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Saints have more problems than 2016 draft can fix

this is a discussion within the Saints Community Forum; Here is my draft wish list: G, DE, DT, OLB(No particular draft order) If we can find a starter at each one of those positions we will be set. I know a lot of people will look at that and ...

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Old 12-29-2015, 07:07 AM   #21
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Here is my draft wish list: G, DE, DT, OLB(No particular draft order)

If we can find a starter at each one of those positions we will be set. I know a lot of people will look at that and say 'Go home, you're drunk' but hear me out. The WRs are set, in my opinion. Even with Colston being on his way out, we have 3 solid WRs(Cooks, Snead, Coleman) so why waste a 1st round pick on a WR? A late round small school guy like Darrin Peterson would work just fine. As for DBs get rid of Browner and welcome back a healthy Keenan Lewis and PJ Williams(hopefully Swanson hasn't done too much damage to himself and can come back as well) and the CBs are set.

So, I would strongly disagree with the article and state that a really good draft COULD make the Saints a contender again.
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Old 12-29-2015, 08:39 AM   #22
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Re: Saints have more problems than 2016 draft can fix

On offense, needs are Starting Right Guard and Starting WR (X) receiver, that's it really...

On defense, first thing you have to do is decide what kind of defense is going to be schemed because we've drafted 3-4 personnel for the front seven the past two drafts and we're running a 4-3 to feature Cam Jordan (who's looked awful as a pass rusher and has blown containment on several big run gashes (Detroit late comes to mind))...

Cam is a poor fit, should be traded for that reason and to begin to unload cap space...

If we continue to draft 3-4. as we have for the front seven these past two drafts (i.e. Stephone Anthony, Hau'oli Kikaha, Davis Tull, John Jenkins, Tyeler Davison) getting OLB Karim Edebali on the field and ILB Dannel Ellerbe healthy, then we only have need for a MLB for depth and a couple of late round maulers for the three down linemen rotation...

So we're not that far away...Now, if we reverse course and build a 4-3 around Cam Jordan, there's more work to be done and is a mistake because Jordan isn't as effective against regular starting offensive linemen...
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Old 12-31-2015, 06:43 AM   #23
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Re: Saints have more problems than 2016 draft can fix

Originally Posted by jeanpierre View Post

On defense, first thing you have to do is decide what kind of defense is going to be schemed because we've drafted 3-4 personnel for the front seven the past two drafts and we're running a 4-3 to feature Cam Jordan (who's looked awful as a pass rusher and has blown containment on several big run gashes (Detroit late comes to mind))...

Cam is a poor fit, should be traded for that reason and to begin to unload cap space...

So we're not that far away...Now, if we reverse course and build a 4-3 around Cam Jordan, there's more work to be done and is a mistake because Jordan isn't as effective against regular starting offensive linemen...
I don't understand the reasoning behind getting rid of Jordan. He is the best lineman we have and arguably the best defensive player. He has as many pressures as J.J. Watt and is THE leader of the defense. We need to be building around him on the front 7. Here is what ProFootball Focus said about him in their '10 biggest pro bowl snubs' article:

Cameron Jordan, DE, New Orleans Saints (91.6):

A late season surge is something that you could definitely not level at Cameron Jordan, who has been ultra productive on a bad Saints’ defense since the start of the season. That last point is perhaps what has held Jordan off of the roster; unfairly overlooked on an individual level due to the failings of the defensive unit around him. What more Jordan could have done than rack up 66 defensive pressures, five batted passes, and 30 stops to help those around him, I’m not quite sure. A crowded pack on the edge for certain, but Jordan’s play this season is absolutely worthy of a trip to Hawaii.
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Old 12-31-2015, 06:50 AM   #24
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Re: Saints have more problems than 2016 draft can fix

The issue is the rest of the front three and other linebacker. Jordan,Anthony and Kikaha are noce building blocks. Get another DE/OLB that can get pressure and a pair of brutes to fill the DT and stop the push on the line and kill the run and the defense will look decent. As much as id love a top 5 defense we can be contenders with anything in the top 15
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Old 12-31-2015, 10:21 AM   #25
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Re: Saints have more problems than 2016 draft can fix

Hopefully you all remember our record before the 09 season.

07 08 were very similar to 14 15... I'm hoping for Payton to stay but all of the position coaches need to go.
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Old 12-31-2015, 10:27 AM   #26
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Re: Saints have more problems than 2016 draft can fix

Originally Posted by mighty12 View Post
I don't understand the reasoning behind getting rid of Jordan. He is the best lineman we have and arguably the best defensive player. He has as many pressures as J.J. Watt and is THE leader of the defense. We need to be building around him on the front 7. Here is what ProFootball Focus said about him in their '10 biggest pro bowl snubs' article:

Cameron Jordan, DE, New Orleans Saints (91.6):

A late season surge is something that you could definitely not level at Cameron Jordan, who has been ultra productive on a bad Saints’ defense since the start of the season. That last point is perhaps what has held Jordan off of the roster; unfairly overlooked on an individual level due to the failings of the defensive unit around him. What more Jordan could have done than rack up 66 defensive pressures, five batted passes, and 30 stops to help those around him, I’m not quite sure. A crowded pack on the edge for certain, but Jordan’s play this season is absolutely worthy of a trip to Hawaii.
Cam Jordan is easily the best defensive player we have. He also consistently ranks out on the top of his position in pass rushing and run stopping according to pff. Don't pay attention to the knee jerk reaction folks.

Cam needs some players across the line which can also draw double teams. Outside of Cam we have NO ONE that poses any threat. We have the worst front 4 in the NFL, if jj watt had the supporting cast Cam had, jj wouldn't be a pro bowler every year.
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Old 12-31-2015, 10:35 AM   #27
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Re: Saints have more problems than 2016 draft can fix

Trading Cam = 18 million in dead money = stupid move
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Old 12-31-2015, 10:54 AM   #28
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Re: Saints have more problems than 2016 draft can fix

you know I watched Anthony a few plays the other afternoon and yes hes good but a couple of plays he just a fraction of a sec. from making plays that could have changed the game. yes he was late on filling a few holes but that will change .possibly by next season. its like getting a better oick in next years draft when u had rookies in there first year running all over the field trying to figure this thing out. Anthony will be better and better, that's just him, we had more rookies that were thrown in the fire first out, i'm going in to next season with being better and i'm pumped for whats coming;.payton knew this season was a rebuild, they just can't say it anymore in these days. wait till next year boys then we can start thinking superbowl after then. it takes time.
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Old 12-31-2015, 02:08 PM   #29
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Re: Saints have more problems than 2016 draft can fix

Jordan just needs some help...along with Anthony and Ki'kaha.
The DB's were terrible because they had to cover for 17 seconds.
Just a decent pass rush would force a few more quick or errant throws.
Doesn't even have to be "turn overs". I consider 3rd down stops to be turnovers.
We did nothing well on defense. I say pick something and be good at it.
Then build around that. Pass rush, run stop, coverage, ...doesn't even matter- just pick one.
Its the little things that got to me this season.
Same foolishness every week.
Scoring 20's , 30's and 40's and defense can't even stop a clock.
Just pick something and be good it.
May surprise at how much better the other things suddenly get.

**SaintSince67**
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Old 12-31-2015, 04:28 PM   #30
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Re: Saints have more problems than 2016 draft can fix

Originally Posted by blackangold View Post
Cam Jordan is easily the best defensive player we have. He also consistently ranks out on the top of his position in pass rushing and run stopping according to pff. Don't pay attention to the knee jerk reaction folks.

Cam needs some players across the line which can also draw double teams. Outside of Cam we have NO ONE that poses any threat. We have the worst front 4 in the NFL, if jj watt had the supporting cast Cam had, jj wouldn't be a pro bowler every year.
Cam Jordan is not even on the same level as Watts and never will be. Watts never takes plays off and constantly beats O-linemen. I would trade him in a heartbeat just like I would have trader Ellis, Vilma and Smith. I can't see cutting him because he does produce to a point but I'm all about trading him for picks. As far as building a D around him, hell no.
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