Collusion-Gate: The Secret Texts and Testimony of NFL Owners and Superstar QBs, Revealed

saintsfan1976 · 06-30-2025, 06:24 AM

Are agents colluding to secure guaranteed money for second round picks?

Are scouts discussing player evaluations colluding to prevent a player from going round 1?

Are players holding out for new contracts in the middle of their current contract colluding?

AsylumGuido · 06-30-2025, 08:06 AM

Originally Posted by saintsfan1976

Are agents colluding to secure guaranteed money for second round picks?

Not in any illegal sense. Working together to form a united front is not against the law. The agents are not doing anything in "secret" nor are they trying to "cheat or deceive others".

Are scouts discussing player evaluations colluding to prevent a player from going round 1?

This has always been a common practice. Shady or unethical? Possibly so, but doesn't fit the definition of collusion at all.

Are players holding out for new contracts in the middle of their current contract colluding?

That is simply a negotiating ploy. The teams commonly ask players to reduce their pay in the middle of contracts. Quid pro quo. Nothing here implies any sort of illegal collusion.

As I mentioned earlier, the legal analyst that appeared on NFL radio discussing this suit read the whole week's worth of testimony, as well as the ruling by the independent arbiter (ruling no illegal collusion was evident). He stated that there were indeed things that had bad optics (owners thanking other owners for not doing a veteran fully guaranteed contract, etcetera), but nothing came close to satisfying the definition of any sort of illegal collusion.

The NFL is first and foremost a business. A huge business. We all know that businesses can be cutthroat and otherwise unseemly. And, yes, sometimes even illegal. But not in this case.

BakoSaint · 07-01-2025, 10:39 PM

My question is why do we care? If the salary cap is still the same amount, guaranteed contracts would not even transfer money from the owners to the players. They would transfer money to aging stars with big contracts who got hurt and would otherwise be cut from players who teams might add on short term deals as a luxury if they have cap space. In many cases these could be some of the same players. If the Giants could not cut Daniel Jones they may not have money for Russell Wilson. But if the Broncos could not cut Wilson then the Giants could not have him anyway. If the Browns could have cut Watson then perhaps they dont have to cheap out on Flacco and they get in a bidding war for Rodgers or Wilson or Darnold. Guaranteed contracts are a big win for players in a league without a salary cap like MLB but with a salary cap they are only good for particular players because they mean much less money or no offer at all for others because that money is taken. I see why many players want them. I see why agents want to say they are the ones who can get them. But I dont see why fans care.

AsylumGuido · 07-02-2025, 08:12 AM

Originally Posted by BakoSaint

My question is why do we care? If the salary cap is still the same amount, guaranteed contracts would not even transfer money from the owners to the players. They would transfer money to aging stars with big contracts who got hurt and would otherwise be cut from players who teams might add on short term deals as a luxury if they have cap space. In many cases these could be some of the same players. If the Giants could not cut Daniel Jones they may not have money for Russell Wilson. But if the Broncos could not cut Wilson then the Giants could not have him anyway. If the Browns could have cut Watson then perhaps they dont have to cheap out on Flacco and they get in a bidding war for Rodgers or Wilson or Darnold. Guaranteed contracts are a big win for players in a league without a salary cap like MLB but with a salary cap they are only good for particular players because they mean much less money or no offer at all for others because that money is taken. I see why many players want them. I see why agents want to say they are the ones who can get them. But I dont see why fans care.

I agree completely with this one sentence.

AsylumGuido · 07-02-2025, 11:50 AM

By the way, that display case is a converted antique radio cabinet.

AsylumGuido · 07-02-2025, 01:26 PM

Also by the way, the cabinet picture is current after a reorganization to better display my pride and joy, the 1918 No. 00G Officer’s Gold Set, in near mint unused condition complete with original inserts and shipping box. Check out the included price card showing $10.00! That was a ton of money back in 1918.

jnormand · 07-02-2025, 01:34 PM

That is insane!

AsylumGuido · 07-02-2025, 03:04 PM

Originally Posted by jnormand

That is insane!

I'm pretty sure I have been labeled worse.

But, hey, it's a hobby that pays for itself and contributes to our cruise fund.

SmashMouth · 07-05-2025, 11:42 AM

YouTube (Short URL)

This is a quickie watch that explains everything.

TheOak · 07-07-2025, 11:18 AM

Devils Advocate

Merriam-Webster
Collusion - secret agreement or cooperation especially for an illegal or deceitful purpose.

Just because the public does not know, does not make it a secrete or illegal. Also, lets not forget that everyone but the agents are employees of the same company.

Discussing the avoidance of fully guaranteed contracts as a general policy within the same company is a far stretch from collusion. The NFLPA wants to frame it as collusion because they want their players to get guaranteed contracts but no one else is concerned.

Lord knows how poorly players have performed after that big guaranteed payout. No guarantee is better for competition.

06-30-2025, 06:24 AM	#1
saintsfan1976 10000 POST CLUB Join Date: Apr 2007 Location: Atlanta Posts: 11,057 Blog Entries: 3	Re: Collusion-Gate: The Secret Texts and Testimony of NFL Owners and Superstar QBs, Revealed Are agents colluding to secure guaranteed money for second round picks? Are scouts discussing player evaluations colluding to prevent a player from going round 1? Are players holding out for new contracts in the middle of their current contract colluding?

06-30-2025, 08:06 AM	#2
AsylumGuido 10000 POST CLUB Join Date: Sep 2007 Location: Bossier City, LA Posts: 26,766	Re: Collusion-Gate: The Secret Texts and Testimony of NFL Owners and Superstar QBs, Revealed Originally Posted by saintsfan1976 Are agents colluding to secure guaranteed money for second round picks? Not in any illegal sense. Working together to form a united front is not against the law. The agents are not doing anything in "secret" nor are they trying to "cheat or deceive others". Are scouts discussing player evaluations colluding to prevent a player from going round 1? This has always been a common practice. Shady or unethical? Possibly so, but doesn't fit the definition of collusion at all. Are players holding out for new contracts in the middle of their current contract colluding? That is simply a negotiating ploy. The teams commonly ask players to reduce their pay in the middle of contracts. Quid pro quo. Nothing here implies any sort of illegal collusion. As I mentioned earlier, the legal analyst that appeared on NFL radio discussing this suit read the whole week's worth of testimony, as well as the ruling by the independent arbiter (ruling no illegal collusion was evident). He stated that there were indeed things that had bad optics (owners thanking other owners for not doing a veteran fully guaranteed contract, etcetera), but nothing came close to satisfying the definition of any sort of illegal collusion. The NFL is first and foremost a business. A huge business. We all know that businesses can be cutthroat and otherwise unseemly. And, yes, sometimes even illegal. But not in this case.
	“The pessimist sees difficulty in every opportunity. The optimist sees the opportunity in every difficulty.” — Winston Churchill

07-01-2025, 10:39 PM	#3
BakoSaint 1000 Posts + Join Date: Dec 2018 Posts: 2,425	Re: Collusion-Gate: The Secret Texts and Testimony of NFL Owners and Superstar QBs, Revealed My question is why do we care? If the salary cap is still the same amount, guaranteed contracts would not even transfer money from the owners to the players. They would transfer money to aging stars with big contracts who got hurt and would otherwise be cut from players who teams might add on short term deals as a luxury if they have cap space. In many cases these could be some of the same players. If the Giants could not cut Daniel Jones they may not have money for Russell Wilson. But if the Broncos could not cut Wilson then the Giants could not have him anyway. If the Browns could have cut Watson then perhaps they dont have to cheap out on Flacco and they get in a bidding war for Rodgers or Wilson or Darnold. Guaranteed contracts are a big win for players in a league without a salary cap like MLB but with a salary cap they are only good for particular players because they mean much less money or no offer at all for others because that money is taken. I see why many players want them. I see why agents want to say they are the ones who can get them. But I dont see why fans care.
BakoSaint 1000 Posts + Join Date: Dec 2018 Posts: 2,425

07-02-2025, 08:12 AM	#4
AsylumGuido 10000 POST CLUB Join Date: Sep 2007 Location: Bossier City, LA Posts: 26,766	Re: Collusion-Gate: The Secret Texts and Testimony of NFL Owners and Superstar QBs, Revealed Originally Posted by BakoSaint My question is why do we care? If the salary cap is still the same amount, guaranteed contracts would not even transfer money from the owners to the players. They would transfer money to aging stars with big contracts who got hurt and would otherwise be cut from players who teams might add on short term deals as a luxury if they have cap space. In many cases these could be some of the same players. If the Giants could not cut Daniel Jones they may not have money for Russell Wilson. But if the Broncos could not cut Wilson then the Giants could not have him anyway. If the Browns could have cut Watson then perhaps they dont have to cheap out on Flacco and they get in a bidding war for Rodgers or Wilson or Darnold. Guaranteed contracts are a big win for players in a league without a salary cap like MLB but with a salary cap they are only good for particular players because they mean much less money or no offer at all for others because that money is taken. I see why many players want them. I see why agents want to say they are the ones who can get them. But I dont see why fans care. I agree completely with this one sentence.

07-02-2025, 11:50 AM	#5
AsylumGuido 10000 POST CLUB Join Date: Sep 2007 Location: Bossier City, LA Posts: 26,766	Re: Collusion-Gate: The Secret Texts and Testimony of NFL Owners and Superstar QBs, Revealed By the way, that display case is a converted antique radio cabinet. SmashMouth likes this.

07-02-2025, 01:26 PM	#6
AsylumGuido 10000 POST CLUB Join Date: Sep 2007 Location: Bossier City, LA Posts: 26,766	Re: Collusion-Gate: The Secret Texts and Testimony of NFL Owners and Superstar QBs, Revealed Also by the way, the cabinet picture is current after a reorganization to better display my pride and joy, the 1918 No. 00G Officer’s Gold Set, in near mint unused condition complete with original inserts and shipping box. Check out the included price card showing $10.00! That was a ton of money back in 1918. SmashMouth likes this.

07-02-2025, 01:34 PM	#7
jnormand 5000 POSTS! + Join Date: Sep 2003 Location: The Free State of Idaho Posts: 5,781	Re: Collusion-Gate: The Secret Texts and Testimony of NFL Owners and Superstar QBs, Revealed That is insane! AsylumGuido likes this.

07-02-2025, 03:04 PM	#8
AsylumGuido 10000 POST CLUB Join Date: Sep 2007 Location: Bossier City, LA Posts: 26,766	Re: Collusion-Gate: The Secret Texts and Testimony of NFL Owners and Superstar QBs, Revealed Originally Posted by jnormand That is insane! I'm pretty sure I have been labeled worse. But, hey, it's a hobby that pays for itself and contributes to our cruise fund.

07-07-2025, 11:18 AM	#10
TheOak 10000 POST CLUB Join Date: Dec 2009 Location: Cypress Tx. Posts: 19,055	Re: Collusion-Gate: The Secret Texts and Testimony of NFL Owners and Superstar QBs, Revealed Devils Advocate Merriam-Webster Collusion - secret agreement or cooperation especially for an illegal or deceitful purpose. Just because the public does not know, does not make it a secrete or illegal. Also, lets not forget that everyone but the agents are employees of the same company. Discussing the avoidance of fully guaranteed contracts as a general policy within the same company is a far stretch from collusion. The NFLPA wants to frame it as collusion because they want their players to get guaranteed contracts but no one else is concerned. Lord knows how poorly players have performed after that big guaranteed payout. No guarantee is better for competition. jnormand, AsylumGuido and SmashMouth like this.
	It's not what you look at that matters, it's what you see. ~ Henry David Thoreau