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New Orleans Saints sign DT Nick Fairley

this is a discussion within the Saints Community Forum; Originally Posted by AsylumGuido No, the Saints only know that relief is needed. As I was pointing out and you missed completely, they don't know EXACTLY what relief is needed until free agency and the draft is completed. And, yes, ...

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Old 03-21-2016, 04:15 PM   #101
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Originally Posted by AsylumGuido View Post
No, the Saints only know that relief is needed. As I was pointing out and you missed completely, they don't know EXACTLY what relief is needed until free agency and the draft is completed. And, yes, I have been paying very close attention for the past two years.

1.)They do know what they need Pass Rush, Pass Rush, Pass Rush. That has been stated since the end of the Season by Our Head Coach. So Yes they knew what they needed before Free Agency Began

We lost a center because his agent was demanding more than the Saints felt he was worth. Would you have rather kept the center and gotten rid of the QB? That is today's NFL. You can't keep everyone.

2.)Actually you can. I don't like The Patriots but one thing I will give Tom Brady, if a restructuring is needed to better the team around he, he gets it done. But, I guess in The NFL this doesn't happen. Correct?

Wrong, we traded Graham because the front office felt adding an all-pro center was more important than keeping a one dimensional TE that could not stay healthy. The net affect of the trade actually increased the cap hit for the 2015 season.

3.)We traded Jimmy Graham to get a Center in Unger and 2nd Round Pick. The funny thing is, we could've signed Graham the year before and had the contract be less than what it turned out to be.

We signed major free agents each of the last two years that have translated into expensive busts. That is not because of Brees or the supposed cap problem.

4.)The only major free agent we signed was Byrd and he got hurt. I don't look at Browner as being a major free agent but rather a reach because we missed on Robinson when we draft him after winning The Super Bowl.

Take a step back? What are you talking about? The extension you are talking about is exactly what I have been predicting for this off-season for the past two years. Loomis and Payton have both said a deal will get made. Brees came right out and said he is more than willing to work out an extension. As I have mentioned before, I would be shocked if the major portion of the deal has not already been negotiated and is only waiting until free agency and the draft have concluded to calculate the ideal amount of cap relief.

5.)If the major portion of this deal was done, it would've gotten done. When you negotiate a salary, or if you haven't you know up front what you want. Same as with purchasing a car. You have a number and you get there. The reason I keep harping to this, is because this is what was brought up by Drew, Coach Payton and GM Mickey Loomis. If they were close this would've gotten done. They aren't close. Stop kidding yourself thinking you're Chris Mortensen.

We still can sign a proven guard, or draft one. We can still get a capable tackle, if they feel they don't already have one on roster, or draft one. Nothing is standing in the way of that. The restructure would and could take that into consideration.

6.)Yes we can still sign a proven guard but will this guard fit what we need? We are a team that always puts a premium on the middle three of the O-Line and not the tackles. Last year we had a change to get Evan Mathis and passed. Had a chance to get the Seattle kid, passed. We have no money. We're card counters at the table. Trying to bluff when we have nothing higher than a 6 in the hand.

No, this is the very reason why the deal should not be made until all the factors are known. It makes no sense whatsoever to get locked into a set of numbers that cannot be adjusted.

7.)Dude, its been shown what Drew means to the system. We could've simply signed him 2 seasons ago and added on two years. That alone would've sold this issue now. But I guess you like seeing Lelito and Kelemete do what they done the past 2 seasons: absolutely nothing.

You have no clue what Loomis has in the works. At this time the Saints do not need the money to sign a draft class. What they do have is plenty of time and resources to have whatever they do need when the time comes and that time is not until well after the draft has occurred.

8.)You're right I have no idea what Loomis is doing. And frankly, I don't think Loomis does either. If he did, it would've already been done. I know that the Saints have said that they are trying to get back to building through the draft, but then we spend what $5 Mill plus on Fleener and then we sign Laurinitis but don't have the numbers for that. Oh, yeah we still have to have the money to sign our draft class. But like you said Loomis has this. No he doesn't.

It is only dragging for those that do not have the patience to wait.
9.)I can tell when someone is stalling because they have no idea what they're doing. If he at least had an idea, you would see him state such when he is approached. When he is approached, even Loomis says he doesn't know what is the hold up. But in your eyes, I'm wrong. I'm sure we'll revisit this topic within the next 3 weeks when the draft is upon us and we still are in the same boat.
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Old 03-21-2016, 04:30 PM   #102
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Re: Nick Fairley in town

Originally Posted by WhoDatFan26 View Post
9.)I can tell when someone is stalling because they have no idea what they're doing. If he at least had an idea, you would see him state such when he is approached. When he is approached, even Loomis says he doesn't know what is the hold up. But in your eyes, I'm wrong. I'm sure we'll revisit this topic within the next 3 weeks when the draft is upon us and we still are in the same boat.
I gotta call bullcrap on that one. Loomis NEVER said he doesn't know what the hold is. Six days ago when asked he said, "I'm not going to address that. He's under contract." In other words, now isn't the time. Loomis has no obligation whatsoever to tell the media, or the fans, what he and Brees have been discussing in private.

And, yes, I'm sure you and others will bring it up again before it is needed. Once again, there is no reason why the extension has to be finalized prior to the draft. In fact, it is counterproductive to do it that early.
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Old 03-21-2016, 04:48 PM   #103
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Re: Nick Fairley in town

Yeah, kinda have to be thinking that even though the defensive coaches don't appear to have a clue, I'm pretty sure the front office does.
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Old 03-21-2016, 05:01 PM   #104
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Re: Nick Fairley in town

1.)They do know what they need Pass Rush, Pass Rush, Pass Rush. That has been stated since the end of the Season by Our Head Coach. So Yes they knew what they needed before Free Agency Began

I never said they don't know what they need personnel-wise. I said they don't know what they need cap wise. They won't know that until they make the move and then they can finalize the Brees deal.

2.)Actually you can. I don't like The Patriots but one thing I will give Tom Brady, if a restructuring is needed to better the team around he, he gets it done. But, I guess in The NFL this doesn't happen. Correct?

Exactly!! And as I have been preaching for the past two years, Brees will agree to a deal right in line with what Brady got at the same point in his career.

3.)We traded Jimmy Graham to get a Center in Unger and 2nd Round Pick. The funny thing is, we could've signed Graham the year before and had the contract be less than what it turned out to be.

And as I stated, Unger counted more against the cap than did Graham, and the draft pick added even more cap hit.

4.)The only major free agent we signed was Byrd and he got hurt. I don't look at Browner as being a major free agent but rather a reach because we missed on Robinson when we draft him after winning The Super Bowl.

Browner was also a big free agent signing. As I pointed out, the supposed cap problem didn't stop the Saints from signing free agents, just as it hasn't stopped them from making deals so far this off-season (Laurinaitis, Stuper and Fleener).

5.)If the major portion of this deal was done, it would've gotten done. When you negotiate a salary, or if you haven't you know up front what you want. Same as with purchasing a car. You have a number and you get there. The reason I keep harping to this, is because this is what was brought up by Drew, Coach Payton and GM Mickey Loomis. If they were close this would've gotten done. They aren't close. Stop kidding yourself thinking you're Chris Mortensen.

Why can't you get this simple concept? There is a very real reason NOT to get it done yet. While the overall numbers may have been agreed to, it only makes sense that how the deal is actually structured may very likely be dependent upon the amount of free cap space required to finish up free agency and the draft. For example, you can do a four year deal at $50 million (that could be agreed to) with a year one hit of $10M, or $15M, or $20M, or whatever. It doesn't change what the deal is for, it only changes how and when the cap hits are realized.

6.)Yes we can still sign a proven guard but will this guard fit what we need? We are a team that always puts a premium on the middle three of the O-Line and not the tackles. Last year we had a change to get Evan Mathis and passed. Had a chance to get the Seattle kid, passed. We have no money. We're card counters at the table. Trying to bluff when we have nothing higher than a 6 in the hand.

No, we have plenty of money, but exactly how much will we need? Make the FA and draft moves first THEN restructure Brees to make it all so.

7.)Dude, its been shown what Drew means to the system. We could've simply signed him 2 seasons ago and added on two years. That alone would've sold this issue now. But I guess you like seeing Lelito and Kelemete do what they done the past 2 seasons: absolutely nothing.

There was no reason to extend Brees before this off-season. That would have gained nothing.

8.)You're right I have no idea what Loomis is doing. And frankly, I don't think Loomis does either. If he did, it would've already been done. I know that the Saints have said that they are trying to get back to building through the draft, but then we spend what $5 Mill plus on Fleener and then we sign Laurinitis but don't have the numbers for that. Oh, yeah we still have to have the money to sign our draft class. But like you said Loomis has this. No he doesn't.

So, because Loomis hasn't satisfied your personal impatience you feel he has no clue what he is doing? I have no doubt whatsoever that Loomis has multiple scenarios worked out that will give Payton what he wants through free agency and easily cover the draft class. Going back to your car example, do you go to the bank and sell off a slew of your savings bonds and then go out to buy your car? No. Why? Because you don't know yet how much you will need until you find the car you want. You don't want to cash in anymore than you need and you don't want to have to go back and sell more because you didn't get enough the first time around. Same exact concept. Brees' extension is Loomis' savings bonds. It gives him complete flexibility to make whatever move is required with minimal waste.
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Old 03-21-2016, 05:01 PM   #105
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Re: Nick Fairley in town

Maybe it's a "rock-star" issue, like Nick wants 1000 green M&M's in a brandy glass before he takes the field each game, #shrug.
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Old 03-21-2016, 06:14 PM   #106
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Re: Nick Fairley in town

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Old 03-21-2016, 07:25 PM   #107
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Re: Nick Fairley in town

Originally Posted by SloMotion View Post
Maybe it's a "rock-star" issue, like Nick wants 1000 green M&M's in a brandy glass before he takes the field each game, #shrug.
It was BROWN M&Ms (because they taste funny and suck). C'mon man. LOL

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Old 03-21-2016, 09:33 PM   #108
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Re: Nick Fairley in town

Originally Posted by AsylumGuido View Post
1.)They do know what they need Pass Rush, Pass Rush, Pass Rush. That has been stated since the end of the Season by Our Head Coach. So Yes they knew what they needed before Free Agency Began

I never said they don't know what they need personnel-wise. I said they don't know what they need cap wise. They won't know that until they make the move and then they can finalize the Brees deal.

2.)Actually you can. I don't like The Patriots but one thing I will give Tom Brady, if a restructuring is needed to better the team around he, he gets it done. But, I guess in The NFL this doesn't happen. Correct?

Exactly!! And as I have been preaching for the past two years, Brees will agree to a deal right in line with what Brady got at the same point in his career.

3.)We traded Jimmy Graham to get a Center in Unger and 2nd Round Pick. The funny thing is, we could've signed Graham the year before and had the contract be less than what it turned out to be.

And as I stated, Unger counted more against the cap than did Graham, and the draft pick added even more cap hit.

4.)The only major free agent we signed was Byrd and he got hurt. I don't look at Browner as being a major free agent but rather a reach because we missed on Robinson when we draft him after winning The Super Bowl.

Browner was also a big free agent signing. As I pointed out, the supposed cap problem didn't stop the Saints from signing free agents, just as it hasn't stopped them from making deals so far this off-season (Laurinaitis, Stuper and Fleener).

5.)If the major portion of this deal was done, it would've gotten done. When you negotiate a salary, or if you haven't you know up front what you want. Same as with purchasing a car. You have a number and you get there. The reason I keep harping to this, is because this is what was brought up by Drew, Coach Payton and GM Mickey Loomis. If they were close this would've gotten done. They aren't close. Stop kidding yourself thinking you're Chris Mortensen.

Why can't you get this simple concept? There is a very real reason NOT to get it done yet. While the overall numbers may have been agreed to, it only makes sense that how the deal is actually structured may very likely be dependent upon the amount of free cap space required to finish up free agency and the draft. For example, you can do a four year deal at $50 million (that could be agreed to) with a year one hit of $10M, or $15M, or $20M, or whatever. It doesn't change what the deal is for, it only changes how and when the cap hits are realized.

6.)Yes we can still sign a proven guard but will this guard fit what we need? We are a team that always puts a premium on the middle three of the O-Line and not the tackles. Last year we had a change to get Evan Mathis and passed. Had a chance to get the Seattle kid, passed. We have no money. We're card counters at the table. Trying to bluff when we have nothing higher than a 6 in the hand.

No, we have plenty of money, but exactly how much will we need? Make the FA and draft moves first THEN restructure Brees to make it all so.

7.)Dude, its been shown what Drew means to the system. We could've simply signed him 2 seasons ago and added on two years. That alone would've sold this issue now. But I guess you like seeing Lelito and Kelemete do what they done the past 2 seasons: absolutely nothing.

There was no reason to extend Brees before this off-season. That would have gained nothing.

8.)You're right I have no idea what Loomis is doing. And frankly, I don't think Loomis does either. If he did, it would've already been done. I know that the Saints have said that they are trying to get back to building through the draft, but then we spend what $5 Mill plus on Fleener and then we sign Laurinitis but don't have the numbers for that. Oh, yeah we still have to have the money to sign our draft class. But like you said Loomis has this. No he doesn't.

So, because Loomis hasn't satisfied your personal impatience you feel he has no clue what he is doing? I have no doubt whatsoever that Loomis has multiple scenarios worked out that will give Payton what he wants through free agency and easily cover the draft class. Going back to your car example, do you go to the bank and sell off a slew of your savings bonds and then go out to buy your car? No. Why? Because you don't know yet how much you will need until you find the car you want. You don't want to cash in anymore than you need and you don't want to have to go back and sell more because you didn't get enough the first time around. Same exact concept. Brees' extension is Loomis' savings bonds. It gives him complete flexibility to make whatever move is required with minimal waste.
Here is the latest on Drew's contract. Notice how the player is quoted as saying: "He doesn't know when or if a deal with eventually be completed." This is bad business on the part of Loomis. This needs to get done, but I'm sure you will attempt to downplay it again.
Drew Brees says contract talks with Saints are ongoing, wants to finish career in New Orleans | NOLA.com
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Old 03-21-2016, 10:07 PM   #109
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Re: Nick Fairley in town

I bet Elway would want him. I'm not a fan of any type of long term deal. Maybe extend a year, not sure I would do a 2 year extention .Brees years have been waisted by a horrid D. Although I will give Williams credit for his D, they bought in to what he was selling.Something I haven't seen since.
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Old 03-21-2016, 11:28 PM   #110
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Re: Nick Fairley in town

Where do Saints stand with free-agent DT Nick Fairley? | NOLA.com
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