Breaking: Malcolm Butler visiting Saints Thursday!

lee909 · 03-14-2017, 03:43 PM

He wont sign a deal
They talk about a deal in principle

ML: What are you looking for each year?

MB: 14ml a year

ML: We are thinking more in the 12ml range

and on and on

ML: Ok that sounds like something we can think about and we will get back to you in the coming days

ML: Hey Bill,what do you want in trade for Butler

BB: We want a 1

ML we are thinking

And on

ML: Ok thats a deal we can do

BB: Malcolm we have a trade offer from the Saints,we cant execute a trade without you signing your tender

Tender signed
Deal done

Butler turns up in Nola

A few days later announced that the Saints and Butler have agreed a new long term agreement

burningmetal · 03-14-2017, 03:44 PM

They can't NOT offer him. They can't negotiate if they don't offer, and the Patriots aren't going to just let him go for lesser picks when they can get the number 11. I mean, I hope I'm totally wrong, but I don't see the Patriots playing nice with us after that Cooks trade.

burningmetal · 03-14-2017, 03:48 PM

Originally Posted by lee909

He wont sign a deal
They talk about a deal in principle

ML: What are you looking for each year?

MB: 14ml a year

ML: We are thinking more in the 12ml range

and on and on

ML: Ok that sounds like something we can think about and we will get back to you in the coming days

ML: Hey Bill,what do you want in trade for Butler

BB: We want a 1

ML we are thinking

And on

ML: Ok thats a deal we can do

BB: Malcolm we have a trade offer from the Saints,we cant execute a trade without you signing your tender

Tender signed
Deal done

Butler turns up in Nola

A few days later announced that the Saints and Butler have agreed a new long term agreement

Right, I get all of that, Lee. You're arguing that they won't get him without making sure they have a long term deal. That's not what I'm arguing. I'm saying he's not worth it, in my opinion. Giving up our Number 1 pick is automatic.

You seem to be assuming, though, that the Patriots would be willing to trade him without waiting for the Saints to make an offer. What makes you believe they will operate on our terms?

lee909 · 03-14-2017, 03:51 PM

So long as he signs nothing then no deal has been agreed(even if it has behind closed doors). Bring him in and send him back without a deal and see what they want in trade. Thats all im saying.

All teams talk to agents behind the scenes to talk outline of numbers

The Pats may well take less as if they dont they have a p1ssed off player ad a player that is a FA next year and assuming they dont sign a same value player the max they get is a 2019 3rd round comp pick

burningmetal · 03-14-2017, 03:55 PM

Originally Posted by lee909

So long as he signs nothing then no deal has been agreed(even if it has behind closed doors). Bring him in and send him back without a deal and see what they want in trade. Thats all im saying.

All teams talk to agents behind the scenes to talk outline of numbers

The Pats may well take less as if they dont they have a p1ssed off player ad a player that is a FA next year and assuming they dont sign a same value player the max they get is a 2019 3rd round comp pick

You could very well be right that they do that, though I don't see it happening that way. I think it's more likely they shop him to another team if the Saints won't make a formal offer.

I don't want to even give up the #32 pick for him, personally, for the reasons I've stated. But I absolutely would not give up the #11.

spkb25 · 03-14-2017, 04:00 PM

Originally Posted by burningmetal

You could very well be right that they do that, though I don't see it happening that way. I think it's more likely they shop him to another team if the Saints won't make a formal offer.

I don't want to even give up the #32 pick for him, personally, for the reasons I've stated. But I absolutely would not give up the #11.

Me neither. Am I wonrg or did he turn down 14m per year from the Pats?

lee909 · 03-14-2017, 04:03 PM

Originally Posted by burningmetal

You could very well be right that they do that, though I don't see it happening that way. I think it's more likely they shop him to another team if the Saints won't make a formal offer.

I don't want to even give up the #32 pick for him, personally, for the reasons I've stated. But I absolutely would not give up the #11.

Im in full agreement

I dont want to give anything beyond a 3 up
I could stomach a 2 but not happily

Id rather draft a CB and bring back Moore and go after Butler next year if needed fr nothing

burningmetal · 03-14-2017, 04:16 PM

Originally Posted by lee909

Im in full agreement

I dont want to give anything beyond a 3 up
I could stomach a 2 but not happily

Id rather draft a CB and bring back Moore and go after Butler next year if needed fr nothing

Yeah, I'm just not really feeling the priority behind getting a corner at all, but if they are concerned about depth, I could see drafting one in the second round and using those two first rounders on more pressing needs.

But if they think they HAVE to have Butler, I wouldn't want to give up more than a 2nd, either. I'm as certain as I can be that they would trade rape us again, though.

AsylumGuido · 03-14-2017, 05:06 PM

Originally Posted by spkb25

More conjecture and rhetoric. 7-9 again and he is as good as gone. He was forced to fire staff

He wasn't FORCED to fire anyone. Payton runs the show. Benson wouldn't order him to fire anyone. Loomis sure wouldn't. He fired them because they weren't doing their jobs adequately. It's as simple as that. Payton is FAR from stupid. He clearly knew changes were needed in those areas. Hell, the dimwits around here could see that, you know Payton had to have been able to see the same. We all know your bias against Payton. It borders on illogical hatred.

AsylumGuido · 03-14-2017, 05:11 PM

Originally Posted by burningmetal

I know. I just wrote an essay, basically, on why I don't like that.

And it isn't just talk. If the Saints actually want Butler, they have no choice. The Patriots are not going to match any offer we make, and we all know it. That means we give up our #11, automatically.

Not if he signs the tender and then they trade him. The Saints can then replace that tender with an agreed upon long-term deal. A 1st rounder doesn't come into play at all.

03-14-2017, 03:43 PM	#61
lee909 Site Donor 2015 Join Date: Mar 2012 Location: Watford England Posts: 8,716 Blog Entries: 1	Re: Breaking: Malcolm Butler visiting Saints Thursday! He wont sign a deal They talk about a deal in principle ML: What are you looking for each year? MB: 14ml a year ML: We are thinking more in the 12ml range and on and on ML: Ok that sounds like something we can think about and we will get back to you in the coming days ML: Hey Bill,what do you want in trade for Butler BB: We want a 1 ML we are thinking And on ML: Ok thats a deal we can do BB: Malcolm we have a trade offer from the Saints,we cant execute a trade without you signing your tender Tender signed Deal done Butler turns up in Nola A few days later announced that the Saints and Butler have agreed a new long term agreement ScottF likes this.
	"Two receivers to the left, Garcon to the right. Manning in the shotgun, puts Collie in motion. Looks in his direction...it's picked off! It's picked off! It's Tracy Porter again! He's runnin' free! He's gonna go all the way!

03-14-2017, 03:44 PM	#62
burningmetal 1000 Posts + Join Date: Mar 2012 Posts: 3,905 Blog Entries: 3	Re: Breaking: Malcolm Butler visiting Saints Thursday! They can't NOT offer him. They can't negotiate if they don't offer, and the Patriots aren't going to just let him go for lesser picks when they can get the number 11. I mean, I hope I'm totally wrong, but I don't see the Patriots playing nice with us after that Cooks trade.

03-14-2017, 03:48 PM	#63
burningmetal 1000 Posts + Join Date: Mar 2012 Posts: 3,905 Blog Entries: 3	Re: Breaking: Malcolm Butler visiting Saints Thursday! Originally Posted by lee909 He wont sign a deal They talk about a deal in principle ML: What are you looking for each year? MB: 14ml a year ML: We are thinking more in the 12ml range and on and on ML: Ok that sounds like something we can think about and we will get back to you in the coming days ML: Hey Bill,what do you want in trade for Butler BB: We want a 1 ML we are thinking And on ML: Ok thats a deal we can do BB: Malcolm we have a trade offer from the Saints,we cant execute a trade without you signing your tender Tender signed Deal done Butler turns up in Nola A few days later announced that the Saints and Butler have agreed a new long term agreement Right, I get all of that, Lee. You're arguing that they won't get him without making sure they have a long term deal. That's not what I'm arguing. I'm saying he's not worth it, in my opinion. Giving up our Number 1 pick is automatic. You seem to be assuming, though, that the Patriots would be willing to trade him without waiting for the Saints to make an offer. What makes you believe they will operate on our terms?

03-14-2017, 03:51 PM	#64
lee909 Site Donor 2015 Join Date: Mar 2012 Location: Watford England Posts: 8,716 Blog Entries: 1	Re: Breaking: Malcolm Butler visiting Saints Thursday! So long as he signs nothing then no deal has been agreed(even if it has behind closed doors). Bring him in and send him back without a deal and see what they want in trade. Thats all im saying. All teams talk to agents behind the scenes to talk outline of numbers The Pats may well take less as if they dont they have a p1ssed off player ad a player that is a FA next year and assuming they dont sign a same value player the max they get is a 2019 3rd round comp pick

03-14-2017, 03:55 PM	#65
burningmetal 1000 Posts + Join Date: Mar 2012 Posts: 3,905 Blog Entries: 3	Re: Breaking: Malcolm Butler visiting Saints Thursday! Originally Posted by lee909 So long as he signs nothing then no deal has been agreed(even if it has behind closed doors). Bring him in and send him back without a deal and see what they want in trade. Thats all im saying. All teams talk to agents behind the scenes to talk outline of numbers The Pats may well take less as if they dont they have a p1ssed off player ad a player that is a FA next year and assuming they dont sign a same value player the max they get is a 2019 3rd round comp pick You could very well be right that they do that, though I don't see it happening that way. I think it's more likely they shop him to another team if the Saints won't make a formal offer. I don't want to even give up the #32 pick for him, personally, for the reasons I've stated. But I absolutely would not give up the #11.

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03-14-2017, 04:00 PM	#66
spkb25 10000 POST CLUB Join Date: Aug 2004 Location: Baltimore, MD Posts: 13,057	Re: Breaking: Malcolm Butler visiting Saints Thursday! Originally Posted by burningmetal You could very well be right that they do that, though I don't see it happening that way. I think it's more likely they shop him to another team if the Saints won't make a formal offer. I don't want to even give up the #32 pick for him, personally, for the reasons I've stated. But I absolutely would not give up the #11. Me neither. Am I wonrg or did he turn down 14m per year from the Pats?

03-14-2017, 04:03 PM	#67
lee909 Site Donor 2015 Join Date: Mar 2012 Location: Watford England Posts: 8,716 Blog Entries: 1	Re: Breaking: Malcolm Butler visiting Saints Thursday! Originally Posted by burningmetal You could very well be right that they do that, though I don't see it happening that way. I think it's more likely they shop him to another team if the Saints won't make a formal offer. I don't want to even give up the #32 pick for him, personally, for the reasons I've stated. But I absolutely would not give up the #11. Im in full agreement I dont want to give anything beyond a 3 up I could stomach a 2 but not happily Id rather draft a CB and bring back Moore and go after Butler next year if needed fr nothing burningmetal likes this.

03-14-2017, 04:16 PM	#68
burningmetal 1000 Posts + Join Date: Mar 2012 Posts: 3,905 Blog Entries: 3	Re: Breaking: Malcolm Butler visiting Saints Thursday! Originally Posted by lee909 Im in full agreement I dont want to give anything beyond a 3 up I could stomach a 2 but not happily Id rather draft a CB and bring back Moore and go after Butler next year if needed fr nothing Yeah, I'm just not really feeling the priority behind getting a corner at all, but if they are concerned about depth, I could see drafting one in the second round and using those two first rounders on more pressing needs. But if they think they HAVE to have Butler, I wouldn't want to give up more than a 2nd, either. I'm as certain as I can be that they would trade rape us again, though.

03-14-2017, 05:06 PM	#69
AsylumGuido 10000 POST CLUB Join Date: Sep 2007 Location: Bossier City, LA Posts: 24,391	Re: Breaking: Malcolm Butler visiting Saints Thursday! Originally Posted by spkb25 More conjecture and rhetoric. 7-9 again and he is as good as gone. He was forced to fire staff He wasn't FORCED to fire anyone. Payton runs the show. Benson wouldn't order him to fire anyone. Loomis sure wouldn't. He fired them because they weren't doing their jobs adequately. It's as simple as that. Payton is FAR from stupid. He clearly knew changes were needed in those areas. Hell, the dimwits around here could see that, you know Payton had to have been able to see the same. We all know your bias against Payton. It borders on illogical hatred.

03-14-2017, 05:11 PM	#70
AsylumGuido 10000 POST CLUB Join Date: Sep 2007 Location: Bossier City, LA Posts: 24,391	Re: Breaking: Malcolm Butler visiting Saints Thursday! Originally Posted by burningmetal I know. I just wrote an essay, basically, on why I don't like that. And it isn't just talk. If the Saints actually want Butler, they have no choice. The Patriots are not going to match any offer we make, and we all know it. That means we give up our #11, automatically. Not if he signs the tender and then they trade him. The Saints can then replace that tender with an agreed upon long-term deal. A 1st rounder doesn't come into play at all.

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