Darren Howard Trade?
 

What would yal think is the Saints were to somehow trade up w/ Clevelend at 3 in exchange for Howard, our 1, 3, and 4or5. This was brought up on another site's forum and I was wondering your thoughts.

It actually makes since b/c the Brows have alot of holes and DE is one of the big ones. They could get more picks a 26 year old superstar and we could draft DJ.

Darren Howard Trade?
 

NO NO NO... trading up will be the biggest mistake we make at this point. Getting extra picks in the 2nd round is what we need, there is a lot of talent across the board this year, snagging one great player and missing out on getting 2-3 great players... bad.

Darren Howard Trade?
 

The thought of a top 5 pick is tempting , I will admit..

But, Howard..our 1st, 3rd and a 4th is just too big a price to pay...

Maybe Howard..our 1st..then maybe a 5th or lower...

I would be happy to see that...

Darren Howard Trade?
 

lets think about it you would try all that for Dj if the saints would do that why dont they just go afterJamie sharper for a 4th or go after hartwell :casstet: they would have a twice as immediate impact,but i think johson would be better down the road..

Im to a huge Dj Fan and would love for him to hold up that saints jersey but face it, the only way were gonna get Dj is if we trade with the titans(Which i can see this possible of happening doing that they couldnt afford me to there roster)

But also the browns would half to take Smith or Rolle and with the signing of Baxter and Crennel saying hes going to 3-4 ive heard and the browns having no Lbs at all really i see it being someone else. we pick up

Darren Howard Trade?
 

I think it would take Howard, #16, and another to get #3 valuewise

Darren Howard Trade?
 

whole heartedly agreed-plus that is way too many picks for the third this year.

Darren Howard Trade?
 

Alright E, you\'re going to have to help me out...

I know the one exceptional player to trade up to: DJ Johnson.

Now help me out with two \"great\" players that\'ll be available at #16 and #40 that are comparable.

I just don\'t see it.

My current thesis is that the Saints needs to get an exceptional playmaker who\'s superior talents will superceed the inevitable poor coaching and scheme that\'ll persist with the current regime.

DJ Johnson is exceptional.

Now who are we talking about that\'s great enough to overcome the obsticles that they will face?

SFIAH

Darren Howard Trade?
 

I don\'t think that Derrick Johnson is worth that many picks AND Darren Howard. I think that we\'ll explore a way to deal Howard for a lower first-round pick just because of the position he plays. Then we\'d have two first-round picks, and the 8th pick in the second round. Not too bad...

Darren Howard Trade?
 

if it were me-I\'d do that...and then get say thomas davis, and a couple of linebackers or thomas davis, a decent cornerback and castillo..or whatever and fill more than one position with solid players.

Darren Howard Trade?
 

I think the Titans pick can be had for our first, Howard, and a third. I don\'t think that\'s too much to ask for the best defensive prospect in at least the past 5 or 6 years. I don\'t think people are grasping the gravity of this situation. I also don\'t think that people that say he isn\'t worth the picks have seen him play. This is a far cry from a Sully situation. DJ is as sure a thing as sure things get.

Better than Vilma....hands down
Better than DJ Williams....hands down
I think he\'s even better than Arrington was when he came out.

LBs historically don\'t bust when they are picked as high as he\'ll be picked.

[Edited on 12/4/2005 by GoldenTomb]

Darren Howard Trade?
 

I personally would rather trade Howard to the Cowboys for their second rounder pick up Thomas Davis at 16 to play SS and put Bellamy on the bench. At 40 I would pick up Burnett for LB out of Tennessee who is a better athlete than D.J. or Blackstock out of Virginia. We would then have another 2nd rounder to pick up either a ROT,DT,CB whichever was the higher ranked player on the board.+
Their is absolutely no way you trade up in this years draft so void of blue chip talent.

Darren Howard Trade?
 

I dont like the idea. Trading all that for an unproved player.
How ofter do the top prospects fail? (1st rouders fail more often then not)

Darren Howard Trade?
 

That\'s what this team needs....better athletes. :casstet:

That makes even a stronger case for DJ. If he is there at 5 pull the trigger, or at least try.

Darren Howard Trade?
 

I\'m saying I think Burnett is a better athlete than D.J. Why would we move up to get D.J. and lose draft picks when we can get Burnett in the second round for free?

Darren Howard Trade?
 

burnett would be a heckuva Linebacker...if we happened to get him...he started at safety and was a running back in high school-i think.

he is only dropping because of this injury a couple of years back..but I assure you he\'s over it...I personally would like to get burnett plus a couple of other picks..but that\'s just me.

Darren Howard Trade?
 

Huh....are you serious? I couldn\'t disagree more. What do you mean by fail??? I think of fail as in out of the NFL, on the practice squad or on the inactive roster.

Let\'s put your theory to the test anyway.

1. Eli Manning - starter
2. Robert Gallery - starter
3. Larry Fitzgerald - starter
4. Philip Rivers -backup to Pro Bowler Drew Brees
5. Sean Taylor - starter
6. Kellen Winslow - injured reserve
7. Roy Williams - starter
8. DeAngelo Hall - starter
9. Reggie Williams - 2nd string
10. Dunta Robinson - starter
11. Ben Roethlisberger - starter
12. Jonathan Vilma - starter
13. Lee Evans - starter
14. Tommie Harris - starter
15. Michael Clayton - starter
16. Shawn Andrews - starter in 05
17. DJ Williams- starter
18. Will Smith - starter in 05
19. Vernon Carey - starter in 05
20. Kenechi Udeze - starter
21. Vince Wilfork - backup
22. JP Losman -starter in 05
23. Marcus Tubbs - backup
24. Steven Jackson - starter
25. Ahmad Carroll - back up
26. Chris Perry - backup
27. Jason Babin - starter in 05
28. Chris Gamble - starter
29. Michael Jenkins - back up
30. Kevin Jones - starter
31. Rashaun Woods - back up
32. Ben Watson - back up

Even if u call the back ups failures, the first rounders still did well. Much better ratio of successes to failures than if I did this with the second round picks. There\'s a reason they go in the first round.

Darren Howard Trade?
 

You are willing to give Burnett a pass on his injury history but not Crowder????

Darren Howard Trade?
 

I think everyone can safely say that this draft is not even in the same galaxy as last years draft. I.E. In this type of draft where blue chip talent is just not there it is a crapshoot on who will pan out from the first round so you should grab as many top two round picks as you possibly can and hope some of them stick.

Darren Howard Trade?
 

I like Crowder as well, but he is an inside LB and we need outside LB\'s if Watson is the answer inside. Which is a big if by the way.

Darren Howard Trade?
 

oh heck yeah-I saw both of them playe and burnett was a beast...the leader of that defense...burnett was also team captain and had much less off the feild trouble then crowder.


also-tennessee was a much better team than florida and burnett was part of the reason.

Darren Howard Trade?
 

that\'s actually another reason...someone convinced me that experience was a key ingredient for MLB so I am thinking keep watson in the middle linebacker and get an OLB.

Darren Howard Trade?
 

I personally put Burnett right up their with D.J. Williams from last year on pure talent. We missed out on Williams last year by one pick and knowing our luck we will miss out on Burnett by one pick in the second round this year.

Darren Howard Trade?
 

All the more reason to try and secure the best LB prospect since LeVar Arrington.

Darren Howard Trade?
 

another thing you gotta look at is-how would they fit in in our locker room/scheme/plans/city...I think that burnett would fit very well in what they are trying to do..I think crowder would spend half his time in bar fights and jail down on bourbon and st. charles.

Darren Howard Trade?
 

:casstet:

Look I love D.J. but under no circumstance do I see the value of trading into the top 5 to get him. If he is available at 11 and the Cowboys want to trade the pick with us for Howard as well as throw in a second rounder so be it. Other than that we need far too much help in our entire defense to sabatoge our entire draft for one player.
You probably loved that Ditka trade for Ricky Williams didn\'t you. He was a Longhorn too. Who cares if that trade set us back 5 years or is widely regarded as the worst draft day trade in the history of the draft. We got Williams and the Redskins got Arrington and Champ Bailey. I.E. we got screwed and the same will happen if we trade up to get D.J. in the top 5.
Moreover, I see your icon and it appears that the burnt orange has you blinded to the value of D. J. You don\'t happen to be a Longhorn fan do you?

[Edited on 12/4/2005 by stockman311]

Darren Howard Trade?
 

I think the line between trading up for DJ and not doing so is pretty close. The only difference seems to be in what we would have to give up to get him. For the most part, I amhearing if we don\'t have to pull a Ricky Williams and give up our whole draft, or half of it, it is a very good idea. On the other side, seems like giving up a little more to get a player of this caliber seems reasonable. One thing is, with the amount of teams in cap trouble at the top of the draft, the lack of a true #1, and the depth at certain key positions high in the draft, this would be a better year than most to trade up, and for our team, DJ is worth it. Bar none, the best defensive player in the draft. Worst case scenario he is a Takeo Spikes type player. Best case, he is the next Derrick Brooks. Not bad odds. I am so tired of hearing the draft is a crap shoot, why not just let every college player be a free agent then and sign with whatever team they want to? Some players in some systems are worth the proce, and as many years as we have gone without a dominant, play-making LB, I don\'t see how we can sit back and hope for whatever\'s left IF the chance to move up for DJ is there.

Darren Howard Trade?
 

Well Crowder is a secondary want for me. DJ is primary....and I do actually think the FO will make a serious run at him.

Darren Howard Trade?
 

Honestly speaking I was optimistic when we picked RW. I thought it was a rather excessive frivilous trade, but I looked at the positives. Who knew he\'d turn out to be such a loon. I find it hard to believe that you weren\'t happy in some sense that day, if you were truly a Saints fan. I was listening to the radio as the pick came down, and every Saints fan I could hear was ecstatic, so don\'t play the \"I knew it all along\" card.

Having said all that....how does trading Howard(who we are getting rid of anyway) plus our first(which we\'ll swap with the Titans) and a third set us back 5 years? I think that\'s all it would take. As far as I know, we still have at least 5 more picks. plus free agency. Just because you make one mistake, doesn\'t mean you curl up in a shell and refuse to take chances. You have to take chances at everything in life to realize success.

And I\'m an LSU fan....I am a big Derrick Johnson fan and have been for 3 years now. I\'m convinced that you haven\'t seen him play before if you are this opposed to drafting him at 6.

Darren Howard Trade?
 

yes, but you must calculate those chances-point is-we have so many needs that trading half our draft picks would kill our depth...if we draft right-we could have outstanding depth.

Darren Howard Trade?
 

Yeah and how many years do we say that exact same thing?? I have no confidence in this FO\'s scouting ability across the board, but DJ is the one pick that even they can\'t mess up.

Darren Howard Trade?
 

I have no idea how GT\'s suggestion of trading Howard, a swap of firsts and our 3rd rounder equates to half our draft. We would still have a 2nd, and a pick in every other round except the third. Doesn\'t seem like that much to give up for the consensus best defensive player int he draft. I have seen him play GT. More than I would like actually. DJ is phenomenal. IF we don\'t make a run at him, we will be looking like we did when we didn\'t take Moss or picked Alex Molden over Eddie George.

Darren Howard Trade?
 

Since Dallas has dropped out of the trade rumors....are the Raiders still wanting to send Charles Woodson or Phillip Buchanon or both. I think it would help our secondary out tremendously if we could get one or both to accomodate McKenzie.

Darren Howard Trade?
 

I don\'t think the Cowboys have dropped out of the running for Howard. However, I have been a huge advocate of Woodson and would still love to see him opposite MM. We could then pick Crowder at 40.