McCarthy?!?
 

With all due respect, I am amazed at some of the views of McCarthy.

The playaction call at the end of the Carolina game should have shown you all something......he should have had his coaching license revoked for that one. I don't care if we score a TD on that play, you run it into the line and let the clock run. Best case, Carolina gets the ball with 10-15 seconds. Terrible.

Has there been a worse 1st drive team in the history of the NFL than the 2004 Saints? I would say not many, if any have been as bad. Also, the worst 1st Qtr offense in football. Who do you put that on if not the OC? He looks at tape all week and comes up with a plan that will set the tone early. He set the tone all right.

Offense vs. Defense:

Yes, bad Defense can take you out of your gameplan Offensively. But....bad offense early in the game keeps the D on the field and gives the other teams more chances to put up numbers. It's a snowball effect. There were many games this year where an answering score from our O could have calmed the storm but we just gave the ball right back and the game got away early.

How many times did AB play fake before the run was established? The TD to Horn in the last game was our best play fake of the year. Why? We established Deuce and then hit em with the deep ball. I said it all year. We finally did it and it worked. One game earlier in the year we ran 12 playfakes (i counted) before Deuce had run for 12 yards. These are basic principals of good football, not rocket surgery.

Third and 2. What does Mike do without fail? He empties the backfield and passes. This happened probably 85% of the time. I understand a pass on 3rd and short, but most of the time you leave Deuce back there and work a playfake and/or mix in a power run. That keeps them guessing. If I know what is coming every time I gotta believe that a guy who gets paid to break down tape knows what is coming. That goalline pitch to Donte a couple of weeks ago in 3rd and short was AWFUL.

Mike routinely keeps Brooks in the pocket with a sub par pass protect and a happy footed QB. More rollouts and moving the pocket would be great.....Brooks probably rolled out (planned) ten times all year. Keeping him in the pocket just encourages him to throw off the back foot when there is pressure.

Inability to execute a plan. Boy, after 16 games, we really got those TEs involved huh guys? Glad Mike laid that out for us. Going to a no fullback set with a RB who likes to have a fullback? Finger on the pulse, baby. (They worked the FB back in over time realizing how stupid they had been...that should happen in camp not the regular season.)

No deep balls. How many times did a team with our speed truly go deep this year? Our QB has a big arm and tends to be erratic on the line drive passes. So, what do we do? Run the 7-15 yard slants. Give Brooks a chance to screw up. Most of our catches are followed by hard hits (partially Brooks fault), but you have to look at who is calling these plays. This team should air it out 3 times a game. Good things can happen. You loosen up the D, you get penalties called....or you catch long balls. Nope, we went for the Montana/Brady offense where your QB is counted on to be precise and make quick decisions in the short passing game.


No huddle? Brooks has been shown to do well late in games and in the 2 minute offense. Do we ever go no huddle to put pressure on other teams? Uhhhh....no. Never. Just a thought, but I bet it would work.

Running plays. Our running plays are as bland as any you'll see. I'm not saying that they should be overly complicated...we certainly don't have Denver's old O line. But, if you watch some of the different things that other teams do in the power running game, you'll realize how bland ours is. Deuce had no gaping holes this year. Our line could be better, I know. But...Deuce left/right and Deuce toss left/right. There it is.

I personally would like to see both Coordinators go. All three of our major coaches are 1st timers. Haslett would be alot better with better guys in these positions. Are those guys out there? Don't know. But praising Mike for our firepower is like putting a guy in a Ferrarri and praising him for driving fast. Look at the inconsistency. That's the problem. We didn't post any big scores this year and last year was boosted by blowouts against bad teams.

Look at our scores this year and tell me our Offense didn't underachieve for most of the year. With Baltimore's D, we were probably 10-6....I get that. But, we knew going in that we didn't have their D. A better OC would have gotten alot more out of this offense. I am totally convinced.

I hope he goes to the Dolphins...that would be awesome to play them next year and watch him call plays for that horrible Offense.

McCarthy?!?
 

Yeah..it is kinda bad..I mean..as you may allready know..most teams script the first 15 or so plays, long before the game starts...then they run them in practice..and get them as polished as possible..while also smoothing out any wrinkles in other plays..etc etc..the point is..is we performed so poorly on nearly every single first drive of every game this year...and yes,..we did...and this was supposed to be our most effective football?..

The plays were run and designed to do certain things to certain defenses...not only did we fail to produce points..or even many first downs...we just flat out looked horrible...almost special olympics like...and this is what they write up plans to do?..and the sad thing is..it happened nearly every week...how can anyone make an excuse for that kind of performance?...I\'m sure if there is a way..Hasslet will find it..and..we are stuck for the remainder of this organizations tenure with Jim...Don\'t fool yourself..and don\'t let them fool you either..Bensons lack of enthusiasm...and limp wristed tactics all point to Los Angeles

McCarthy?!?
 

I am all for voting McCarthy off the island as well. Hope he leaves for another team. Changing a dynamic offense in the offseason did it for me. Venturi just has to be gone.

McCarthy?!?
 

WURD

McCarthy?!?
 

Yasoon - great post. I can\'t really argue any of your points. All I can say is that this year is the first in 5 that the offense has truly been a problem. Every unit is eventually going to have a down year. You\'re absolutely right, they need to play better, but canning the guy for being out of the top 10 in offense (or top 11) once just seems kind of harsh.

Moreover, if McCarthy goes and Venturi stays, what are the odds this team goes better than 8-8 next season? I say one in a million. ;) Seriously, it takes more than an offseason to properly install a new offense. Given the boneheads on this team, especially at the QB position, it could take years before these guys start to get it. How does a 28th ranked defense and a 22nd ranked offense sound? Pretty f---ing terrible to me.

McCarthy?!?
 

I am all for voting McCarthy off the island as well. Hope he leaves for another team. Changing a dynamic offense in the offseason did it for me. Venturi just has to be gone.

I also agree.

McCarthy?!?
 

I gotta disagree with you Whodat. Our offense has been good in years past, but our personnel this year wasn\'t turned over. We should have gotten better on offense because with the stability in our offensive personnel timing and communication should have improved. Not having a fullback starting was driving me, and I\'m willing to bet, 99% of Saints fans up the wall. And the crap performance every game on the first possession of the game? Teams have a full week to prepare for that first possession and if that was the best the Saints could do it points to pisspoor coaching, preparation, and decision making. We need new blood and enthusiasm in the OC position.

McCarthy?!?
 

We need new blood at EVERY coaching position. If Benson is willing to extend Haslett\'s contract, and Venturi\'s (B/C that\'s the offer on the table - Haslett and all of his coaches) then do you really have faith that we\'ll go get a premier OC candidate?

Imagine Venturi coaching the offense too.... yikes.

My point isn\'t that McCarthy necessarily deserves to stay, though I don\'t know if his transgressions are worthy of a firing either. My point is, of the big three, Haslett, Venturi, and McCarthy, I feel McCarthy is most deserving of an invitation back... but they all probably deserve a one-way ticket out.

McCarthy?!?
 

Hate to say it, but after his stint as interim head coach, I don\'t see Venturi getting the axe.

He might get moved in the front office, but he\'s with the organization as long as Benson has it.

McCarthy?!?
 

I don\'t think that moving Venturi to either the FO or to a position coach would be a bad move. Venturi\'s problem is that he has developed a system to be run by geniuses and what he has is idiots. As LB coach, he wasn\'t bad. As a talent evaluator he may definitely beat Baby Mule( I almost could).

But, McCarthy has to go. And hopefully he takes Leon with him. As for a new QB, I\'d take Kitna and draft a up and comer to back him up while learning the system. Bouman hits to trail or the # 3 guy with Bouman as the holder. Mainly, and foremost. GET RID OF LEON.

McCarthy?!?
 

Wow, I can\'t believe noone jumps on you for saying that RDOX. When I say it, it\'s like World War 3. I am glad someone agrees with me.

McCarthy?!?
 

Maybe it\'s my charming wit and personality. LOL

What I see is that you and I think very closely. I got dangerously close to the edge in another thread by suggesting that Leon was less than perfect and that as a Saints fan, I was tired of the kids here thinking that 8-8 was reaching Nirvana.

Know one thing Whodi!! I have your back on this issue, son. I support what you say 100%.

Keep saying it. Half of the Saints posters believe the lies that LoomBoom, Leon, and Benson tell them because they\'re \"optimistic.\"

Balls. :o

McCarthy?!?
 

It looks like we all agree - but you guys have a long way to go until you can complain about being attacked! LOL :)

McCarthy?!?
 

I know WhoDat, but when I say it, some members try to make me feel like I am coming out of left field and the never heard anyone speak bad of our QB and how dare I. I am like, I know I am not the only one saying it, why do I get so much flack? It\'s all good. Just knowing there are like minded folks on here keeps me straight.

RDOX, good looking out man. I agree, I find myself agreeing with you damn close to 100% of the time. Keep fighting the good fight, and maybe one more year of .500 or below will open everyone\'s eyes.

McCarthy?!?
 

gatorman......from what I\'ve seen Mike runs the show. I would have hoped Haz would override him on the playaction call vs. Carolina, but who knows.

And look, I realize that our O ranks somewhere in the top 1/3 of the league. Just remember that we spent alot of time in panic mode this year, which tends to inflate the numbers.

The case against Venturi is statistically stronger, no doubt. Mike just annoys me more because I think he has better tools in place to get the job done. I mean, who would have thought at the beginning of the year that 2 rookies at LB/Fakhir/MacKenzie would make our D 3 times better. I certainly wasn\'t that smart.

I just don\'t think Mike has a feel for the team and what will work at a given time. He gets some numbers here and there...but there\'s alot of talent on the field.

One day a couple of weeks ago, the Pats were on at the same time as the Saints. Aside from their O line (which is important to say the least) they don\'t have better players than us on O. They just play alot smarter. I was literally changing channels from one game to the next and noticing the difference in coaching. I know we can\'t all have Weiss...he\'s clearly a top OC, but we can all learn from watching others and watching the Saints. I don\'t think the Mike does that. The problem is...I don\'t know who to replace him with. But hey, what qualified Mike? The simple fact that the Saints put him there.....hardly a definitive statement. I would like to see them give SOMEONE a a chance so that I don\'t have to scream at the TV next year all game (yeah right).


Check this out: Mike Singletary Saints DC. Think about it. He\'s the LB coach with the Ravens so it would be a move up for him. He\'s a smart guy who got by in the league on knowing the game and effort, two places our D often comes up short. Who wouldn\'t follow this guy into battle? Our players grew up watching him runone of the great defenses of all time. Grab him before someone else does and sign him to a 4 year contract. The guy knows football AND he\'s been through the wars.

McCarthy?!?
 

yasoon, I am with you on Singletary. I also like Jim Bates from Miami. He isout of a job now. But Venturi has to go.

I am also with you McCarthy. I don\'t know if he took the year off or what but the predictability of this offense(including not scoring in the first) is maddening at times. I too think we can get better at o-coordinator. At least someone who will call plays downfield more than once a game. McCarthy called plays like he was afraid to lose more than it looked like he was playing to win. Get someone in here who will take advantage of our skills players and let\'s get her done. If AB was getting sacked so much, partially line partially him, why didn\'t we play him in shotgun more ala Culpepper? Worked pretty well for him. He woulda been MVP if not for a guy named Manning and his best weapon was hurt half the year. Just someone with some fresh ideas, unless with Haslett\'s new extension McCarthy breathes a sigh of relief and truly opens this thing up.

McCarthy?!?
 

whodi.....The shotgun point is dead on. You could use that as well as moving the pocket to make up for our sub par pass protection. The biggest part of coaching is getting the most out of what you have and minimizing the impact of your weaknesses. Problem is....our big shotgun down was 3rd and 2. I wish I had our numbers on 3rd and short over the last 4 years. We are REALLY bad in those spots.

I fear the same. Haz seems loyal to a fault and it\'s starting to look like Mike\'s only train out of town is a job offer (amazing). Our QB coach is also getting some looks. I wish someone could explain that to me. Let\'s see...your QB throws off his back foot, holds the ball too long, and throws lasers into triple coverage. He continues to get worse with experience under your watching eye. Want a promotion?

I know he\'s not Manning, but how bout some timing drills. (Indy has a better line, in fairness.) Manning is NOT fast, but he gets the ball out quick and avoids sacks. I saw old footage of Mariucci with Young where they were working on timing. 3 step drop and fire it outta there, either over everybody or to your open receiver. Many times Brooks drops three steps, holds the ball, pumps tenatively, then gets sacked or throws off his back foot. I refuse to believe that some good coaching wouldn\'t help him out. Maybe the coaches are too much his peers and not as much his leaders. \"You da man, AB\" \"I know\" They just don\'t seem to be pushing the offense or AB in particular.

McCarthy?!?
 

My own humble opinion is that Leon is un-coachable.

How can a person be expected to coach a guy who has an absolute belief that he is among the best to ever play the game? I can\'t fault the coaches for a defect in Leon\'s character and the scope of Leon\'s ego.

It really makes a lot of sense when you think about it. Since his holdout, Leon has claimed that he is a \"great\" or \"top 5\" QB. If he thinks he\'s been \"great\" for the past 4 years, then why should anyone be surprised that he\'s still making the same dumb mistakes for 4 years? It seems to me that Leon is convinced he\'s flawless already, so why should he improve?

We could hire Lombardi, Bear Bryant, Unitas and Montana to coach the guy and it would make no difference since he seems to believe he\'s already the best thing going. Leon\'s a coach killer.

McCarthy?!?
 

yasoon, agreed on all points listed. Good go.

BMG, that\'s I fear I am gonna have to hold off until next year. I pray AB is minimally coachable and we can get just consistency from him every game. If he was consistently fair to good, the ones who call for him to go would notbe doing so. If he was consistently terrible, the ones who keep hoping he stays would want him to go. It\'s his 1 out of 7 play show of decency that keep people holding on to him.

gator, funny funny funny.

I am rolling!!!!

McCarthy?!?
 

Look at the archives man. ;) I\'ve been accused of being a \"miserable person,\" and the most \"pessimistic person\" certain people on the board know. I have been accused of harboring personal vendettas against players and coaches, called just about every insult in the book... This is tame my man. LMAO! :) Just giving you a hard time. I know what you mean... especially when it comes to some of the members you\'ve been arguing with about Brooks.


Yasoon, I\'m confused. You said...

Inflate the numbers? They finished 15th, their worst in 5 years. 11th was the worst before that. Are you saying that this team was actually even worse but the \"panic mode\" inflated the numbers to make them look respectable? I might beg to differ on that.

I agree there\'s more talent on O, but then, Venturi and the D have had a whole lot of FA money and first round picks in the last 4 years haven\'t they? It\'s made them worse.... how\'s that possible?

And the D being 3 times better? You mean in the last 4 games? B/c it ranked dead last in the NFL this year.... better than what?

McCarthy?!?
 

No prob Who.

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I\'m not saying that Brooks\' shortcomings are all coaching problems. I personally think he\'s just a flake. He\'s not as coachable as I would like to see, but at some point you\'d like to see him step into throws and get the ball out earlier. (I think these things can be coached through repitition, I just don\'t think any one has taken charge of AB.)

I was personally a fan of JT...hated to see him go even if we did get a solid corner. Now, we have no back up plan and getting rid of Brooks either means getting another QB in return or having a rookie start which rarely works out (unless you have Pitt\'s D).

As for Kitna (his name keeps coming up), I work with a Bengals fan who really knows his football. He\'s got the Sunday ticket and watches all the games. His take on Kitna: we can have him. He said he actually has trouble watching them play with Kitna at the helm. I don\'t know that he would be much more than what we have. My guy: Volek, but I don\'t think the Titans are gonna let go of him. We might have a better shot without McNair getting ripped in half every year and teasing retirement.

Alex Smith? Interesting. Maybe we grab him and put the heat on AB, possibly ditching him after next year. I picture our D with a rookie at QB and cringe...but hey, AB looks like a rookie sometimes, so maybe I\'m wrong.

McCarthy?!?
 

Leon is not a \"flake.\" Leon is an immature, low class, petulant child with a low IQ. AB looks like a rookie because he\'s been coddled by Hazlett, McCarthy, and Sheppard in the hopes that he would \"rise to the occasion\" grow up, and be a professional QB. After 4 years of Leon, guess what? He hasn\'t and in all probability he won\'t.

I have continued to concede that Brooks has an immense amount of raw talent and above average physical tools. The problem is that he either cannot or will not listen and be coached. I suspect that his belief that he is in the \"top 5\" among quarterbacks is one of the reasons for his lack of coachability. You can\'t coach someone who won\'t listen.

In another thread, I was chided for calling Brooks \"Leon.\" My name of preference is \"Fumbles the Clown,\" but that bothered Danno, so I stopped. Mutey came up with the \"Leon\" thingy and I believe that the name fits Brooks to a Tee. Why? Because he is all about himself and not the team.

I also honestly believe that Leon has worn out his welcome with both fans and teammates here in New Orleans. After all of his comments this year and in the past, any and all of his flaws, mistakes, and gaffs will be subject to the microscope of the media and the fans. Sadly, he has little, if any credibility here. But, his \"stats\" are good.

He honestly needs to go. We would do much better with an average, team oriented QB like Maddox, Volek, or even Kitna who can hand the ball to Deuce, throw catchable balls, and cross the goal line for 6 with whatever line he plays behind. Because that line will work for a team member, not an individual who believes that he alone is a superstar.

McCarthy?!?
 

..if you look at the more athletic QB\'s, they are usually \"uncoachable\"... they\'ve used their pure physical ability to play the game since they started playing the game, and will always trust their physical prowess over their brains... it is rare to find a QB with exceptional physical talent who also is a student of the game and relies more on what he learns than on his pure physical skills...

McCarthy?!?
 

Great post RDOX, I agree sompletely. Some people continue to insist that it is absurd to even suggest that A) Brooks\' play could have any negative impact whatsoever on his line, WRs, coordinator, or team, B) he may have to start taking responsibility for his own shortcomings, C) he might not have progressed very much meaning all that \"raw talent\" is pretty useless, or D) maybe it\'s time for a new identity. Apparently those of us who criticize Brooks either have blinders on, don\'t know football, or simply skew everything purposely b/c we hold a grudge against Brooks. I\'m glad to see more and more people coming around and viewing Brooks the same way now that BMG, Gator, myself, and others viewed him three years ago. :)

McCarthy?!?
 

Absolutely. A great post RDOX. summed Leon up pretty well. I saw what someone said about calling Brooks Leon. All I can say is, if the shoe fits.... Noone calls anyone out for calling Sullivan a steaming pile of poo anytime the defense is discussed so who cares if Leon is called Leon. Keep on trucking man.

McCarthy?!?
 

A great primer on why the arrogant and stupid should not lead, RDOX.

I do want to point out that, even with that key obstruction, McCarthy couldn\'t put together a plan or teach his offense how to get the job done. Brooks is only one of 11 guys on the field. Duece seems to be a reasonably intelligent chap, he could look at the defense and get Brooks to audible in critical situations. It just takes delegation and enforcement of the plan. I\'ll bet no one considered giving Brooks a hand in that area. Receivers all over the league are coached how to read defensive coverages and alter patterns appropriately. That coordination appears to be lacking in the Saints schemes. Either McCarthy can\'t plan for it or teach it, or Brooks is incapable of implementing. It explains a lot for why the 1st 15 \"scripted\" plays don\'t seem to do much.

McCarthy?!?
 

I never said it was respectable. I\'m saying that, depending on what stat you look at, this offense was middle of the pack. We put up some yards when we were down 2 or 3 scores that made the final yearly totals look better than they actually were. I personally believe this offense should be in the top 5 in the conference/top 10 in the league. We were a little worse than the 21.8 points a game we averaged especially when you factor in pretty solid special teams all year. When this offense was not clicking it was just plain ugly. There were games like SD where we might as well have been shut out, but we posted 17 meaningless points when the outcome was completely out of reach. Also, the Carolina game looks OK at 32-21, but anyone who watched that game knows that we were done before the O did anything.

My point is that the offense was even worse than the stats bear out because they couldn\'t even get first downs for large stretches of time. Sometimes, it\'s not about scoring, it\'s about getting the ball out near midfield and giving your bad defense time to rest and better field position.

Ummmm...not apologizing for the D here. I\'m tired of Venturi\'s D and ready for him to go. I stated \"2 rookies at LB/Fakhir/MacKenzie would make our D 3 times better.\"
Yes, that would be the last 4 games of the year. Did you think I was saying that we had a good D all year? That would certainly not be a very easy argument to win.
As for Points per Game and takeaways, the last 4 games, we had one of the best defenses in the entire NFL, if not the best. I said 3 times better, maybe i should have said ten times better. Better than what? Better than their performance the rest of the year.

Sorry if I wasn\'t clear. The D is awful and has to be overhauled.... Knowing that we weren\'t going to shut people down going into the season, I was hoping that the O could take some pressure off of them with the personnel we have. My main point is, going in, we needed to score points this year. The O didn\'t really show an ability to hang in shootouts. The game where the D really let us down was MIN because we scored some points and still lost. If you look at the other point totals, our D was bad...real bad, but our Offense didn\'t score points in our losses.

Look at the losing point totals 7, 10, 17, 31, 17, 13, 21, 21

I think we all knew going in that we weren\'t gonna have alot of sub 20 point games on D. (When\'s the last time the Saints won a 10-7 game?)

Just saying that the D was statistically worse than the O...for sure. But I was more let down by the offense because I was hoping they would win us a couple of games 35-28 or something. The elite Offenses in this league usually bail their D out a few times a year. Our O just made a bad D even worse.

McCarthy?!?
 

Couldn\'t have said it better myself.

McCarthy?!?
 

Riddle me this though: did the offense wear out the defense, by keeping them on the field after going 3 and out?? Our did the defense wear out the offense, by allowing the opponents to go 1 and score???

Note: the preceding was a rhetorical/humorous question. no true answer is expected/needed.

McCarthy?!?
 

dberce:

You\'re right (even though I know you\'re being funny). It never helps to be down 14-0 from a gameplan standpoint and alot of that is on the D. But, it seemed to me that whenever the D gave up a touchdown on the first drive, we got the ball and did nothing.....allowing opposing offenses to stay in rhythm and tire our Defense. Making it 7-7 can really make a difference for the D. They at least feel like the O has their back.

The weird thing this year is we used to always be in every game (since 2000). This was the first year where we just got flat out housed a few times. In the words of Goldmember \"Ishn\'t that veeerd?\" :jester: