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Same... Old... Saints...

this is a discussion within the Saints Community Forum; Sorry Whodat, my heart was still pumpin about 140 beats per minute when I wrote that. Still can\'t believe the most unlikely of all 3 games happened. 1. We beat Carolina. I didn\'t think we would. 2. Washington beat the ...

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Old 01-03-2005, 06:36 AM   #11
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Same... Old... Saints...

Sorry Whodat, my heart was still pumpin about 140 beats per minute when I wrote that.

Still can\'t believe the most unlikely of all 3 games happened.
1. We beat Carolina. I didn\'t think we would.
2. Washington beat the Vikes.
3. St Louis beats the Jets.

In a way you are right, that is EXACTLY the same old Saints.
But usually every thing falls in to place for us and WE choke away a playoff spot.

Done in by a Rams FG, again.
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Old 01-03-2005, 08:12 AM   #12
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It sucks, no doubt. I felt sick to my stomach watching that Rams game. I didn\'t realize Doug Brien was kicking for the Jets, but the second I heard his name I knew he\'d miss. An ex-Saint could never do anything to help his former team.

Of course, there were 8 games this year where a little better effort makes all the difference. The Saints have no one to blame but themselves... again. Haslett has yet to go better than 3-5 in at least one half of any full season in the last 4 at least. That\'s crap.

In any case, my prediction from above is that many Saints fans will kick the ground and say aw shucks. They\'ll blame the stupid Rams or Vikings or the NFL for crazy tie-breaker rules. They\'ll say that the Saints did everything they could and it\'s not their fault. It is their fault. They went 8-8. They had the worst defense in the NFL. At one point we were talking about the Saints being nearly as bad as SF and Miami.

As you pointed out, nearly everyone on this board said they would be screaming for Haslett\'s head if the Saints didn\'t make the playoffs this year. Well, they didn\'t, and I don\'t expect to hear much screaming.

\"Excuses, excuses, excuses. That’s all anyone ever makes for the New Orleans Saints’ organization.\" - Eric Narcisse


\"Being a Saints fan is almost like being addicted to crack,\"
he said.[i]\"You know you should stop, but you just can\'t.\"
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Old 01-03-2005, 08:49 AM   #13
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Same... Old... Saints...

Still can\'t believe the most unlikely of all 3 games happened.
1. We beat Carolina. I didn\'t think we would.
2. Washington beat the Vikes.
3. St Louis beats the Jets.

In a way you are right, that is EXACTLY the same old Saints.

Done in by a Rams FG, again.
We are, by the hardest, 8-8 AGAIN!!!!! What is wrong here is that we were relying on a loss by some team rather than relying on a high W-L record like Pittsburg, Philly, Atlanta. We have seen 4 back to back seasons that revolve around 8-8. The only reason that we ARE 8-8 is the outstanding evolvement of Fakir Brown and Mike McKenzie. I believe that this will be looked at as the best personnel move made by New Orleans in a while. The thing to be careful about is that LOOMBOOM doesn\'t try to get creative with the contract and annoy McKenzie into a position like he faced in GB.

Brooks has to go. LoomBoom, McCarthy, and Moss have to go. Venturi needs to be demoted to a position coach. The draft needs to center around getting one or two beast O-tackles. And we need to seriously look to get someone here who is a free agent leader at QB.

I believe the reason that we won out though is McKenzie and Grant. Grant is the captain of the defense. But his play steps up a notch with McKenzie because he can concentrate on line play. Watson, and Bockwaldt are going to be outstanding, with a decent LB coach. Also, T-Jones is kicking it up a notch with his play. He should have a great year with McKenzie. This guy is the missing piece. Defense should not be a huge problem next year.

Again, Brooks needs to go. Whether or not you like or dislike him, he has said and done things this season that are enough to alienate both fans and team members alike. So, begone and do well.
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Old 01-03-2005, 12:28 PM   #14
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Same... Old... Saints...

With the luxury of a rare walk around Audubon Park to soothe my battered psyche, I sank deep into the reflection of the Saints\' season in the waters of the lagoon.

Lagoon. Thick. Murky. Lifeless.

Maybe there\'s an insight here. The only sign of life the organisation showed occured when there was an enemy. Amazingly, the enemy was the Owner and the GM!! The late burst of energy predictably smothered in the decay of rotting expectations. Lagoons dam themselves up. Or should it be damn.

It is more than obvious that the loose collection of individuals that call themselves the Saints need leadership. They need a uniting force that inspires the breakthrough of the dam. They need to have more to motivate them than the satisfaction of sticking their toungues out at each other and saying. \"SEE! you didn\'t think we could even get this far!\".

When they haven\'t really gone anywhere and the effort didn\'t lead to anything, just like a lagoon.

Calvin: "I wish I was a Tiger."
Hobbes: "Common lament."
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Old 01-03-2005, 12:46 PM   #15
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Same... Old... Saints...

While I am disappointed in the season --- and I certainly think that the late season surge is/was overated for what it worth -- I must say that I at least have seen some positives which were not there earlier and are reasons to believe we have something to build on. We have a couple of star defensive players to anchor around -- Grant was super this year -- the addition of McKenzie is something to applaud --- Will Smith looks like he will blossom into a great defensive player -- the young linebackers look to have potential == Tebucky certainly played a lot better this year and if he improves as much next year as he did this year he may be a top safety in the league. All in all a lot more to be thankful for than our defensive ranking may lead you.

\"I have a photographic memory -- I just don\'t have any film.\"
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Old 01-03-2005, 04:48 PM   #16
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Same... Old... Saints...

Defense is solid and with a few players at lb and safety could be really special. I was all for trading Howard before but only if it bring us A)another good corner B) a good linebacker or C) a late first or high second draft pick. If not keep him. He was dominant when he played.

I agree with RDOX, Brooks has to go, Carolina game aside. It was obvious by the crickets chirping at his impromptu speech to the team before the Carolina game that he has alienated himself from the team. And his \"I am a great qb, my team is inconsistent and struggling,\" should have whoever is GM on the phone as soon as a trade can be made. He has to go.
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Old 01-04-2005, 01:04 PM   #17
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Same... Old... Saints...

I\'m disapppointed we didn\'t make the playoffs... BUT ...

I don\'t think there\'s too many teams who were playing better than the Saints as of late.

Further, our defense, has shown SIGNIFICANT sings of improvement. Just ask Jake Delhomme and the Carolina Panthers. Over the last 4-weeks, no runningback has rushed for over 100-yards. And our pass rush is killing QBs.

The main reason our offense has been inconsistent this year is because Deuce was hurt for most of the season. And our offensive line didin\'t help him much either. That\'s not the only reason, but it is the MAIN reason.

WhoDat is all for change with NO plan of who should be the next coach.

Who\'s to say the next guy won\'t be worse?

Winnning the last 4 games, to me, is a springboard to next year.

A couple of years ago Carolina made a late season surge and the next year they were in the Super Bowl.

WhoDat, along with many others, gave the Saints NO chance of beating the Jake and the Panthers. We\'ll we dominated the Panthers and some really don\'t like Haz and the Saints proved them wrong.

Some folks will never give credit where credit is due.

I think we finially have the players on defense to be very good. Yeah, it\'s taken longer than I would have liked. But, I damn sure ain\'t ready to make a change just for changes sake.



[Edited on 4/1/2005 by GumboBC]
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Old 01-04-2005, 01:19 PM   #18
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Same... Old... Saints...

I\'m disapppointed we didn\'t make the playoffs... BUT ...

I don\'t think there\'s too many teams who were playing better than the Saints as of late.

Further, our defense, has shown SIGNIFICANT sings of improvement. Just ask Jake Delhomme and the Carolina Panthers. Over the last 4-weeks, no runningback has rushed for over 100-yards. And our pass rush is killing QBs.

The main reason our offense has been inconsistent this year is because Deuce was hurt for most of the season. And our offensive line didin\'t help him much either. That\'s not the only reason, but it is the MAIN reason.

WhoDat is all for change with NO plan of who should be the next coach.

Who\'s to say the next guy won\'t be worse?

Winnning the last 4 games, to me, is a springboard to next year.

A couple of years ago Carolina made a late season surge and the next year they were in the Super Bowl.

WhoDat, along with many others, gave the Saints NO chance of beating the Jake and the Panthers. We\'ll we dominated the Panthers and some really don\'t like Haz and the Saints proved them wrong.

Some folks will never give credit where credit is due.

I think we finially have the players on defense to be very good. Yeah, it\'s taken longer than I would have liked. But, I damn sure ain\'t ready to make a change just for changes sake.



[Edited on 4/1/2005 by GumboBC]

Well put...bravo


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Old 01-04-2005, 03:04 PM   #19
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Same... Old... Saints...

WhoDat is all for change with NO plan of who should be the next coach.

Who\'s to say the next guy won\'t be worse?

Winnning the last 4 games, to me, is a springboard to next year.
Hey Danno, please take note. This is what I\'m talking about when I say some people are happy with mediocrity. Notice Billy didn\'t say we could be better - no he said it may get worse. That\'s fear - better to be average than deal with being bad to be good.

I\'ve been called pessimistic by Billy and others time and again. Mainly b/c I\'ve criticized this coaching staff and Aaron Brooks. In 2001 and early 2002 I was just a guy with a grudge against Brooks. By last season I was the most pessimistic person Billy and SF had ever met. Why? B/c I predicted this team would go 8-8 or 9-7. How can you be a pessimist when your assessment is right?

I knew people, especially Billy, would point to the late season indicators and, as always, \"rationalize\". It\'s amazing that some people can\'t remember longer than a few games ago.

Hey Billy, how did the Saints finish last season? Did they go 5-3 in the second half of the season? Did the defense, despite a slew of injuries finish 18th in the league (14 spots better than this year mind you)? Did Deuce have his best season ever finishing, what, second in the NFC in rushing? Did Brooks have his best numbers ever? The answer to all of those questions is yes. How did this season turn out?

I\'ve suggested ways this team could get better through coaching and personnel changes all season long. I don\'t have to recite them again for you b/c you weren\'t around the board when the Saints were 4-8. Funny how you showed up in the last two weeks again, bold as ever.

\"Excuses, excuses, excuses. That’s all anyone ever makes for the New Orleans Saints’ organization.\" - Eric Narcisse


\"Being a Saints fan is almost like being addicted to crack,\"
he said.[i]\"You know you should stop, but you just can\'t.\"
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Old 01-04-2005, 03:23 PM   #20
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Same... Old... Saints...

Oh, and Billy, before we go too much further with this, I\'d just like to remind you of a few of your comments from the 2004 offseason and preseason... and even early regular season.

6/22
http://www.blackandgold.net/site/mod...=5221#pid27779

Although I\'ve said something to this effect before, I want to give WhoDat his just due.

WhoDat and myself often get in some spirited debates on a variety of topics. Neither one of us usually concede too much in our beliefs and a lot of the things we argue about can\'t be proven until enough time has passed to have sufficient evidence.

Well, one of the things WhoDat told me last year is that Haslett was a major problem and because of that he didn\'t have a lot of faith in the 2003 season. I agrued and argued with WhoDat that he was wrong. And this went on for a while.

Now, I must be a man and admit the one that was wrong was ME.

I\'m now seeing things exactly like WhoDat saw them last year as far as Haslett is concerned.

I suppose the reason I didn\'t see it last year was because of how great the team had started out the past couple of years and I wanted to believe the late season collapses were not the fault of Haslett. I now think otherwise.

This is not to say that I think everything has been Hasletts fault and I don\'t think WhoDat is suggesting that either. But, it now seems so clear to me that Haslett has made a lot of mistakes. Mistakes that just can\'t be dismissed.

Anyway, WhoDat, I\'ll concede this one to you. I don\'t mind admitting I was wrong. I just hope Haslett can turn things around because at this point he worries me more than anything else.

8/26
http://www.blackandgold.net/site/mod...=5907#pid30875

If you really look at what WhoDat has said, it\'s not much different that last year. I think he\'s a LITTLE more optimistic than last year, but he\'s said he wouldn\'t be surprised to see an 8-8 finish. ...


2. All Brooks needs to do is play like last year minus the fumbles and it should be good enough to get us to the playoffs.

8/27
http://www.blackandgold.net/site/mod...=5967#pid30988

So, there\'s plenty of room for improvement. The bad news is we are depending on Venturi and Haslett for those improvement. Not good.

9/21
http://www.blackandgold.net/site/mod...d&tid=6331#pid

As optimistic as I am, I have little faith in this team until Haslett and co. are fired.

I hope I\'m proved wrong, but after all these years of watching the same problems over and over, I\'ve had enough.
So, my question to you then, is what did you see this season that made you change your mind about Haslett and Co.? What about this season makes you think that they deserve to stay? You do realize that you\'re now on your third opinion about Haslett in less than two years right? Great coach, bad coach, good enough to stay....

\"Excuses, excuses, excuses. That’s all anyone ever makes for the New Orleans Saints’ organization.\" - Eric Narcisse


\"Being a Saints fan is almost like being addicted to crack,\"
he said.[i]\"You know you should stop, but you just can\'t.\"
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