Yahoo Sports on McCarthy's Departure

Tobias-Reiper · 01-22-2005, 09:26 AM

... it is true that McCarthy didn\'t throw that backward pass...
... however...
... there is a reason why the offense is centered around the QB and not Dulymus, and it is not that Brooks is a bigger threat than Deuce...
... and that reason (I believe) is McCarthy trying to follow in the \"Walsh tree\"...
Walsh had Montana
Sheiffert had Young
Holmgren Favre
Reid has McNabb
... McCarthy wants to create \"his\" QB...
...don\'t forget, it was McCarthy that took a special interest in Brooks at the combine, convinced Holmgren to draft him, then convinced both Mueller and Haslett to bring him to the Saints, so McCarthy obviously will feature his QB more than the RB,no matter what... simple as that...

..so, while Brooks may be a self-centered ego-maniac who thinks he\'s a great QB, you have to credit McCarthy for creating that beast...

The thing is, Brooks has the physical ability to play the position, but he\'s mentally not there. I\'m not saying Brooks is an idiot, not even saying that Brooks is not smart... but it is going to take an OC that is going to tell Brooks he\'s not a great QB and teach him to play the position... I don\'t know that could happen at this stage in New Orleans, though...

[Edited on 22/1/2005 by Tobias-Reiper]

WhoDat · 01-22-2005, 10:14 AM

All we really know is how AB will play under McCarthy since we\'ve never seen him under another OC. So, logic dictates that it is just as likely that McCarthy has hindered AB as AB has hindered McCarthy. Wouldn\'t it be interesting if someone else comes in and AB lights up the world?

Spock out.

LOL. And how much do you want to bet that when Sheppard or whomever takes the reigns next year comes in, and the offense is STILL INCONSISTENT, every blames the new guy? Sure, he is ultimately to blame. I won\'t argue that - but his fault isn\'t necessarily in designing a bad offense or call the wrong plays - it\'s in keeping a momentum killing nitwit at QB... amongst other things.

FireVenturi · 01-22-2005, 12:12 PM

... it is true that McCarthy didn\'t throw that backward pass...
... however...
... there is a reason why the offense is centered around the QB and not Dulymus, and it is not that Brooks is a bigger threat than Deuce...
... and that reason (I believe) is McCarthy trying to follow in the \"Walsh tree\"...
Walsh had Montana
Sheiffert had Young
Holmgren Favre
Reid has McNabb
... McCarthy wants to create \"his\" QB...
...don\'t forget, it was McCarthy that took a special interest in Brooks at the combine, convinced Holmgren to draft him, then convinced both Mueller and Haslett to bring him to the Saints, so McCarthy obviously will feature his QB more than the RB,no matter what... simple as that...

..so, while Brooks may be a self-centered ego-maniac who thinks he\'s a great QB, you have to credit McCarthy for creating that beast...

The thing is, Brooks has the physical ability to play the position, but he\'s mentally not there. I\'m not saying Brooks is an idiot, not even saying that Brooks is not smart... but it is going to take an OC that is going to tell Brooks he\'s not a great QB and teach him to play the position... I don\'t know that could happen at this stage in New Orleans, though...

[Edited on 22/1/2005 by Tobias-Reiper]

Excellent post

FireVenturi · 01-22-2005, 12:19 PM

I don\'t know about some of you. You\'ve missed what is so wrong with this artlicle just so you can AB bash.

Now, don\'t accuse me of saying AB isn\'t a problem, but McCarthy\'s problems have much more to do with McCarthy than they have to do with AB and this article missed that completely.

McCarthy can\'t call plays worth a crap, can\'t game plan, and can\'t avoid being read like a book by EVERY opposing DC. Those are all better reasons why he should be let go than just saying he relied on error prone AB too much.

It just goes to show how little the national media really knows about what\'s going on in N.O....and some you agreed with them.

Everything turns into a AB argument on this board! I can see why...football isnt a team game or anything.Ab make mistakes...yes. Mcnabb has also made just as stupid mistakes(lining up under guard-twice), but his TEAM wins so he gets a pass. I am not sayin AB is better than Mcnabb;because he is not, but AB gets a lot of unfair blame. Just like Salisbury and Schlereth said..If Saints fans don\'t want him...they have bout 20 other teams that would!!!!!!

JKool · 01-22-2005, 12:54 PM

T-R nice post. I was impressed.

Gator, nice find.

FV, did you just compare Brooks to McNabb?! OMG, how is that even possible?! You do know that McNabb has won more than one playoff game... Just kidding buddy. Nice post.

McCarthy built his offense around Brooks. Now whether Brooks is himself a bad QB (or even a subpar starter in the freakin\' NFL people) or not that was McCarthy\'s choice. Even if McCarthy wasn\'t allowed to bench Brooks, he could have done A LOT to protect the offense from the kind of problems Brooks has (and McCarthy should know them, since so many here are convinced they know exactly why Brooks sucks). Thus, I think it is only reasonable to believe that DESPITE BROOKS, McCarthy had a huge hand in how poor our offense was. As people are pointing out, McCarthy could have simply featured the running game more often.

The only obvious reply to this argument is that the OLine made it hard to feature our running game. However, as we all know, a sucky OLine is also going to make it hard to feature a passing game (and even harder for a QB to get things done). Thus, either all three of McCarthy, Brooks, and Duece suffered this season at the hands of our terrible line, OR McCarthy is responsible for the so called disaster that Brooks has been in our offense this season.

GumboBC · 01-22-2005, 01:27 PM

While y\'all sit here and debate McCarthy... You might want to bring up the offensive line.

Doesn\'t make a damn who\'s calling the plays or who the QB is . Cause if that offensive line plays like they did this year, we\'ve got big problems.

Personally, I don\'t believe McCarthy or Brooks was the major problems. Oh, they could both have done better.

You think McCarthy is being sought out by other teams because he sucks? Hmmm. Maybe you guys are smarter then the Jaguars and Lions. Because they obviously see something they like.

Believe it or not foks, but just because an offense doesn\'t do well, its not always the coordinator\'s fault. And believe this too. There are 11 guys out there on the field who have an awful lot to do with the results we\'ve been getting.

Oh, and that offensive line we\'ve got. They had an awful lot to do with these problems ya\'ll are trying to figure out.

JKool · 01-22-2005, 01:39 PM

Gumbo,

While y\'all sit here and debate McCarthy... You might want to bring up the offensive line.

I did just bring up the line. Please see the post right above yours.

JKool · 01-22-2005, 01:42 PM

Also, it is the OC\'s job to do the best he can with the 11 best guys he has. The argument here isn\'t that McCarthy sucks (oddly), merely that he didn\'t do the best he could with the 11 guys he had, and if he is moving on, perhaps someone else can do better. Judging by his game planning, I\'m willing to bet someone could do better with those 11 guys - maybe not much better, but better.

GumboBC · 01-22-2005, 01:50 PM

Gumbo,

While y\'all sit here and debate McCarthy... You might want to bring up the offensive line.

I did just bring up the line. Please see the post right above yours.

I know you did, JKool. It was nice to see someone talking about it. Then again, you are one of the few who actually explore something other than the QB or the coach.

Not that there\'s anything wrong with discussing the QB or coach. But some folks thing getting a new coach and QB will solve world hunger..

Anyway, I just felt compelled to say a little something about our offensive line. In fact, I \'ve been complaining about the poor PASS blocking for the past 2-years.

Last year Deuce rushed for 1,600 yards and most folks thought we had a pretty good offensive line. Well, they did good at run blocking, but they didn\'t do worth a flip at pass blocking. I would bring it up after almost every game that year. But most foks just want to blame it on Brooks. Imagine that!!

Well, this year our line was even worse than the year before. I suppose losing Fontenot hurt. But it goes way beyond that. Victor Riley and Wayne Gandy are major problem. You want to talk about inconsistent play?!?! Riley and Gandy are about as inconsistent as it gets and both need to go, IMO.

GumboBC · 01-22-2005, 02:48 PM

Saints: McCarthy on his way out as OC

by Fanball Staff - Fanball.com
Friday, January 21, 2005

News
Saints\' offensive coordinator Mike McCarthy is not expected to retain his title next season. The 41 year-old McCarthy interviewed for the vacant Jaguars\' offensive coordinator position earlier this week, and met with the Lions regarding their opening on Thursday, according to the Detroit Free Press. McCarthy has been with the Saints for five seasons.

Views
Did McCarthy throw a pass 25 yards backwards? No, that was quarterback Aaron Brooks. Then again, McCarthy\'s game plan always seemed to feature Brooks and the passing game rather than running back Deuce McAllister, which might be one reason he is being allowed to interview for other coordinator positions.

Yes, you just read a national media outlet blast Brooks for erratic play and blame McCarthy for featuring Brooks over Deuce. Well, good to see it\'s not just \"those fans\" as Billy puts it that see it this way. So if the national media sees it, some fans here see it.........where does it leave the rest? Could it be everyone has it wrong except the guy who thinks all black qbs that run are the future of the NFL? And I don\'t think yahoo sports has any bias towards the Saints. This article is simply stating the obvious IMO, but I guess if you don\'t see it yet, it\'s not obvious. One thing is for sure, Mike is out, now there\'s a chance the offense won\'t feature AB over Deuce.

[Edited on 1/21/2005 by gatorman]

Here\'s a news flash for you, Gator.

McCarthy does not feature Brooks over Deuce. And never has. In fact, if McCarthy had it his way he would run 50% of the time and pass 50% of the time. It\'s called BALANCE!!

Hey, but check this out Gator. You know why it seems McCarthy features Brooks over Deuce?

Come on now. This ain\'t hard. And I shouldn\'t have to explain it to you. But I will....

Have you ever watched a Saints\' game?

If so, have you noticed our defense?

You know, the one that gives up about 90-points per game.

Why do I bring up that fact you ask?

Well, when you\'re behind in almost every game there becomes a need to pass the ball more frequently!!

Ohhhhhhhhh, I suppose he could keep running the ball when we are 20-points behind. Sounds logical to me... NOT!!

Look past the trees Gator. There\'s a big forest right over yonder!!

And wouldn\'t it be logical that when your behind by a large margin in most games that no matter what call you make it doesn\'t work most of the time.

Just look at some games other than the Saints every Sunday.

If you do, I\'ll bet you notice that when a team gets behind and HAS to pass that defenses realize this and they tee off and bring a big ol\' can of WHOOP-AZZ to the table.

Playcalling Playcalling. Riiiiiiiiiiiiight!!

01-22-2005, 09:26 AM	#11
Tobias-Reiper Merces Letifer Join Date: Dec 2004 Posts: 4,161	Yahoo Sports on McCarthy's Departure ... it is true that McCarthy didn\'t throw that backward pass... ... however... ... there is a reason why the offense is centered around the QB and not Dulymus, and it is not that Brooks is a bigger threat than Deuce... ... and that reason (I believe) is McCarthy trying to follow in the \"Walsh tree\"... Walsh had Montana Sheiffert had Young Holmgren Favre Reid has McNabb ... McCarthy wants to create \"his\" QB... ...don\'t forget, it was McCarthy that took a special interest in Brooks at the combine, convinced Holmgren to draft him, then convinced both Mueller and Haslett to bring him to the Saints, so McCarthy obviously will feature his QB more than the RB,no matter what... simple as that... ..so, while Brooks may be a self-centered ego-maniac who thinks he\'s a great QB, you have to credit McCarthy for creating that beast... The thing is, Brooks has the physical ability to play the position, but he\'s mentally not there. I\'m not saying Brooks is an idiot, not even saying that Brooks is not smart... but it is going to take an OC that is going to tell Brooks he\'s not a great QB and teach him to play the position... I don\'t know that could happen at this stage in New Orleans, though... [Edited on 22/1/2005 by Tobias-Reiper]
	'Cause the simple man pays the thrills, the bills and the pills that kill

01-22-2005, 10:14 AM	#12
WhoDat 5000 POSTS! + Join Date: Sep 2002 Posts: 5,631	Yahoo Sports on McCarthy's Departure All we really know is how AB will play under McCarthy since we\'ve never seen him under another OC. So, logic dictates that it is just as likely that McCarthy has hindered AB as AB has hindered McCarthy. Wouldn\'t it be interesting if someone else comes in and AB lights up the world? Spock out. LOL. And how much do you want to bet that when Sheppard or whomever takes the reigns next year comes in, and the offense is STILL INCONSISTENT, every blames the new guy? Sure, he is ultimately to blame. I won\'t argue that - but his fault isn\'t necessarily in designing a bad offense or call the wrong plays - it\'s in keeping a momentum killing nitwit at QB... amongst other things.
WhoDat 5000 POSTS! + Join Date: Sep 2002 Posts: 5,631

01-22-2005, 12:12 PM	#13
FireVenturi Cold as Ice! Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Da Big Easy Posts: 2,978	Yahoo Sports on McCarthy's Departure ... it is true that McCarthy didn\'t throw that backward pass... ... however... ... there is a reason why the offense is centered around the QB and not Dulymus, and it is not that Brooks is a bigger threat than Deuce... ... and that reason (I believe) is McCarthy trying to follow in the \"Walsh tree\"... Walsh had Montana Sheiffert had Young Holmgren Favre Reid has McNabb ... McCarthy wants to create \"his\" QB... ...don\'t forget, it was McCarthy that took a special interest in Brooks at the combine, convinced Holmgren to draft him, then convinced both Mueller and Haslett to bring him to the Saints, so McCarthy obviously will feature his QB more than the RB,no matter what... simple as that... ..so, while Brooks may be a self-centered ego-maniac who thinks he\'s a great QB, you have to credit McCarthy for creating that beast... The thing is, Brooks has the physical ability to play the position, but he\'s mentally not there. I\'m not saying Brooks is an idiot, not even saying that Brooks is not smart... but it is going to take an OC that is going to tell Brooks he\'s not a great QB and teach him to play the position... I don\'t know that could happen at this stage in New Orleans, though... [Edited on 22/1/2005 by Tobias-Reiper] Excellent post

01-22-2005, 12:19 PM	#14
FireVenturi Cold as Ice! Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Da Big Easy Posts: 2,978	Yahoo Sports on McCarthy's Departure I don\'t know about some of you. You\'ve missed what is so wrong with this artlicle just so you can AB bash. Now, don\'t accuse me of saying AB isn\'t a problem, but McCarthy\'s problems have much more to do with McCarthy than they have to do with AB and this article missed that completely. McCarthy can\'t call plays worth a crap, can\'t game plan, and can\'t avoid being read like a book by EVERY opposing DC. Those are all better reasons why he should be let go than just saying he relied on error prone AB too much. It just goes to show how little the national media really knows about what\'s going on in N.O....and some you agreed with them. Everything turns into a AB argument on this board! I can see why...football isnt a team game or anything.Ab make mistakes...yes. Mcnabb has also made just as stupid mistakes(lining up under guard-twice), but his TEAM wins so he gets a pass. I am not sayin AB is better than Mcnabb;because he is not, but AB gets a lot of unfair blame. Just like Salisbury and Schlereth said..If Saints fans don\'t want him...they have bout 20 other teams that would!!!!!!

01-22-2005, 12:54 PM	#15
JKool 1000 Posts + Join Date: Nov 2003 Location: Madison, WI Posts: 2,423	Yahoo Sports on McCarthy's Departure T-R nice post. I was impressed. Gator, nice find. FV, did you just compare Brooks to McNabb?! OMG, how is that even possible?! You do know that McNabb has won more than one playoff game... Just kidding buddy. Nice post. McCarthy built his offense around Brooks. Now whether Brooks is himself a bad QB (or even a subpar starter in the freakin\' NFL people) or not that was McCarthy\'s choice. Even if McCarthy wasn\'t allowed to bench Brooks, he could have done A LOT to protect the offense from the kind of problems Brooks has (and McCarthy should know them, since so many here are convinced they know exactly why Brooks sucks). Thus, I think it is only reasonable to believe that DESPITE BROOKS, McCarthy had a huge hand in how poor our offense was. As people are pointing out, McCarthy could have simply featured the running game more often. The only obvious reply to this argument is that the OLine made it hard to feature our running game. However, as we all know, a sucky OLine is also going to make it hard to feature a passing game (and even harder for a QB to get things done). Thus, either all three of McCarthy, Brooks, and Duece suffered this season at the hands of our terrible line, OR McCarthy is responsible for the so called disaster that Brooks has been in our offense this season.
	"... I was beating them with my eyes the whole game..." - Aaron Brooks

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01-22-2005, 01:27 PM	#16
GumboBC Banned Join Date: May 2004 Posts: 2,616	Yahoo Sports on McCarthy's Departure While y\'all sit here and debate McCarthy... You might want to bring up the offensive line. Doesn\'t make a damn who\'s calling the plays or who the QB is . Cause if that offensive line plays like they did this year, we\'ve got big problems. Personally, I don\'t believe McCarthy or Brooks was the major problems. Oh, they could both have done better. You think McCarthy is being sought out by other teams because he sucks? Hmmm. Maybe you guys are smarter then the Jaguars and Lions. Because they obviously see something they like. Believe it or not foks, but just because an offense doesn\'t do well, its not always the coordinator\'s fault. And believe this too. There are 11 guys out there on the field who have an awful lot to do with the results we\'ve been getting. Oh, and that offensive line we\'ve got. They had an awful lot to do with these problems ya\'ll are trying to figure out.
GumboBC Banned Join Date: May 2004 Posts: 2,616

01-22-2005, 01:39 PM	#17
JKool 1000 Posts + Join Date: Nov 2003 Location: Madison, WI Posts: 2,423	Yahoo Sports on McCarthy's Departure Gumbo, While y\'all sit here and debate McCarthy... You might want to bring up the offensive line. I did just bring up the line. Please see the post right above yours.

01-22-2005, 01:42 PM	#18
JKool 1000 Posts + Join Date: Nov 2003 Location: Madison, WI Posts: 2,423	Yahoo Sports on McCarthy's Departure Also, it is the OC\'s job to do the best he can with the 11 best guys he has. The argument here isn\'t that McCarthy sucks (oddly), merely that he didn\'t do the best he could with the 11 guys he had, and if he is moving on, perhaps someone else can do better. Judging by his game planning, I\'m willing to bet someone could do better with those 11 guys - maybe not much better, but better.

01-22-2005, 01:50 PM	#19
GumboBC Banned Join Date: May 2004 Posts: 2,616	Yahoo Sports on McCarthy's Departure Gumbo, While y\'all sit here and debate McCarthy... You might want to bring up the offensive line. I did just bring up the line. Please see the post right above yours. I know you did, JKool. It was nice to see someone talking about it. Then again, you are one of the few who actually explore something other than the QB or the coach. Not that there\'s anything wrong with discussing the QB or coach. But some folks thing getting a new coach and QB will solve world hunger.. Anyway, I just felt compelled to say a little something about our offensive line. In fact, I \'ve been complaining about the poor PASS blocking for the past 2-years. Last year Deuce rushed for 1,600 yards and most folks thought we had a pretty good offensive line. Well, they did good at run blocking, but they didn\'t do worth a flip at pass blocking. I would bring it up after almost every game that year. But most foks just want to blame it on Brooks. Imagine that!! Well, this year our line was even worse than the year before. I suppose losing Fontenot hurt. But it goes way beyond that. Victor Riley and Wayne Gandy are major problem. You want to talk about inconsistent play?!?! Riley and Gandy are about as inconsistent as it gets and both need to go, IMO.
GumboBC Banned Join Date: May 2004 Posts: 2,616

01-22-2005, 02:48 PM	#20
GumboBC Banned Join Date: May 2004 Posts: 2,616	Yahoo Sports on McCarthy's Departure Saints: McCarthy on his way out as OC by Fanball Staff - Fanball.com Friday, January 21, 2005 News Saints\' offensive coordinator Mike McCarthy is not expected to retain his title next season. The 41 year-old McCarthy interviewed for the vacant Jaguars\' offensive coordinator position earlier this week, and met with the Lions regarding their opening on Thursday, according to the Detroit Free Press. McCarthy has been with the Saints for five seasons. Views Did McCarthy throw a pass 25 yards backwards? No, that was quarterback Aaron Brooks. Then again, McCarthy\'s game plan always seemed to feature Brooks and the passing game rather than running back Deuce McAllister, which might be one reason he is being allowed to interview for other coordinator positions. Yes, you just read a national media outlet blast Brooks for erratic play and blame McCarthy for featuring Brooks over Deuce. Well, good to see it\'s not just \"those fans\" as Billy puts it that see it this way. So if the national media sees it, some fans here see it.........where does it leave the rest? Could it be everyone has it wrong except the guy who thinks all black qbs that run are the future of the NFL? And I don\'t think yahoo sports has any bias towards the Saints. This article is simply stating the obvious IMO, but I guess if you don\'t see it yet, it\'s not obvious. One thing is for sure, Mike is out, now there\'s a chance the offense won\'t feature AB over Deuce. [Edited on 1/21/2005 by gatorman] Here\'s a news flash for you, Gator. McCarthy does not feature Brooks over Deuce. And never has. In fact, if McCarthy had it his way he would run 50% of the time and pass 50% of the time. It\'s called BALANCE!! Hey, but check this out Gator. You know why it seems McCarthy features Brooks over Deuce? Come on now. This ain\'t hard. And I shouldn\'t have to explain it to you. But I will.... Have you ever watched a Saints\' game? If so, have you noticed our defense? You know, the one that gives up about 90-points per game. Why do I bring up that fact you ask? Well, when you\'re behind in almost every game there becomes a need to pass the ball more frequently!! Ohhhhhhhhh, I suppose he could keep running the ball when we are 20-points behind. Sounds logical to me... NOT!! Look past the trees Gator. There\'s a big forest right over yonder!! And wouldn\'t it be logical that when your behind by a large margin in most games that no matter what call you make it doesn\'t work most of the time. Just look at some games other than the Saints every Sunday. If you do, I\'ll bet you notice that when a team gets behind and HAS to pass that defenses realize this and they tee off and bring a big ol\' can of WHOOP-AZZ to the table. Playcalling Playcalling. Riiiiiiiiiiiiight!!
GumboBC Banned Join Date: May 2004 Posts: 2,616