Leonard Fournette amoung 4 Jaguars who stayed in tunnel during anthem
 

All of the New Orleans Saints and Jacksonville Jaguars players on the field stood during the national anthem before Thursday's preseason game, but four Jaguars players were not on the field while the song played.

Running backs Leonard Fournette and T.J. Yeldon, cornerback Jalen Ramsey and linebacker Telvin Smith Sr. did not take the field until after the anthem finished.

"It's a personal thing and I don't want to get into it, but everyone has their own beliefs in certain things," said Fournette, an LSU and St. Augustine product.

The NFL and NFL Players Association are still working to find a compromise about how to handle players who wish to protest to raise awareness for racial injustices in the U.S. during the anthem. In May, the league adopted a policy that required all team personnel on the field to stand during the anthem. Players wishing to protest could stay in the locker room or off the field, but if someone chose not to stand on the field, he would face discipline.

This policy received significant backlash, and in July, the NFL and NFLPA announced that no new rules would be enforced with regards to the anthem until there was an agreement from both sides.

NOLA

Re: Leonard Fournette amoung 4 Jaguars who stayed in tunnel during anthem
 

For the NFL, it's best that all participants on the field stand. For the players who choose this avenue to have their voices heard, staying off the field really defeats that purpose. I support the players right of free speech. But, in the end, the avenue they chose simply overshadowed their message.

Re: Leonard Fournette amoung 4 Jaguars who stayed in tunnel during anthem
 

James Baldwin wrote an excellent speech that still applies to this very moment in time.

Re: Leonard Fournette amoung 4 Jaguars who stayed in tunnel during anthem
 

Where are the "concerned players" during the off season? I'm sure if they wanted to "raise awareness" for any subject there is a media outlet for it. Don't want to hear about "So and So" working "behind the scenes" and quietly doing "this and that". "So and So" needs to be Overt not Covert! Only fitting that there be "band wagon" players for "band wagon" fans!

Re: Leonard Fournette amoung 4 Jaguars who stayed in tunnel during anthem
 

Chicago is averaging 8 people shot a day for the year. Maybe stickers on their helmets to honor them? Roughly 2920 so they would have to be very tiny.

Re: Leonard Fournette amoung 4 Jaguars who stayed in tunnel during anthem
 

Who cares. Why are we still talking about this. It’s not like any of you guys haven’t stopped by the beer and hot dog stand during the anthem.

Re: Leonard Fournette amoung 4 Jaguars who stayed in tunnel during anthem
 

Who Cares is right.

Re: Leonard Fournette amoung 4 Jaguars who stayed in tunnel during anthem
 

Re: Leonard Fournette amoung 4 Jaguars who stayed in tunnel during anthem
 

The American Dream and the American Negro

I suppose they all still apply though, because A Letter to My Nephew would suffice as well.

Re: Leonard Fournette amoung 4 Jaguars who stayed in tunnel during anthem
 

I care.
A significant number of other people care, also.
The TV ratings were affected last year, and the League is
working policy on this, so obviously somebody cares.

It matters to the players doing it.
It matters to many of their customers.

Re: Leonard Fournette amoung 4 Jaguars who stayed in tunnel during anthem
 

If people stick with the issue of the protest instead of implying that this stance was against America, this issue wouldn't have blown up this big. Thank Donald Trump for his divisive message which cause more players to protest.

Re: Leonard Fournette amoung 4 Jaguars who stayed in tunnel during anthem
 

It wouldn't have mattered, unfortunately. There is a sizable segment of the population who believes that any sign of disrespect (according to them) of the flag is disrespecting the country, no matter the reason.

What I found interesting in all this is two things. First is that Kaepernick was advised by veterans that taking a knee is a sign of showing respect for fallen brothers. The second is that almost to a person in all the interviews I've seen, veterans state that they served so that citizens could retain the right to disagree and to protest. So the folks that are in theory being the most "disrepected" by the action are the ones who actually understand it the best.

In the end, everyone has the right to do exactly what they are doing. Players can kneel (or not). NFL owners can choose to impose rules. Those who feel disrespected have the right to feel that way, and to express their opinions. Even Trump has the right to fan the flames if that's what he wants to do. Each and every group has the right of self expression. There's actually nothing more American than that.

The NFL really only has one way out of this. They have to recognize the rights of the players to protest. If they don't, the players will simply continue to do so, just as in this instance that prompted this thread. At the same time, the league will need to take significant steps to address the issues that the players are protesting about. It's all in the understanding that people protest when they feel powerless and unheard. In short, instead of trying to force people to stand for the anthem, create the conditions where they will want to stand for it.

But closing with my opening: Nothing other than complete conformity will satisfy some, regardless of the underlaying issues. The NFL has already made the mistake once of trying this path, and here we are again.

SFIAH

Re: Leonard Fournette amoung 4 Jaguars who stayed in tunnel during anthem
 

that was well said.

Re: Leonard Fournette amoung 4 Jaguars who stayed in tunnel during anthem
 

Nonsense.
Ultimately, Kaepernick had 24 hours in a day and 168 hours in a week to accomplish something positive and chose 2.5 minutes during a time that many consider sacred to kneel. That was considered by many to be a vile act.
The pig socks fanned the flames.
CK urinated on people that paid his million dollar salary by showing disrespect to the flag, the anthem and those who chose to "serve and protect" our country.
Those that would try to convince me that this was not a stance against America are either clueless or full of crap.

Re: Leonard Fournette amoung 4 Jaguars who stayed in tunnel during anthem
 

Re: Leonard Fournette amoung 4 Jaguars who stayed in tunnel during anthem
 

Good god at this nonsense. Tito bring this nut a tissue.

Re: Leonard Fournette amoung 4 Jaguars who stayed in tunnel during anthem
 

“The white liberal differs from the white conservative only in one way: the liberal is more deceitful than the conservative. The liberal is more hypocritical than the conservative. Both want power, but the white liberal is the one who has perfected the art of posing as the Negro's friend and benefactor; and by winning the friendship, allegiance, and support of the Negro, the white liberal is able to use the Negro as a pawn or tool in this political "football game" that is constantly raging between the white liberals and white conservatives.”

Malcolm X

Point being, this bipartisan argument between White Liberals and Conservatives ain’t our business. Neither side means us any good and we should create our own, unique side that’s for us and by us. Should we trust the liberals? Of course not. Should we in turn, trust the conservatives? **** no. We’re not going to champion law enforcement because one demographic feels we should. We don’t have to honor veterans in the way anybody else feels is right. We all have veterans in our family. My father, grandfather, and Great-Grandfather are vets. We won’t get into the disrespect my grandfathers came home to since “respect” is something everyone says they’re worried about. This country was always divided, and it’s going to stay divided until it rips apart at the seams. I won’t push a kumbaya message for the sake of doing so. I don’t trust law enforcement because I know the history of it in this country. I don’t care about the National Anthem because it doesn’t represent me and was never intended to. I understand all sides and it’s completely fine to feel how you want to feel, regardless how outrageous it sounds, but it’s 2018...Conservatives are lying to us just as much as the Liberals. I won’t be used in the quarrels. We protect ourselves from any imminent threats by most of our tax money going to defense. If you’re worried about the military, protest for them to get paid more and come home to country that offers them better mental and physical health care than they do now.

Re: Leonard Fournette amoung 4 Jaguars who stayed in tunnel during anthem
 

You understand YOUR side - it is the Black Panther mantra, pretty much word for word. I run in to it a lot out here in California.

But you do not understand ALL sides. Not even close my friend.

And Che Guevara was a magnanimous failure. I love conversations about the 60s. ;)

Re: Leonard Fournette amoung 4 Jaguars who stayed in tunnel during anthem
 

1. The Black Panthers were a reformist group. I’m not a reformist.

2. I’m not your friend.

3. Don’t be so arrogant as to tell me what I do and don’t understand. You don’t know me.

Re: Leonard Fournette amoung 4 Jaguars who stayed in tunnel during anthem
 

I don't know you, but I know what you speak. I'm very familiar with it. You get what you give sir. You're following a playbook with which I am somewhat well-versed. I can spot it 10 miles away.

You simply do not understand any side other than yours. You only think you do. That is evident in your posts which always lead back to race. The only person you're fooling is yourself.

Re: Leonard Fournette amoung 4 Jaguars who stayed in tunnel during anthem
 

Okay. 👌🏽

Re: Leonard Fournette amoung 4 Jaguars who stayed in tunnel during anthem
 

I don't hate my cat because he is black. I don't hate my cat because she is orange. I don't like my white cat because he is white.

I hate dishonest a-holes no matter what the color, race or species.

Which people are the most racist? Look in the mirror. Everyone has their own version of supporting themselves.



https://object.cato.org/sites/cato.o...voltaire_b.jpg

Re: Leonard Fournette amoung 4 Jaguars who stayed in tunnel during anthem
 

Great input. You did well to enrich this discussion.

Re: Leonard Fournette amoung 4 Jaguars who stayed in tunnel during anthem
 

Rez
I see the post quoting Malcolm X above
I can get part of it but i wonder how would you solve the issues. I totally get not trusting either party. I wouldn't trust either of them (Im white Irish/English). Both parties are the same from what i see off them. The whole race thing is flaring up over here. Not suprisingly weeks after some of our right wing party members all had meetings with the agitating snake Steve Bannon.

Personally any type of bigotry disgusts me.
I'm not religious so don't want religious views clouding anything polotical. Teligion has no place in politics.

I also have no time for the recent trend over here of trying to push the respect our military like it is over there(I'll respect anyone that deserve it. Some in uniform do,some dont. Its a simple case of respect the man not the uniform/position in society),no time for the monarchy either.

It amazes me how msny in the US see the Democrats as a left wing party. There has barely been a true left wing socialist in years. Last time there was he was screwed by his own party,and yet i don't know enough about him to have a proper opionion.

How would YOU go about changing things?.

Re: Leonard Fournette amoung 4 Jaguars who stayed in tunnel during anthem
 

What you have to understand is the above statement immediately disqualifies your opinion - you can not possibly understand, "Because You Are White"...but he's not 'racist'. Now that doesn't reconcile, but no matter, he's black so you could never even begin to understand how his loathing of white people isn't racist.

What he subscribes too is 100% anti-white. He will tell you he is pro-black and therefore not racist. He doesn't think blacks are superior (at least he won't 'say' that), only that blacks should take over. He supports the destruction of America and the Constitution that defines it because "it wasn't for black people". You're white. You're the enemy. Full stop.

Re: Leonard Fournette amoung 4 Jaguars who stayed in tunnel during anthem
 

We have to abandon the two party system and get rid of the electoral college. Democrats and Republicans are like siblings fighting over control of a toy that they’re about to break. Democrats use Blacks and other minorities as leverage to try and gain the upper hand over the Republican, majority. They both have their points policy-wise, but as far as race relations go they don’t know what the **** they’re doing. It’s simple for me, help the poor and it’ll help society in general. Go out of your way to make sure nobody can fail. Invest whatever it takes in your people if you really look at them as your people. Socialism and Capitalism are opposites that balance each other out. The Homestead Acts were investments into the American people that worked out on the countries behalf. Something similar could be done for minorities as a sign of good faith. Even if it’s a fake gesture people will fall for it. Just that, would do wonders for the country. Low morale can make a well oiled machine of a system seem rusty and time to replace. But if people want everyone to forget the past, you have to give them a real reason to. But the question will become, “Who’s going to pay for that?”. It’ll die there.

Re: Leonard Fournette amoung 4 Jaguars who stayed in tunnel during anthem
 

You should look in the mirror. Then you'd see you're just pointing at yourself.

Re: Leonard Fournette amoung 4 Jaguars who stayed in tunnel during anthem
 

Thanks. I enjoy shedding truth on the topic at hand.

Re: Leonard Fournette amoung 4 Jaguars who stayed in tunnel during anthem
 

Re: Leonard Fournette amoung 4 Jaguars who stayed in tunnel during anthem
 

So how do would you go about choosing who owes you something, and what they should pay?

Re: Leonard Fournette amoung 4 Jaguars who stayed in tunnel during anthem
 

I get that you have a lot of historical knowledge but how many people today have any ties to slavery, civil rights, lynchings, cop killings. It's almost nobody. There are some bad cops but get this; some of them are ALSO black as you well know. So what are we talking about then?


We are so racist we elected a black President. We are so racist we have black astronauts. I'm sorry dude but it just ain't reality. Yeah, racism exist but it has always existed and it will continue to exist. It's not even a crime to be a member of the KKK. They have a right to exist as hard is that is for you to acknowledge. I hate them but they do in fact have the right to exist. If they cause physical or financial harm to anyone though they will be held accountable.

Re: Leonard Fournette amoung 4 Jaguars who stayed in tunnel during anthem
 

And people claim Obama is the reason for division. Trump, who dodge the draft, dis honored a gold star family, and publicly disrespected Senator McCain for being a POW, speak against protesting during the anthem.

Why I don't hear anyone offended by those acts. It's like a double standard. When people was so against Obama Care, didn't care if it was done away with till they find out affordable care and Obama care was the same thing they had town meetings with their disapproval.

Those double standards are part of the reason why blacks and whites are protesting,,,,,if it's by locking arms, clinching fist, or kneeling during the anthem. It's not cause they're against America. If you really feel its against America or disrespectful, where were those voices when Trump disrespected our veterans that were captured and the family of veterans who lost their lives serving America? Instead, you accept his lies and believe he is making America great again.

Re: Leonard Fournette amoung 4 Jaguars who stayed in tunnel during anthem
 

Dodging the draft and getting deferments are two different things but I do get what you mean. A lot of people used the deferments like Bruce Springsteen and Bill Clinton to bypass the draft. Some who served like Al Gore did it for political reasons. He did it to score his father political points but his father ended up losing the election. There is a double standard for some reason though. Why is Bruce given a pass and not Trump? I have no idea. Why is Bill given a pass for saying he loathed the military? Seems half the people hate the military and the other half do not is all I can make of it.


As for the gold star family, he was bashing the father for not letting the mother speak. He didn't bash the Soldier. Muslim culture treat women horrible as I'm sure you know. The parents were bashing Trump so he bashed them. I see nothing wrong with it. They were also using their son to make a political statement which to me is wrong. They were not using the moment to honor their son, only spew hatred.


McCain is garbage and I am a 20 year Veteran who was wounded in combat. I respect him for his service but that is the extent of it. He has consistently used his POW status for political points. He never shuts up about it. He also wanted to get rid of the meager military pension. Almost nobody earns the pension. Of the 1% that served, only 17% of that 1% earn the pension and it's not that much. Why not vote to get rid of Congressional pensions then? He's just a pile of garbage. Always has been.

Re: Leonard Fournette amoung 4 Jaguars who stayed in tunnel during anthem
 

Whats it smell like, up in there?
Every Leading Economic Indicator says you're wrong.
Including the black unemployment rate - at a historic Low.