, but in this case I want Haslett out so bad I think I might root against my boys.

I understand why this is perplexing - even I have a very hard time rooting against the Saints and rarely actually do so in-game. It\'s not about what I WANT in my heart, but about what my head tells me the team NEEDS.

Let me give you an analogy similar to your hypothetical. I hesitate to post this, so before I start let me say that I don\'t want to belittle the war in Iraq in any way shape or form. I use it only as an illustration.

Danno - if you were an Iraqi when or even just before America attacked. If you had been dealing with the same old oppressive treatment for years, would you still \"root\" for your country? Sure, Hussein is an a$$hole, but it seems to me that the Americans are gonna take him out. In the meantime, I\'m an Iraqi. I\'m going to root for my country. Maybe we can win a few and kill or mame a few foriegn soldiers before a change is made. That\'s in essence what you\'re saying here. Sure Haslett is a bum. Yes I want him and the rest of the coaches gone. But in the meantime, if the team can find a way to make them look good and give people hope, why not? Well, b/c maybe he\'ll end up staying if that happens, and the change that could really happen won\'t. That\'s why not.

\"Excuses, excuses, excuses. That’s all anyone ever makes for the New Orleans Saints’ organization.\" - Eric Narcisse


\"Being a Saints fan is almost like being addicted to crack,\"
he said.[i]\"You know you should stop, but you just can\'t.\"
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Old 11-18-2004, 08:03 AM   #62
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KC beat us and we still won...

Sure, I\'ll accept that. Good analogy. Both groups want to see an end to the madness. Both are right when they say the issue is being mismanaged. Both groups want change for the better, not more of the same old same old. And I would say JH is very similar to Georgie-boy. Can\'t answer a straight question - ususally \"just doesn\'t get it\" - lies blatantly to the people (Iraq has weapons of mass destruction :: There is nothing wrong with AB\'s arm) - and generally preaches blind faith behind the wall of a huge propoganda machine despite every indication that things are no where near as peachy as he says they are. You\'re right, it\'s very similar.

That\'s enough of this though. I don\'t want this to descend into a political debate. Let\'s just say I\'m for change and you\'ll root for the team no matter what. Is that fair?

\"Excuses, excuses, excuses. That’s all anyone ever makes for the New Orleans Saints’ organization.\" - Eric Narcisse


\"Being a Saints fan is almost like being addicted to crack,\"
he said.[i]\"You know you should stop, but you just can\'t.\"
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Old 11-18-2004, 09:04 AM   #63
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KC beat us and we still won...

This debate is getting perilously close to the place where arguments happen. I have a new spin, that incorporates much of the essentials of your analogy Who, but adds a few wrinkles that make it more robust. Let\'s consider the paradigm of a business that makes products that are designed to make it\'s customers happy, while continuing to make product innovations to keep pace with the market.
Now, for some time there has been grumbling that your customers are not happy with your product. You have added new features to it, often ones that market research has indicated were favorable, to try to raise the appeal of your product. Still no change.
However people still seem to be buying the product, they just don\'t like it anymore. On closer inspection it appears that the factory is fine, a bit old but serviceable. The raw materials are being brought in to the warehouse, there is a consistent effort to bring in shop floor workers, who on paper seem to be perfect for the job. Here is where the breakdown occurs.
The training department gives the new employee a garbled job description, he scratches his head but goes on, after basic training he\'s brought to his department. He meets his supervisor who doesn\'t impress him too much, as soon as the supe turns his back his fellow workers tell him that the guy\'s a crackpot who just brownnoses the production manager. Respect is quickly getting lost.
Meanwhile,the production manager is being told that the new recruit is gonna take some work. This buys the supe some time. As the recruit begins to grow roots in the company he becomes entrenched in his dislike of the dumb supe, a pattern emerges for the company, if they want a good worker they have to head hunt because they can\'t seem to develop new workers.
Despite all of this, the company ships it\'s product half-assed with faulty packaging, and half full palettes. Lo and behold the vast majority continue to buy it. Now the company would like to build a new factory, and they are locked in a debate over how much they should have to pay for the improvements.
This is roughly where we are now. Within this analogy there are multiple changes that can be affected, who is to blame? where does the company go from here? remember the idea is not just to sell the product, it is to have the product be respected and constantly evolving to keep pace with change.

[Edited on 18/11/2004 by johnnythesaint]

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Old 11-18-2004, 10:51 AM   #64
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KC beat us and we still won...

And I would say JH is very similar to Georgie-boy. lies blatantly to the people (Iraq has weapons of mass destruction :: There is nothing wrong with AB\'s arm) - and generally preaches blind faith behind the wall of a huge propoganda machine despite every indication that things are no where near as peachy as he says they are. You\'re right, it\'s very similar.
Not so fast frenchie...
Show me where he lied. Show me. You can\'t do it.
Because everyone acknowledged (including demoncrats) that he DID have them. Then he was given 14 months to hide material THAT COULD FIT IN A TRACTOR TRAILER, in a country larger than California. Now some clueless idiots want to claim he lied.

ABSOLUTELY PATHETIC. No wonder Kerry and the rest of the demoncrats got their asses kicked.
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Old 11-18-2004, 01:28 PM   #65
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KC beat us and we still won...

How soon we forget. NO POLITICS!!! Please keep politics out of the forum. This side is for football. I don\'t want to have to lock this thread.
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Old 11-18-2004, 03:08 PM   #66
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KC beat us and we still won...

LOL - I agree Joe. AB\'s arm really was fine. LMAO.
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Old 11-18-2004, 03:38 PM   #67
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KC beat us and we still won...

This is a heavy duty warning shot over the heads of WhoDat and Danno. Read the forum rules - no political debates at all.

Consider a magic cyber buillet just flew over your heads.

Everyone is tired of that debate also, and it\' breaks our rules.
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Old 11-19-2004, 12:26 AM   #68
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KC beat us and we still won...

I like your analogy, johnny, nicely thought out. In light of recent events, I just hope our little company doesn\'t get outsourced...

Geaux Saints ... but not away!
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Old 11-19-2004, 01:54 AM   #69
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KC beat us and we still won...

I didn\'t want to have to say it, but I will: let this thread die! There was some interesting discussion here, but it has since passed. Don\'t make me beat you with my eyes
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Old 11-19-2004, 07:45 AM   #70
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KC beat us and we still won...

Before you let it die, I would like to add my $.02. It wasn\'t an ugly win to me, because I didn\'t watch it...it was just a win. I am extremely pleased with that. I will take 7 more just like it in a heart beat, and I am not worried about the Saints getting into the playoffs and stinking it up...at least I will be sitting down some afternoon in the near future awaiting another Saint playoff game kickoff. That would be enough for me....anything beyond that would be gravy, and I do like gravy.

Whether you think you can or think you can't...you're right!
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