Politics

WhoDat · 07-20-2004, 01:42 PM

I skipped a lot, but I have to throw a few things in here:

First:

I\'ve managed to avoid this \'til now, but I absolutely positively agree with you whodat...110%.

Everybody stop. A moment of silence please to honor this moment. Maybe i\'m not the miserable person Saintfan thought I was outside of the Brooks/Haz debate!

I always thought that we thought alike Saintfan - great minds usually do. Now if I could just get you off the sunshine laced tang that Billy\'s got you hooked on... :P

Now, I gotta get a little ticked.

canucksaint -- Marriage in the US has always been for people of the opposite sex. Define marriage however you want, but that\'s the way it is.

Since you don\'t object to gay marriage, is there anything you object to that you think is morally wrong? What about incest? What about having multiple wifes or husbands? What about sexual relationships between adults and childern? Who has the right to say this isn\'t OK? Me, for one. Just like gays. You got to draw the line somewhere. It\'s not natural to sleep with your sister and it\'s not natural for a man to sleep with a man. Of course, an arguement could be made to justify all of \'em.

1. Comparing gay marriage to incest shows ignorance of the subject matter. That\'s sad Billy - do you know any gays. Really, do you have a single gay who is truly your friend, or who you have ever gotten to know? If you had you wouldn\'t make those kinds of ridiculous comments.

2. Unfortunately, you\'re half wrong here and it is the half that matters. In practice, marriage has always been between a man and a woman. Hoewever, that is not always the way it is defined in law, which is why gays CAN marry in certain places. Its those laws (and the impending challenges of those laws) that will eventually allow gays to be married in every state in this country within the next 20 years.

3. There are NO grounds for disallowing marriage between gays in law. Marriage in this country is DEVOID of religious signifigance (separation of church and state). Thus it is simply a civil contract between two people. Marriage, for the position of the state, is nothing more than that. As we all know discrimination on race, sex, age after majority, etc. is illegal in this country, as well it should be. So is discrimination based on sexual preference. There are a plethora of reasons why gay marriage should not be banned and very few other than a \"religious\" argument for why it should be. Fortunately, religion AND majority view mean very little in this country when it comes to civil liberties and personal freedoms.

4. THIS IS THE MOST IMPORTANT THING: One person please give me any reason whatsoever as to why gays should not be married THAT DOES NOT INCLUDE \'morals\', \'ethics\', or \'religion\'. What threat does the idea pose to American society? None. Plain and simple. The bottom line here is fear. People who oppose gay marriage generally know very little about gay people and that ignorance makes them scared. Religion is another major contributor - thankfully our government does not legislate morals.

Gay should have the right to be married, and they most certainly will have that right sooner rather than later. George Bush\'s decision to make this an issue now may serve to act as a wedge amongst Democrats and help him win another election, but he is doing it at the cost of \'his cause.\' Bringing the issue to the forefront has only shortened the time frame until gays can be married. States like MS, GA, LA, and other bible belt states will be quick to pass laws outlawing gay marriage. Gays will take legal action and eventually this will sit in front of the Supreme Court - who will decide that it is unconstitutional to bar a citizen of rights afforded other citizens based solely on sexual preference. Thanks George, what might have taken 30 or even 50 years may now only take 10.

07-20-2004, 01:42 PM	#11
WhoDat 5000 POSTS! + Join Date: Sep 2002 Posts: 5,631	Politics I skipped a lot, but I have to throw a few things in here: First: I\'ve managed to avoid this \'til now, but I absolutely positively agree with you whodat...110%. Everybody stop. A moment of silence please to honor this moment. Maybe i\'m not the miserable person Saintfan thought I was outside of the Brooks/Haz debate! I always thought that we thought alike Saintfan - great minds usually do. Now if I could just get you off the sunshine laced tang that Billy\'s got you hooked on... :P Now, I gotta get a little ticked. canucksaint -- Marriage in the US has always been for people of the opposite sex. Define marriage however you want, but that\'s the way it is. Since you don\'t object to gay marriage, is there anything you object to that you think is morally wrong? What about incest? What about having multiple wifes or husbands? What about sexual relationships between adults and childern? Who has the right to say this isn\'t OK? Me, for one. Just like gays. You got to draw the line somewhere. It\'s not natural to sleep with your sister and it\'s not natural for a man to sleep with a man. Of course, an arguement could be made to justify all of \'em. 1. Comparing gay marriage to incest shows ignorance of the subject matter. That\'s sad Billy - do you know any gays. Really, do you have a single gay who is truly your friend, or who you have ever gotten to know? If you had you wouldn\'t make those kinds of ridiculous comments. 2. Unfortunately, you\'re half wrong here and it is the half that matters. In practice, marriage has always been between a man and a woman. Hoewever, that is not always the way it is defined in law, which is why gays CAN marry in certain places. Its those laws (and the impending challenges of those laws) that will eventually allow gays to be married in every state in this country within the next 20 years. 3. There are NO grounds for disallowing marriage between gays in law. Marriage in this country is DEVOID of religious signifigance (separation of church and state). Thus it is simply a civil contract between two people. Marriage, for the position of the state, is nothing more than that. As we all know discrimination on race, sex, age after majority, etc. is illegal in this country, as well it should be. So is discrimination based on sexual preference. There are a plethora of reasons why gay marriage should not be banned and very few other than a \"religious\" argument for why it should be. Fortunately, religion AND majority view mean very little in this country when it comes to civil liberties and personal freedoms. 4. THIS IS THE MOST IMPORTANT THING: One person please give me any reason whatsoever as to why gays should not be married THAT DOES NOT INCLUDE \'morals\', \'ethics\', or \'religion\'. What threat does the idea pose to American society? None. Plain and simple. The bottom line here is fear. People who oppose gay marriage generally know very little about gay people and that ignorance makes them scared. Religion is another major contributor - thankfully our government does not legislate morals. Gay should have the right to be married, and they most certainly will have that right sooner rather than later. George Bush\'s decision to make this an issue now may serve to act as a wedge amongst Democrats and help him win another election, but he is doing it at the cost of \'his cause.\' Bringing the issue to the forefront has only shortened the time frame until gays can be married. States like MS, GA, LA, and other bible belt states will be quick to pass laws outlawing gay marriage. Gays will take legal action and eventually this will sit in front of the Supreme Court - who will decide that it is unconstitutional to bar a citizen of rights afforded other citizens based solely on sexual preference. Thanks George, what might have taken 30 or even 50 years may now only take 10.
WhoDat 5000 POSTS! + Join Date: Sep 2002 Posts: 5,631	\"Excuses, excuses, excuses. ThatÃ¢Â€Â™s all anyone ever makes for the New Orleans SaintsÃ¢Â€Â™ organization.\" - Eric Narcisse \"Being a Saints fan is almost like being addicted to crack,\" he said.[i]\"You know you should stop, but you just can\'t.\"