Drew Brees

frydaddy · 12-05-2016, 05:16 PM

Originally Posted by WillSaints81

2000:10-6
2002:9-7
2003:8-8
2004:8-8

LOL! You would have us revisit the Haslett years? Payton may not be perfect but good gawd man. You could have at least thrown in some of the winning seasons we had under Mora to maintain some credibility. You're off in lala land if you think the early 2000's were a better time for this team.

Rell&Gold · 12-05-2016, 08:12 PM

Im so glad some of you don't have any say in personnel decisions because a lot them would be emotional based decisions

WillSaints81 · 12-05-2016, 11:34 PM

Originally Posted by frydaddy

LOL! You would have us revisit the Haslett years? Payton may not be perfect but good gawd man. You could have at least thrown in some of the winning seasons we had under Mora to maintain some credibility. You're off in lala land if you think the early 2000's were a better time for this team.

I never said they were better. But Carolina and TB have found their way back in the mix. The NFC South is a division of parity. Vick and Ryan for Atlanta. Delhomme and Newton for Carolina. Gruden/Winston for TB. We were knocking on the door of making playoffs before Katrina. Look at how close most of those losses were in 2005. We would have had 10 wins if not for Katrina. And trust me we have already set a precedent for QBs to want to play here post-Brees. But I will say this nostalgia is bad. And sometimes the only cure for both parties is to start fresh. Brees has a better chance with other teams.

I was basically acknowledging the fact that we were not a 3-4 win team right before Katrina. And it's not like Delhomme and Williams was not in our lap. I don't think our org will ever be stupid enough to draft a read option QB, including a Manziel. This org is always going to model their QBs after Brees. Just like Big Ben is modeled after Bradshaw and Romo after Aiken.

WillSaints81 · 12-05-2016, 11:40 PM

Originally Posted by Rell&Gold

Im so glad some of you don't have any say in personnel decisions because a lot them would be emotional based decisions

No. I pretty much have nailed the recent QBs success rates coming out of college. I would surely know the QB to draft to replace Brees. I would surely know that after Brees we will need to change philosophy from a pass first team to a run first team so I would get a big RB and fix the mess at oline. Also, I would stay away from defense-minded head coaches and look for someone like Haley or Norv.

foreverfan · 12-05-2016, 11:48 PM

YOU SHOULD NEVER BLAME BREES...

Year. Team CMP% YDS. TD INT Rating
2016 Saints 71.4 3,913 30 11 105.0

The Dude · 12-06-2016, 12:03 AM

Brees isn't the problem. He had a bad game for sure but without him we would be looking at our 3rd 1-2 win seasons in a row. He can still perform at an elite level. Tell me another option that's available that would be better. If we keep him protected and get some real playmakers at TE and receiver it will extend his career. For this reason getting rid of Cooks is dumb. We have money this offseason and can afford a couple good pieces.

jnormand · 12-06-2016, 02:07 AM

Getting rid of Brees would be devastating. To think of it is completely ridiculous.

burningmetal · 12-06-2016, 04:25 AM

I had a lot of issues with this game, and I'm not sure I can name many who didn't botch something. The line was not good in pass protection, but on his first two interceptions he had plenty of time and just made horrible throws. I noticed that he kept staring down Cooks every time he threw his way. Reminded me of the later Jimmy Graham years.

The lack of balance in play calling was evident to everyone, and was miserable.

Payton cost us a timeout by challenging a call that wasn't even reviewable. Cooks was clearly not down, but they called him down and you can't change that. I can't believe that no one on the Saints sideline said anything to Payton about that, and I can't believe he didn't know that. Also, I couldn't believe the refs LET him challenge it. When something isn't reviewable, they are supposed to say that. It was a total waste of a challenge and timeout, especially when it was first and goal inside the 1.

Fleener had multiple critical drops. He is everything he was in Indy. A guy who might put up some stats, because he isn't a true tight end and can get open fairly well, but he drops way too many balls. This was common knowledge.

The defensive backfield was pathetic. They just left guys wide open all day. Breaux, in particular, got burned several times. He had perfect position on one, and seemed to literally just let Tate catch the ball. He made no effort to knock the ball away despite the fact that he was pretty much running the route for the receiver. This entire secondary has atrocious ball skills. Even when they are playing decent, they don't make big plays. There were multiple dropped interceptions, again.

I'm sure there is more, but that's about all I care to say about the negatives. Too many of them.

dizzle88 · 12-06-2016, 04:36 AM

Originally Posted by burningmetal

I had a lot of issues with this game, and I'm not sure I can name many who didn't botch something. The line was not good in pass protection, but on his first two interceptions he had plenty of time and just made horrible throws. I noticed that he kept staring down Cooks every time he threw his way. Reminded me of the later Jimmy Graham years.

The lack of balance in play calling was evident to everyone, and was miserable.

Payton cost us a timeout by challenging a call that wasn't even reviewable. Cooks was clearly not down, but they called him down and you can't change that. I can't believe that no one on the Saints sideline said anything to Payton about that, and I can't believe he didn't know that. Also, I couldn't believe the refs LET him challenge it. When something isn't reviewable, they are supposed to say that. It was a total waste of a challenge and timeout, especially when it was first and goal inside the 1.

Fleener had multiple critical drops. He is everything he was in Indy. A guy who might put up some stats, because he isn't a true tight end and can get open fairly well, but he drops way too many balls. This was common knowledge.

The defensive backfield was pathetic. They just left guys wide open all day. Breaux, in particular, got burned several times. He had perfect position on one, and seemed to literally just let Tate catch the ball. He made no effort to knock the ball away despite the fact that he was pretty much running the route for the receiver. This entire secondary has atrocious ball skills. Even when they are playing decent, they don't make big plays. There were multiple dropped interceptions, again.

I'm sure there is more, but that's about all I care to say about the negatives. Too many of them.

Yeah I thought Breaux was better than that, now however I'm not really sure why we were so excited about him coming back.

He tracked the ball and literally just watched it.

A great DB would have attacked the ball and got the pick
A good/average DB would have knocked the ball down.

Breaux watched it sail straight past him into Tate's hands.

AsylumGuido · 12-06-2016, 09:44 AM

Originally Posted by burningmetal

I had a lot of issues with this game, and I'm not sure I can name many who didn't botch something. The line was not good in pass protection, but on his first two interceptions he had plenty of time and just made horrible throws. I noticed that he kept staring down Cooks every time he threw his way. Reminded me of the later Jimmy Graham years.

The lack of balance in play calling was evident to everyone, and was miserable.

Payton cost us a timeout by challenging a call that wasn't even reviewable. Cooks was clearly not down, but they called him down and you can't change that. I can't believe that no one on the Saints sideline said anything to Payton about that, and I can't believe he didn't know that. Also, I couldn't believe the refs LET him challenge it. When something isn't reviewable, they are supposed to say that. It was a total waste of a challenge and timeout, especially when it was first and goal inside the 1.

Fleener had multiple critical drops. He is everything he was in Indy. A guy who might put up some stats, because he isn't a true tight end and can get open fairly well, but he drops way too many balls. This was common knowledge.

The defensive backfield was pathetic. They just left guys wide open all day. Breaux, in particular, got burned several times. He had perfect position on one, and seemed to literally just let Tate catch the ball. He made no effort to knock the ball away despite the fact that he was pretty much running the route for the receiver. This entire secondary has atrocious ball skills. Even when they are playing decent, they don't make big plays. There were multiple dropped interceptions, again.

I'm sure there is more, but that's about all I care to say about the negatives. Too many of them.

While I agree with you that Payton definitely should not have challenged the Cooks' play, I have to disagree with you on a few of points. The play was reviewable. I know the announcer said it wasn't, but it was. Also, if it was not reviewable the refs definitely would not have accepted the review. And finally, Cooks was clearly down. Yes, he was pulled down upon the defender's body and rolled over and off, but before gaining his feet his forearm clearly hit the turf. That is down by contact.

But, with first and goal inside the one, Payton should never have taken the chance.

12-05-2016, 05:16 PM	#21
frydaddy 1000 Posts + Join Date: Sep 2011 Location: Lafayette Posts: 1,947 Blog Entries: 1	Re: Drew Brees Originally Posted by WillSaints81 2000:10-6 2002:9-7 2003:8-8 2004:8-8 LOL! You would have us revisit the Haslett years? Payton may not be perfect but good gawd man. You could have at least thrown in some of the winning seasons we had under Mora to maintain some credibility. You're off in lala land if you think the early 2000's were a better time for this team. AsylumGuido and Utah_Saint like this.

12-05-2016, 08:12 PM	#22
Rell&Gold 1000 Posts + Join Date: Apr 2012 Location: Washington, D.C Posts: 2,874	Re: Drew Brees Im so glad some of you don't have any say in personnel decisions because a lot them would be emotional based decisions Beastmode likes this.

12-05-2016, 11:34 PM	#23
WillSaints81 1000 Posts + Join Date: Oct 2012 Posts: 4,267	Re: Drew Brees Originally Posted by frydaddy LOL! You would have us revisit the Haslett years? Payton may not be perfect but good gawd man. You could have at least thrown in some of the winning seasons we had under Mora to maintain some credibility. You're off in lala land if you think the early 2000's were a better time for this team. I never said they were better. But Carolina and TB have found their way back in the mix. The NFC South is a division of parity. Vick and Ryan for Atlanta. Delhomme and Newton for Carolina. Gruden/Winston for TB. We were knocking on the door of making playoffs before Katrina. Look at how close most of those losses were in 2005. We would have had 10 wins if not for Katrina. And trust me we have already set a precedent for QBs to want to play here post-Brees. But I will say this nostalgia is bad. And sometimes the only cure for both parties is to start fresh. Brees has a better chance with other teams. I was basically acknowledging the fact that we were not a 3-4 win team right before Katrina. And it's not like Delhomme and Williams was not in our lap. I don't think our org will ever be stupid enough to draft a read option QB, including a Manziel. This org is always going to model their QBs after Brees. Just like Big Ben is modeled after Bradshaw and Romo after Aiken.

12-05-2016, 11:40 PM	#24
WillSaints81 1000 Posts + Join Date: Oct 2012 Posts: 4,267	Re: Drew Brees Originally Posted by Rell&Gold Im so glad some of you don't have any say in personnel decisions because a lot them would be emotional based decisions No. I pretty much have nailed the recent QBs success rates coming out of college. I would surely know the QB to draft to replace Brees. I would surely know that after Brees we will need to change philosophy from a pass first team to a run first team so I would get a big RB and fix the mess at oline. Also, I would stay away from defense-minded head coaches and look for someone like Haley or Norv.

12-05-2016, 11:48 PM	#25
foreverfan 12,000 BS Posts Join Date: Mar 2006 Location: Metairie, LA Posts: 13,457 Blog Entries: 5	Re: Drew Brees YOU SHOULD NEVER BLAME BREES... Year. Team CMP% YDS. TD INT Rating 2016 Saints 71.4 3,913 30 11 105.0 jeanpierre likes this.

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12-06-2016, 12:03 AM	#26
The Dude 5000 POSTS! + Join Date: Jul 2011 Posts: 9,006	Re: Drew Brees Brees isn't the problem. He had a bad game for sure but without him we would be looking at our 3rd 1-2 win seasons in a row. He can still perform at an elite level. Tell me another option that's available that would be better. If we keep him protected and get some real playmakers at TE and receiver it will extend his career. For this reason getting rid of Cooks is dumb. We have money this offseason and can afford a couple good pieces. jnormand and darksoul35 like this.
The Dude 5000 POSTS! + Join Date: Jul 2011 Posts: 9,006

12-06-2016, 02:07 AM	#27
jnormand 5000 POSTS! + Join Date: Sep 2003 Location: The Free State of Idaho Posts: 5,530	Re: Drew Brees Getting rid of Brees would be devastating. To think of it is completely ridiculous. The Dude and darksoul35 like this.

12-06-2016, 04:25 AM	#28
burningmetal 1000 Posts + Join Date: Mar 2012 Posts: 3,905 Blog Entries: 3	Re: Drew Brees I had a lot of issues with this game, and I'm not sure I can name many who didn't botch something. The line was not good in pass protection, but on his first two interceptions he had plenty of time and just made horrible throws. I noticed that he kept staring down Cooks every time he threw his way. Reminded me of the later Jimmy Graham years. The lack of balance in play calling was evident to everyone, and was miserable. Payton cost us a timeout by challenging a call that wasn't even reviewable. Cooks was clearly not down, but they called him down and you can't change that. I can't believe that no one on the Saints sideline said anything to Payton about that, and I can't believe he didn't know that. Also, I couldn't believe the refs LET him challenge it. When something isn't reviewable, they are supposed to say that. It was a total waste of a challenge and timeout, especially when it was first and goal inside the 1. Fleener had multiple critical drops. He is everything he was in Indy. A guy who might put up some stats, because he isn't a true tight end and can get open fairly well, but he drops way too many balls. This was common knowledge. The defensive backfield was pathetic. They just left guys wide open all day. Breaux, in particular, got burned several times. He had perfect position on one, and seemed to literally just let Tate catch the ball. He made no effort to knock the ball away despite the fact that he was pretty much running the route for the receiver. This entire secondary has atrocious ball skills. Even when they are playing decent, they don't make big plays. There were multiple dropped interceptions, again. I'm sure there is more, but that's about all I care to say about the negatives. Too many of them. jeanpierre and dizzle88 like this.
	If I had a nickel for every time I heard that, the NFL would fine and suspend me.

12-06-2016, 04:36 AM	#29
dizzle88 10000 POST CLUB Join Date: Oct 2009 Posts: 10,838	Re: Drew Brees Originally Posted by burningmetal I had a lot of issues with this game, and I'm not sure I can name many who didn't botch something. The line was not good in pass protection, but on his first two interceptions he had plenty of time and just made horrible throws. I noticed that he kept staring down Cooks every time he threw his way. Reminded me of the later Jimmy Graham years. The lack of balance in play calling was evident to everyone, and was miserable. Payton cost us a timeout by challenging a call that wasn't even reviewable. Cooks was clearly not down, but they called him down and you can't change that. I can't believe that no one on the Saints sideline said anything to Payton about that, and I can't believe he didn't know that. Also, I couldn't believe the refs LET him challenge it. When something isn't reviewable, they are supposed to say that. It was a total waste of a challenge and timeout, especially when it was first and goal inside the 1. Fleener had multiple critical drops. He is everything he was in Indy. A guy who might put up some stats, because he isn't a true tight end and can get open fairly well, but he drops way too many balls. This was common knowledge. The defensive backfield was pathetic. They just left guys wide open all day. Breaux, in particular, got burned several times. He had perfect position on one, and seemed to literally just let Tate catch the ball. He made no effort to knock the ball away despite the fact that he was pretty much running the route for the receiver. This entire secondary has atrocious ball skills. Even when they are playing decent, they don't make big plays. There were multiple dropped interceptions, again. I'm sure there is more, but that's about all I care to say about the negatives. Too many of them. Yeah I thought Breaux was better than that, now however I'm not really sure why we were so excited about him coming back. He tracked the ball and literally just watched it. A great DB would have attacked the ball and got the pick A good/average DB would have knocked the ball down. Breaux watched it sail straight past him into Tate's hands.

12-06-2016, 09:44 AM	#30
AsylumGuido 10000 POST CLUB Join Date: Sep 2007 Location: Bossier City, LA Posts: 24,391	Re: Drew Brees Originally Posted by burningmetal I had a lot of issues with this game, and I'm not sure I can name many who didn't botch something. The line was not good in pass protection, but on his first two interceptions he had plenty of time and just made horrible throws. I noticed that he kept staring down Cooks every time he threw his way. Reminded me of the later Jimmy Graham years. The lack of balance in play calling was evident to everyone, and was miserable. Payton cost us a timeout by challenging a call that wasn't even reviewable. Cooks was clearly not down, but they called him down and you can't change that. I can't believe that no one on the Saints sideline said anything to Payton about that, and I can't believe he didn't know that. Also, I couldn't believe the refs LET him challenge it. When something isn't reviewable, they are supposed to say that. It was a total waste of a challenge and timeout, especially when it was first and goal inside the 1. Fleener had multiple critical drops. He is everything he was in Indy. A guy who might put up some stats, because he isn't a true tight end and can get open fairly well, but he drops way too many balls. This was common knowledge. The defensive backfield was pathetic. They just left guys wide open all day. Breaux, in particular, got burned several times. He had perfect position on one, and seemed to literally just let Tate catch the ball. He made no effort to knock the ball away despite the fact that he was pretty much running the route for the receiver. This entire secondary has atrocious ball skills. Even when they are playing decent, they don't make big plays. There were multiple dropped interceptions, again. I'm sure there is more, but that's about all I care to say about the negatives. Too many of them. While I agree with you that Payton definitely should not have challenged the Cooks' play, I have to disagree with you on a few of points. The play was reviewable. I know the announcer said it wasn't, but it was. Also, if it was not reviewable the refs definitely would not have accepted the review. And finally, Cooks was clearly down. Yes, he was pulled down upon the defender's body and rolled over and off, but before gaining his feet his forearm clearly hit the turf. That is down by contact. But, with first and goal inside the one, Payton should never have taken the chance. Rugby Saint II likes this.
	“The pessimist sees difficulty in every opportunity. The optimist sees the opportunity in every difficulty.” — Winston Churchill

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