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Payton need to go?

this is a discussion within the Saints Community Forum; Originally Posted by RailBoss This excerpt pretty much summed it up "Rudderless Group" The Saints' offense started with an efficient, effective balanced attack against a stout Vikings defense. It transformed into a rudderless group struggling to move the football once ...

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Old 09-13-2017, 05:53 AM   #111
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Re: Payton need to go?

Originally Posted by RailBoss View Post
This excerpt pretty much summed it up "Rudderless Group"

The Saints' offense started with an efficient, effective balanced attack against a stout Vikings defense. It transformed into a rudderless group struggling to move the football once right tackle Zach Strief exited with a knee injury.
Yep and you know what extremely frustrating? Watching SP not adjust to the fact that we did not have the blocking for plays that take time to develop down the field and Brees kept getting 0 time. You could tell the Vikings thought we were going to bring heat and that was why they only threw quick passes to start the game. Then they switched it up and started going down the field.
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Old 09-13-2017, 05:59 AM   #112
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Re: Payton need to go?

Originally Posted by spkb25 View Post
Yep and you know what extremely frustrating? Watching SP not adjust to the fact that we did not have the blocking for plays that take time to develop down the field and Brees kept getting 0 time. You could tell the Vikings thought we were going to bring heat and that was why they only threw quick passes to start the game. Then they switched it up and started going down the field.
I could tell our D wasn't the same as preseason right from the very start, when they got beat on 3rd down twice by the same exact play, a drag route.
Right before the snap, the entire LB and DB group were just pointing and shouting to each other like they didn't know their assignments.

But our "number 1 offense" refused to throw to anyone that wasn't a RB. We needed to take shots downfield, yet Payton force fed the ball to Kamara and AP.
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Old 09-13-2017, 06:03 AM   #113
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Re: Payton need to go?

Originally Posted by dizzle88 View Post
I could tell our D wasn't the same as preseason right from the very start, when they got beat on 3rd down twice by the same exact play, a drag route.
Right before the snap, the entire LB and DB group were just pointing and shouting to each other like they didn't know their assignments.

But our "number 1 offense" refused to throw to anyone that wasn't a RB. We needed to take shots downfield, yet Payton force fed the ball to Kamara and AP.
No slants to MT. I counted one. One of the worst plays I saw was the swing pass to kamara...I mean I just looked like it was in slow mo wondering when are we going to throw him the ball.
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Old 09-13-2017, 10:55 AM   #114
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Re: Payton need to go?

Originally Posted by spkb25 View Post
No slants to MT. I counted one. One of the worst plays I saw was the swing pass to kamara...I mean I just looked like it was in slow mo wondering when are we going to throw him the ball.
Is Payton that scared of our receiving corps without Cooks or Snead? I understand he said he was committed to the running game but I didn't think he meant he was committed to only throwing to his running backs.
I think Brees was a little off too. It's understandable, they didn't get much game time work together. I hope they get their **** together. KC had to score what, like 40 plus points to beat the Pats? I guarantee our defense can't limit them to under 30 so offense better get their **** together .
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Old 09-13-2017, 11:15 AM   #115
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Re: Payton need to go?

Watched the game again last night and confirmed play calling has got to be more patient with the run game - from a post earlier in the thread...

Originally Posted by jeanpierre View Post
[B]... the running game not working is simply not true...

The Saints were leading the game 6-3 with a run-pass ratio of 16 run plays to 17 (14) pass plays; three of the pass plays were negated by penalty (hence the 17 (14) pass plays), two by the Vikings (T. Johnson - PF/Roughing Passer, E. Griffin - Offsides) and one by Saints (A. Peat - Holding)...

Just because Ingram, Peterson, or Kamara tear off a run of 50 yds doesn't mean the run game wasn't successful...
In the first half, we had RuYd plays of 9, 1, 3, 2, 2, 1, 4, 3, 3, 7, 2, 5, -1, 3, 2, 1...

Again, the 20 yd gashes are great, but this Vikings defense was third (3rd) in pass defense, but only twentieth (20th) in rush defense last season...

So the recipe for beating these physical defenses like the Vikings, Seahawks and Broncos is too pound them, running it right at their edge rushers...

And another thing I didn't see with the Ingram and Peterson runs was a lot of pull-zone blocking to open the field, instead trying to run at L. Joseph...

Running those wide zone sweeps, exposing their pass rushers to those remember me hits from our physical guards...

Believe Payton learned his lesson and the MNF beating in the second half will reinforce the lesson...
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Old 09-13-2017, 11:17 AM   #116
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Re: Payton need to go?

I don't understand why our offense didn't come out of the gates aggressive, we just passed every ball to the flats and expected to get a first down. Call some shots down the field man!!
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Old 09-13-2017, 11:21 AM   #117
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Re: Payton need to go?

Originally Posted by dizzle88 View Post
I don't understand why our offense didn't come out of the gates aggressive, we just passed every ball to the flats and expected to get a first down. Call some shots down the field man!!
I'd like to have seem @CantguardMike running double move routes, but that pass rush was allowing the time...

If anything, to slow that pass rush, in addition to running it at their edge rushers, we should have ran screens, specifically with Ingram...

There were keying on Kamara as a receiver in the flats, even though he did have seven RuAts...

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Old 09-13-2017, 11:23 AM   #118
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Re: Payton need to go?

When we didn't spend the extra mil and sign Zeitler as our Right Guard, settling on Warford, I knew this was going to be a problem...

Mass and @ss is fine, but Warford's massive @ss is gonna be slower out in space and whiff on those linebackers...

Zeitler excells in getting out in space, beating on those defenders, which would be more conducive to our screen game...
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Old 09-13-2017, 11:50 AM   #119
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Re: Payton need to go?

Originally Posted by jeanpierre View Post
Watched the game again last night and confirmed play calling has got to be more patient with the run game - from a post earlier in the thread...

So the recipe for beating these physical defenses like the Vikings, Seahawks and Broncos is too pound them, running it right at their edge rushers...

And another thing I didn't see with the Ingram and Peterson runs was a lot of pull-zone blocking to open the field, instead trying to run at L. Joseph...
Someway the Saints must establish a running attack going forward.

Ingram, Peterson, Kamara etc ... there is no reason for us not to have a 90+ yard run game. Parcels always used to say that Payton was a bit too "pass happy". Run it down their collective throats ... even if it isn't working at first.
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Old 09-13-2017, 12:18 PM   #120
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Re: Payton need to go?

Originally Posted by K Major View Post
Someway the Saints must establish a running attack going forward.

Ingram, Peterson, Kamara etc ... there is no reason for us not to have a 90+ yard run game. Parcels always used to say that Payton was a bit too "pass happy". Run it down their collective throats ... even if it isn't working at first.
And that's the thing, what do you define as working?

I would've considerd a lead of 6-3 as working just fine...
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