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Whose our biggest threat in the division?

this is a discussion within the Saints Community Forum; Originally Posted by gulfgambler Agreed! Don't see any changes made that will improve this D. Originally Posted by K Major Gulf, No changes made in 2017 that will improve the D? I read this as no surefire changes, like draftling ...

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Old 07-20-2017, 11:22 AM   #31
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Re: Whose our biggest threat in the division?

Originally Posted by gulfgambler View Post
Agreed!

Don't see any changes made that will improve this D.
Originally Posted by K Major View Post
Gulf,

No changes made in 2017 that will improve the D?
I read this as no surefire changes, like draftling Myles Garrett for example.

The 2017 Saints defense is an unknown. One week before training camp, the impact of new coaching, free agents, draftees, players returning from IR, or even just being the 2nd year of the same system is unknown.

It's the promise and challenge of every season. Go back and read the pre training camp posts before the 2009 season. Or the 2013 season. The same questions and same uncertainty come up.

The one thing we can be sure of is that the defense is going to be different because some of the longstanding pieces (coaches) are no longer in place.

Let hope with that change and with a injury free training camp we get a chance to see the promise in September.

SFIAH

Super Bowl Championships: New Orleans Saints:1, Carolina:0, Atlanta Chokers: STILL ZERO

Only Atlanta choked in an unchokable situation... Life is definitely good.
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Old 07-20-2017, 11:36 AM   #32
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Re: Whose our biggest threat in the division?

Originally Posted by gulfgambler View Post
Agreed!

Don't see any changes made that will improve this D.
7-9 three seasons straight, did not occur because of offense.
Could only imagine the numbers yds/tds this defense would have yielded
if playing w/ offense like Texans, Jets, Browns.
Are you serious?

Drafting the top CB in the entire draft. (Lattimore)
Getting back our top two CB's that were both gone by the second game of the season. (Breaux, Williams)
Adding a ball hawking safety in the 2nd round of the draft. (Williams)
Getting our #1 DT draft pick back from missing half the season with a broken leg. (Rankins)
Adding quality depth through free agency in the LB corps. (Klein, Te'o)
Adding a quality LB through the draft. (Anzalone)
Adding an edge rusher at DE. (Okafor)

And most importantly ...

Getting rid of stagnant coaching at D-Line and LB and adding two outstanding coaches for those major units (Nielsen, Nolan)

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Old 07-20-2017, 12:25 PM   #33
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Re: Whose our biggest threat in the division?

Originally Posted by K Major View Post
I just don't see the Bucs as the biggest threat. Jameis can't carry a team yet and they are still a work in progress on defense.
They are going to be our toughest matchup is what I am saying.

Actually this is how I see Atlanta(Detroit is a tossup and either them or Carolina loses in Chicago)
@Chi-W
GB-L
(those could be reversed)
@Det-L/W(Detroit is on five days rest so it does somewhat help Atlanta but Atlanta will put everything into the GB game)
Buf-L/W
Mia-W/L(this precedes the big matchup vs NE so Atl could be looking ahead)
@NE-L
@NYJ-L(after disappointment against NE they will be out of it mentally)
@Car-L
Dal-W
@Sea-L(MNF in Seattle)
TB-L(TB off a bye, Atl on five days rest after playoff rematch)
Min-W
NO-L/W
@TB-W
@NO-L
Car-W

How I view this is Atlanta has gone 4-0 and 3-1 the last two years vs NFC divisions and in 2014 went 0-4. Next in line is 2-2. They will stay 3-1 if they win in Detroit week 3. But they will lose to either Chicago or Green Bay. They have gone 0-4, 3-1 and 2-2 the last three years against the AFC. 1-3 is next and since I have them losing two for sure, it comes down to either Buffalo or Miami pulling out the upset. If Atlanta is looking at 7-9 or 8-8 then odds are one of them will do it. Both Miami and Buffalo have enough talent to hang with Atlanta. Buffalo can slow them down by running the ball with McCoy and have drafted another playmaker to go with Watkins. Miami has a three good receivers, a emerging back, and a top TE(he has chemistry issues with Tanny however so far). Miami also has Cam Wake. I think Buffalo has better chance because they focus on the run more and have a decent defense against the pass. Miami's one advantage if if Tanny stays with Atlanta and the fact it is right before the game Atlanta has marked on their calendar.

On paper, Atlanta is supposed to go 3-1 vs AFC East. That will not happen. Atlanta starts out 1-2 they will find a way to lose to Buffalo. Defending NFC South champs have never outside of one occasion started the next season 4-1(Carolina 1-4, Carolina 5-0, Carolina 3-2, Atlanta 1-4, NO 1-4, Atlanta 2-3, NO 3-2, Carolina 2-3, TB 3-2, NO 1-4, TB 1-4, Atlanta 3-2). And Carolina in 2015 was coming off a 7-8-1 record. They should not have won the division that year but we choked. So Atlanta is definitely lose to one of Buffalo or Miami. Atlanta lost to KC, TB, and SD last year. Outside division Atlanta goes 4-6 or 5-5 with four division games coming in the last four weeks. If Atlanta goes 5-5, they have a 5-7 record before the last four weeks, 4-8 if 4-6. Atlanta goes 3-3 or 1-5 in division. Since 2012, Atlanta has taken turns going 1-5 and 5-1. If they go 1-5 their sole win is Carolina. Atlanta can go anywhere from 5-11 to 8-8.

TB
@Mia-L
Chi-W
@Min-W
NYG-L/W
NE-L
@Ari-L
@Buf-L
Car-W
@NO-L/W
NYJ-W
@Atl-W
@GB-L
Det-W
Atl-L/W
@Car-W(five days rest but both Atlanta and Carolina could be done)
NO-W/L(depending on week 9, split)

If TB beats the giants they are looking at 9-7, 8-8 if not. I think Detroit beats Baltimore the week before going to TB so think the b2b hurts them. TB has gone 0-4, 2-2, and 2-2 the last three years and before the 0-4 run(which lasted three years) they were 1-3. Them going 3-1 makes sense(titans last three years went 0-4, 2-2, and 3-1 vs NFC). Against the AFC they have gone 1-3 and 2-2 last two years, but I can see 1-3 because it's hard to see 3-1 with NE and two road games at Miami and Buffalo. TB's division games do not matter, they went 4-2 last season and 3-3 before. They are approaching 5-1 next up and that will depend of if they sweep Atlanta which they have a great shot at doing. Going into the MNF game depending on what happens against giants, TB is looking at 6-7, 7-6, or 8-5(if they beat us week 9). They will be in better shape than Atlanta. Their record ranges from 8-8 to 10-6.

Carolina
@SF-W
Buf-W/L
NO-W
@NE-L
@Det-L/W
Phi-L(Philly is loaded)
@Chi-L/W(split w/ here and GB)
@TB-L
Atl-W
Mia-L/W(Miami has owned them recently, led mostly in 2013)
@NYJ-W
@NO-L
Min-L
GB-W/L(see Chi)
TB-L
@Atl-L

Car and TB have been sweeping each other since 2008. Even if Car sweeps TB it's still 9-7 at best and I don't think Car did enough this offseason to keep up with TB. They start out 3-0 then lose to NE and if they lose to Detroit they will will go on a losing streak until Atlanta week 9. Carolina has like Atlanta gone 4-0 and 3-1 the last two years but before that Carolina went 2-2 and before that 0-4. Carolina can go 1-3 instead of 2-2 and that's what I am predicting. They will go 2-2 if they beat Detroit. Against the AFC Carolina has gone 1-4, 4-0, and 1-4 the last three years so 2-2 is likely. If Atlanta goes 2-2, they will go 1-3. I see them beating the jets week 12 off the bye and losing to Miami week 9. Carolina is 6-10 or 7-9.

With the saints
@Min-W
NE-L
@Car-L
vs.Mia-W
Det-W(thanks to the bye)
@GB-L/W
Chi-W
TB-W/L
@Buf-L
Was-W
@LA-W/L(it's on the road and it's no longer GW, the team has given us fits without GW)
Car-W
@Atl-L/W
NYJ-W
Atl-W
@TB-L/W

There are so many toss-ups here. We should go 3-1 or 4-0 against vs NFC division we play because we get Det off a bye and Min week 1 with AP, and we are not losing to Chicago. It comes down to GB week 7. Against the AFC lately it's 1-3 one year, 2-2 the next. We went 1-3 last year and I think it's either 2-2 or 4-0. But I don't feel confident in the shorter rest after a big week 1 game. And therefore, I see us losing at Buffalo as well because it's a tougher game than expected. It's better than losing to Miami and starting out 1-3 perhaps again. We beat Washington this time as that drama is gonna rear its ugly head. This is a improvement 6-4(losing to Gb/LA), 7-3(losing to one of them), or 8-2(beating both) outside division--something that needs to happen to help us in division games. We will go 3-3 in division or 4-2. Our record ranges from 9-7 to 12-4. We are in the best shape if we take care of business out of the division.
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Old 07-20-2017, 12:29 PM   #34
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Re: Whose our biggest threat in the division?

Originally Posted by SaintFanInATLHELL View Post
I read this as no surefire changes, like draftling Myles Garrett for example.

The 2017 Saints defense is an unknown. One week before training camp, the impact of new coaching, free agents, draftees, players returning from IR, or even just being the 2nd year of the same system is unknown.

It's the promise and challenge of every season. Go back and read the pre training camp posts before the 2009 season. Or the 2013 season. The same questions and same uncertainty come up.

The one thing we can be sure of is that the defense is going to be different because some of the longstanding pieces (coaches) are no longer in place.

Let hope with that change and with a injury free training camp we get a chance to see the promise in September.

SFIAH
The only surefire anything is whatever you're looking at in the rear view mirror. Compare this year to the year, say Sean was suspended, we threw our second round pick at SLB, the years we kept the same crappy LB and special teams coach, etc... This is the brightest off season and the closest thing we've had to surefire in a long, long while.
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Old 07-20-2017, 12:31 PM   #35
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Re: Whose our biggest threat in the division?

Damn Big Will ^^^^ , that's a lot of information but ok. Tampa is the least of my worries coming out of the NFC South.
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Old 07-21-2017, 08:41 AM   #36
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Re: Whose our biggest threat in the division?

It seems like the talking heads say Tampa will be improved every year and they end up being average or below average. I think health will be our biggest threat. After that I think Atlanta will come in second with panthers third and then Bucs.
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Old 07-21-2017, 10:16 AM   #37
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Re: Whose our biggest threat in the division?

Originally Posted by darksoul35 View Post
I think health will be our biggest threat.
^^^^ This. Today's NFL is all about staying healthy and being productive when the inevitable injuries come. To find a way when the #1 can't play, that the 1A comes in and there isn't a dropoff in production.

That's why the Saints need 47 CB, 83 safties, 11111 LBs, and a rotation of defensive linemen on the roster and in training camp.

That's why Nolan needs to find a way to get Anthony up to speed. And why Craig Robertson will be on the roster. Robertson may or may not start. But we now know that when you plug the guy into the Will, Sam, or Mike, that you are going to get consistent production.

I remember at the draft when everyone had their hands up in the air over the Ramcyzk pick. How's that looking now?

The Saints 53 needs to be the 53 most productive and flexible players that can produce at a moment's notice. On the defensive side for the first time in a long time it looks like we're getting there.

SFIAH
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