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The Decline and Fall of Paytonís Empire, or How the Culture of Gregg Williams Ruined the Saints

this is a discussion within the Saints Community Forum; Originally Posted by Danno True, its not about the guys we let go nearly as much as it is about the guys that are currently on the roster that aren't living up to expectations on and off the field. This ...

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Old 12-12-2014, 09:21 AM   #11
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Re: The Decline and Fall of Paytonís Empire, or How the Culture of Gregg Williams Ruined the Saints

Originally Posted by Danno View Post
True, its not about the guys we let go nearly as much as it is about the guys that are currently on the roster that aren't living up to expectations on and off the field.
This ^.

But yet, still with a shot. Season is not over.
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Old 12-12-2014, 11:52 AM   #12
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Re: The Decline and Fall of Paytonís Empire, or How the Culture of Gregg Williams Ruined the Saints

Originally Posted by Euphoria View Post
I have to agree with some of it but some of it is just crap. I don't think people give much credit to Sharper as they should for that D. Turnovers is what did it for that D that year and he pretty much was the leader and if I recall lead the team with INT's and pick 6.

This D has no leaders to make the players around them better. Until they find that leader welcome to the cellar.
Sharper was good but he was hurt in 2010 when we had the 4th rated D. Williams also had to deal with Vilma being hurt that year and still had the 4th rated D. Williams is still my favorite DC as of late, the bounty thing was overblown but the key to Williams was his ability to hype people up and make them aggressive. He took a bunch of average players and made them into a pack of angry dogs. Williams' defense worked even though they struggled at times it was consistent.
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Old 12-12-2014, 12:06 PM   #13
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Re: The Decline and Fall of Paytonís Empire, or How the Culture of Gregg Williams Ruined the Saints

Originally Posted by blackangold View Post
Williams' defense worked even though they struggled at times it was consistent.
Exactly. You could feel reasonably comfortable, and get excited when they would line up on 3rd down, that something good would happen!

Gregg Williams defenses had this thing where, stuff that looked EASY for the other team's offense in the first half, wouldn't be as easy for them in the 2nd. You could see them clamping down and taking stuff away from the offense as the game wore on. Now? It's no different as the game progresses, in fact it's actually WORSE in the 4th than in the 1st quarter.

And you could also SEE the effect they had on opposing QB's, with your own two eyes -- they'd get guys rattled or unhappy or where you could tell the QB was just not wanting to be out there, he wanted to be anyplace else but on the field right then. The Saints defense would always give up that ONE big horrible running play, early in the game, 50, 60, 70 yards, usually for a TD....and 99 times out of 100, with the Gregg Williams D we'd be like, "okay, they got that one, but that's NOT gonna happen again!" and it WOULDN'T. Nowadays the big plays for the other team just keep on coming and coming.
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Old 12-12-2014, 01:04 PM   #14
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Re: The Decline and Fall of Paytonís Empire, or How the Culture of Gregg Williams Ruined the Saints

Not so fast.

I seem to remember Williams's defense being sort of a one trick pony.

They couldn't stop Hasselbeck or Lynch in the playoffs - 41pts
They couldn't stop Alex Smith or Davis in the playoffs - 36pts

The blitz became predictable and ineffective after the 2010 Superbowl.
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Old 12-12-2014, 05:35 PM   #15
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Re: The Decline and Fall of Paytonís Empire, or How the Culture of Gregg Williams Ruined the Saints

An Empire is what New England has year after year, and Green Bay is starting to look the same way.
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Old 12-12-2014, 06:38 PM   #16
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Re: The Decline and Fall of Paytonís Empire, or How the Culture of Gregg Williams Ruined the Saints

Originally Posted by saintsfan1976 View Post
Not so fast.

I seem to remember Williams's defense being sort of a one trick pony.

They couldn't stop Hasselbeck or Lynch in the playoffs - 41pts
They couldn't stop Alex Smith or Davis in the playoffs - 36pts

The blitz became predictable and ineffective after the 2010 Superbowl.
While true, the offense turned the ball over 5 times in the San Fran game. There isn't a defense in NFL history that can overcome that.
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Old 12-12-2014, 07:21 PM   #17
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Re: The Decline and Fall of Paytonís Empire, or How the Culture of Gregg Williams Ruined the Saints

His defense pretty much shut down the Cards last night.
Arguably the best D.C. in the league and I wish we had him back.
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Old 12-12-2014, 08:19 PM   #18
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Re: The Decline and Fall of Paytonís Empire, or How the Culture of Gregg Williams Ruined the Saints

Originally Posted by saintsfan1976 View Post
Not so fast.

I seem to remember Williams's defense being sort of a one trick pony.
Exactly. Watching that defense play was almost as bad at times as it is watching this current one.

While I'll forever be grateful to GW for being part of that SB winning team - I wouldn't want him back.

I still wish they would've gone with Romeo Crennel instead of RR, but I had to admit after last season that they made a good call - now it seems that it might've just been a fluke. I feel like Crennel would've been far superior long-term in creating a good complimentary defensive unit for SP's offense.

But then again, I was over the moon when they hired Spags to replace GW.

"I don't think I'll be thinking at all. I think I'm just gonna go out there and play my balls out" - Martez Wilson | "I'm not bashing people, I'm bashing their opinions because in my opinion their opinion is wrong" - Danno
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Old 12-12-2014, 10:37 PM   #19
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Re: The Decline and Fall of Paytonís Empire, or How the Culture of Gregg Williams Ruined the Saints

GW had Dennis Allen coaching that secondary and I think that helped a lot,and it makes me wonder how much Ryan's D would improve having him back along with other new defensive coaches. Maybe Ryan's scheme isn't as bad as it seems to be...maybe it just needs some better coaching.
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Old 12-12-2014, 10:45 PM   #20
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Re: The Decline and Fall of Paytonís Empire, or How the Culture of Gregg Williams Ruined the Saints

Originally Posted by AlaskaSaints View Post
His defense pretty much shut down the Cards last night.
Arguably the best D.C. in the league and I wish we had him back.
If you gave a chimp that D-Line they would play well. The GM deserves credit for getting such a strong line set up there with depth and Ogletree is immense
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