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I'm not sure Brees is gonna restructure

this is a discussion within the Saints Community Forum; Personally given this FA class, he probably does not need to. I mean the things I'm hearing saints want don't seem to be that they are going after a big name....

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Old 03-09-2016, 02:36 AM   #1
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I'm not sure Brees is gonna restructure

Personally given this FA class, he probably does not need to. I mean the things I'm hearing saints want don't seem to be that they are going after a big name.
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Old 03-09-2016, 05:21 AM   #2
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Re: I'm not sure Brees is gonna restructure

we have a long long list of FA in 2017 also so not a bad idea to lock a few up now
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Old 03-09-2016, 09:39 AM   #3
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Re: I'm not sure Brees is gonna restructure

I was going to say something about this yesterday. I keep waiting for this "extension/restructure" and it doesn't appear to be coming. And theres no whispers about it either.

Almost like it never was an issue. I hope Drew isn't asking for too much.
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Old 03-09-2016, 11:10 AM   #4
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Re: I'm not sure Brees is gonna restructure

If the extension does happen it doesn't look like it will be done to free up cap space to sign free agents. I'm expecting a very quiet day today for the Saints instead of big surprise FA signings.
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Old 03-09-2016, 11:15 AM   #5
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Re: I'm not sure Brees is gonna restructure

He will if he wants to stay off his ass this coming season...
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Old 03-09-2016, 11:19 AM   #6
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Re: I'm not sure Brees is gonna restructure

Originally Posted by jnormand View Post
I was going to say something about this yesterday. I keep waiting for this "extension/restructure" and it doesn't appear to be coming. And theres no whispers about it either.

Almost like it never was an issue. I hope Drew isn't asking for too much.
It looks like it's time to review NFL contracts 101. Brees has no obligation to do anything.

Brees is heading into year 5 of a 6 year contract. Large NFL contracts are almost always loaded with guaranteed money early and large salaries late in the contract. The combination of the two constitutes the cap number for each year. Without double-checking I believe that Brees contract was $100 million/6 years with $60 million guaranteed. So the guaranteed money is a $10 million a year cap hit. And with the typical escalation of salary this 2nd to last year is a $20 million salary number.

Restructuring isn't usually about asking for new money. It's usually about converting that un-guaranteed remaining salary into some type of guaranteed bonus money. This often works for both the team and the player. The team gets cap relief by being able to spread out the dollars over multiple years while the player gets guaranteed money and usually gets it immediately.

But this only works if more time is on the table. This type of restructure is almost always an extension in time, which gives more space to spread out the guaranteed money.

It's an open question if either Brees or the Saints really want to extend the contract past 2017. Brees will be 40 by then and the Saints will be on the hook for any guaranteed dollars extended beyond 2017 even if Brees retires.

Brees is now the 3rd upcoming QB heading towards 40 as the longtime starter, along with Manning and Brady. I'm leaving Farve off this list because he bounced around a bit at the end. Denver and New England have handled this is different ways. Denver went with a pay as you go model paying Manning about $20 million a year with no bonus. So they were on the hook for the salary each year with no residual bonus dollars. Brady on the other hand took a flat pay cut in 2013. Dude is earning about $12million/year below his true worth. Tom Brady is the NFL's most Underpaid Player | The MMQB with Peter King outlines that restructure which seeming makes no sense.

The Saints are not going to get either of these models. In the end they really only have 3 options:

1. Extend the years for Brees which ups the guaranteed dollars and extends new money into years that likely Brees will not be here.

2. Stay the course and eat the rest of the current contract for 2016 and 2017. But that's going to be $30+ million cap hits each year.

3. Cut Brees before the 2016 season and strike out in a new rebuilding direction now. The cap hit over the next two years is $20 million instead of $60+ million. But of course the team no longer has their franchise QB.

Which is why all Brees needs to do this nothing, which ends up being scenario #2 above.

It's not a matter of Brees asking for too much. It's a matter of how much are the Saints willing to invest to move the scenario from #2 to #1? Also couple that with the fact that even at 40, some NFL team would be willing to pay Brees $22-$25 million a year for a three year contract with virtually all the dollars guaranteed. This means that the Saints not only have to contend with the current dollars on the table, but the $60-$75 million of future dollars from 2018-2020 too.

So this is going to take a while. The Saints have to figure out what they are willing to invest. Then Brees has to decide if it's enough to pull the trigger.

I'd like to point out that the contract system worked exactly the way it's supposed to. If the player isn't living up to a contract then you cut them halfway through. If they out perform it all the way to the back end, then the team has to either heavily incentivize restructuring, eat the heavy backload, or cut the player loose.

Brees is at worst the #3 QB in this league. So thinking that he's going to take a $30-$40 million pay cut, like Brady bizarrely did to help out the Saints is wishful thinking at best. Also I'd like to point out that Brees really has done two discount contracts with the Saints already. The original 6 year $60 million was a bargain, while the 6 year $100 million, even with the $60 million guaranteed money, is really a bargain in today's environment. So paying him $20 million this year really isn't too much a stretch. It's just that coupled with the $10 million cap hit from the guaranteed dollars that it seems out of whack.

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Old 03-09-2016, 11:39 AM   #7
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Re: I'm not sure Brees is gonna restructure

I see two options:
1. Stay the course and take the 30 million pay day. Especially if you are about done. The Saints are going to cut him or do anything stupid. Trade him?

2. He also has to look at the possibility of breaking Mannings records which he actually could do under Payton and the Saints. So what is it worth... taking care of his family and future Bree's generations or the records.
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Old 03-09-2016, 12:38 PM   #8
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Re: I'm not sure Brees is gonna restructure

Originally Posted by SaintFanInATLHELL View Post
It looks like it's time to review NFL contracts 101. Brees has no obligation to do anything.

Brees is heading into year 5 of a 6 year contract. Large NFL contracts are almost always loaded with guaranteed money early and large salaries late in the contract. The combination of the two constitutes the cap number for each year. Without double-checking I believe that Brees contract was $100 million/6 years with $60 million guaranteed. So the guaranteed money is a $10 million a year cap hit. And with the typical escalation of salary this 2nd to last year is a $20 million salary number.

Restructuring isn't usually about asking for new money. It's usually about converting that un-guaranteed remaining salary into some type of guaranteed bonus money. This often works for both the team and the player. The team gets cap relief by being able to spread out the dollars over multiple years while the player gets guaranteed money and usually gets it immediately.

But this only works if more time is on the table. This type of restructure is almost always an extension in time, which gives more space to spread out the guaranteed money.

It's an open question if either Brees or the Saints really want to extend the contract past 2017. Brees will be 40 by then and the Saints will be on the hook for any guaranteed dollars extended beyond 2017 even if Brees retires.

Brees is now the 3rd upcoming QB heading towards 40 as the longtime starter, along with Manning and Brady. I'm leaving Farve off this list because he bounced around a bit at the end. Denver and New England have handled this is different ways. Denver went with a pay as you go model paying Manning about $20 million a year with no bonus. So they were on the hook for the salary each year with no residual bonus dollars. Brady on the other hand took a flat pay cut in 2013. Dude is earning about $12million/year below his true worth. Tom Brady is the NFL's most Underpaid Player | The MMQB with Peter King outlines that restructure which seeming makes no sense.

The Saints are not going to get either of these models. In the end they really only have 3 options:

1. Extend the years for Brees which ups the guaranteed dollars and extends new money into years that likely Brees will not be here.

2. Stay the course and eat the rest of the current contract for 2016 and 2017. But that's going to be $30+ million cap hits each year.

3. Cut Brees before the 2016 season and strike out in a new rebuilding direction now. The cap hit over the next two years is $20 million instead of $60+ million. But of course the team no longer has their franchise QB.

Which is why all Brees needs to do this nothing, which ends up being scenario #2 above.

It's not a matter of Brees asking for too much. It's a matter of how much are the Saints willing to invest to move the scenario from #2 to #1? Also couple that with the fact that even at 40, some NFL team would be willing to pay Brees $22-$25 million a year for a three year contract with virtually all the dollars guaranteed. This means that the Saints not only have to contend with the current dollars on the table, but the $60-$75 million of future dollars from 2018-2020 too.

So this is going to take a while. The Saints have to figure out what they are willing to invest. Then Brees has to decide if it's enough to pull the trigger.

I'd like to point out that the contract system worked exactly the way it's supposed to. If the player isn't living up to a contract then you cut them halfway through. If they out perform it all the way to the back end, then the team has to either heavily incentivize restructuring, eat the heavy backload, or cut the player loose.

Brees is at worst the #3 QB in this league. So thinking that he's going to take a $30-$40 million pay cut, like Brady bizarrely did to help out the Saints is wishful thinking at best. Also I'd like to point out that Brees really has done two discount contracts with the Saints already. The original 6 year $60 million was a bargain, while the 6 year $100 million, even with the $60 million guaranteed money, is really a bargain in today's environment. So paying him $20 million this year really isn't too much a stretch. It's just that coupled with the $10 million cap hit from the guaranteed dollars that it seems out of whack.

SFIAH
I could be wrong, but I don't think anyone said Brees was obligated to do anything. That's really not the point. The point is that if the Saints are to have ANY kind of room to improve through free agency, they will have to extend Drew's deal.

By the way, he's in the last of a five year deal, not six. I don't call 20 million a year a bargain. It is what it is... A guy taking advantage of market value. I don't say that to be critical, it's just a fact. Drew has been more than fairly compensated.

Also, I'm pretty certain everyone is aware of how guaranteed money works, and how we arrived at this point of Drew being owed 30 million for this season. It has been discussed ad nauseam, and is in no way confusing. It does not seem out of whack. It IS out of whack. He's not going to take a pay cut by extending, it will simply be spread out. It's pushing back the problem, in effect, but there's not much else that can be done now, from the Saints' perspective.

It comes down to whether or not Drew wants to play here, and if so, is he willing to work with the team to enhance his chances at another Super Bowl. No one knows what his thoughts are on that. But it's universally understood that taking a 30 million dollar cap hit is not very reasonable for the team.
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If I had a nickel for every time I heard that, the NFL would fine and suspend me.
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Old 03-09-2016, 01:11 PM   #9
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Re: I'm not sure Brees is gonna restructure

I don't care about a lesser cap hit. I want to see him extended so we know he'll be a Saint for the rest of his career.
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Old 03-09-2016, 03:23 PM   #10
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Re: I'm not sure Brees is gonna restructure

If Drew stays here and continues to break records in a Sean Payton offense he will go down in history with only a few select other players. Does he want the money or the records?

Drew is most recognizable in a New Orleans Saints jersey. Also, those endorsement contracts pay pretty well too.
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