qb, i'm curious.........
 

i know whodi wants one, but, is duece our answer at rb?
not even mentioning defense, but really, is duece the man he was?
can he return to his old form? i've seen very few flashes of it before he was hurt......and truthfully, i am worried about him........
sure, a super star qb would be welcome on any team but come draft day, who do you think will pass on bush and take leinart, really?
i would really like to know who thinks we're best to stick with duece? smitty

RE: qb, i
 

I am not sold on Deuce right now. Even before the knee injury, it appeared that he lost a great deal of speed. At this point I do not see anyone passing on Bush to take Leinart, including the Saints if they happen to get the top pick.

Re: RE: qb, i
 

you noticed too, huh? if we're throwing out scenarios, how about this?
let's trade brooks, duece and the 1st or 2nd (hopefully) (by the way, anyone thinking houston is gonna win, well, i would'nt ...and then again, the saints would be blessed enough to pull an upset) to the giants for eli.....................smitty

RE: Re: RE: qb, i
 

Smitty- I would trade Brooks, Deuce, and 1st round draft pick for Eli in heartbeat. Only issue is I do not think the Giants would go for it... :|

Re: RE: Re: RE: qb, i
 

alright, throw in haz and the whole coaching staff too...........
i have tears in my eyes as i write this because i'm roflmao.........................smitty

RE: Re: RE: Re: RE: qb, i
 

u, guys are cracking me up. good to see humor in here. but have to differ on your opinion, granted deuce had a down year maybe year and half. but he's the ideal type player regardless of position. never give up on a player after injury too many rb's have come back from acl's edge the latest. deuce has the heart of a lion and i would hate to see a class act like him leave.

Re: RE: Re: RE: Re: RE: qb, i
 

i never questioned deuce's heart and he is the class act of the saints.......
i miss him and it was long before the injury............
truely, i do have tears in my eyes again as i find myself lmao just thinking where the saints will be much less who they will draft and trade..........
there really is humor in misfortune and for some reason the saints have my attention.....smitty

RE: Re: RE: Re: RE: Re: RE: qb, i
 

Can't bring myself to give up on Deuce, either. When he's on, he is upper echelon. Can only hope that he can regain his old form. Just my opinion, I haven't heard anything in regards to his knees.

RE: Re: RE: Re: RE: Re: RE: qb, i
 

I hope he can to BnB but I'm afraid of the fact that we haven't heard anything about his knees. If we draft Bush we could keep both and pound the run all game long.

RE: Re: RE: Re: RE: Re: RE: qb, i
 

I think Deuce needs to get back to hitting the holes with speed but I never thought he was all that fast anyway so I haven't noticed a drop off there. My biggest problem with the running game has been blocking. There just have not been the holes that have been there in the past for Deuce. Still, he's got some things to work on and coming back off the injury isn't going to be easy.

I wouldn't give up on Deuce yet, but what I would do is find a capable backup. Not being a homer at all, but someone like Joseph Addai would be a perfect fit. Stecker has done a decent job, but he's not a home run hitter, tends to fumble a bit too much, and seems to struggle in pass protection. If the franchise quarterback is available when you pick, you take the franchise quarterback. The only issue I have with Leinart would be signability. Not that I think he would pull an Eli, but knowing how this front office works, the fact that they haven't gotten a first round pick in camp on time in a few years, and the uncertainty of the Saints makes me question how much a problem it may turn out to be. If he is drafted, the last thing this franchise needs would be a lengthy holdout from someone who will be the face of the franchise for years to come.

With a QB under center who has the arm and accuracy to deep threat .

Deuce is gonna rule the pool .....

Dump Deuce. Deuce hasn't been the same since he hurt his ankle 2 years ago. He's been either 50% or 0% for the last 2 years. With the injury he's sustained, it's unlikely he'll make it back to 100% and with his history whatever condition in which he'll return he likely won't remain there long.

More importantly, I certainly am not going to pay Benson money to see the Saints next year unless there's some sort of compelling reason, like witnessing a once in a generation player like Bush in Black and Gold. This concept of New Orleans not supporting a team would be more realistic if there was actually a FOOTBALL player on it.

I sympathize with this, and it has been something that has me torn. I want to support the team in every way possible, in order to prove to the NFL that New Orleans can support a franchise. But, not exactly thrilled with putting more money in the greedy coffers of such an A-Hole.

It hasn't looked good outside the state of Louisiana, from a media standpoint. Questions arise as to whether or not a team can be supported in the gulf, and the first point they site is the attendance records at Tiger stadium.

First, we can't dump Deuce. We just signed him to a new deal last year. So yeah, Deuce being one of the highest paid RBs n the league now, let's draft another one with the first pick, and have so much money tied up in one position we can't sign anyone else. Brilliant. I read Deuce will be ready for training camp. He'll be fine. Hopefully with the injury he has dropped weight, and can get back some explosion. Hopefully the new coach will let him be and not tell him to bulk up, slim down, and then bulk up again.

Second, FRANCHISE QB. Anyone know what that means? Prob not cause we haven't had one since Archie. You don't pass on those, PERIOD. Never. Ever. Leinart is the real deal. He is grading our higher than Eli and Carson did on draft boards. And we pass that up for what? Bouman? Someone else's backup? Although there are several backups I would have taken, that was prior to a realistic shot at Leinart. Now we have it. Passing on him would be the dumbest thing we could do, cause we will prob never be in this position to get a QB like this again. Ever. Can't do it. Nope.

we shouldn't give up on deuce....with brooks at qb, all defenses focused on him......its kind of hard to do something with pigskin if the defense knows you are going to have the ball in your hands 90% of the time.

Having been a front line spear chucker in the mighty and righteous movement to rid ourselves of Brooks, you don't need to tell me of the glaring need at qb. Yet a qb's best friend is the unstoppable RB, and Deuce is just too damn stoppable. He doesn't hit holes, he's slowing down and he's hurt most of the time; I don't care how much is on his contract, he will be worth more to us in a trade than he has been on the field the last two years. There will be at least 10 quality qbs on the open market (11 if you count AB, lol) and any one of them can serve as mentor to AMac. Geez, look at Drew Brees (not his fault that they didn't make the playoffs this year) and his resurgence due to an unstoppable Ladanian Tomlinson.

Plus, if you follow fantasy football theorists, running backs like Alexander and Tomlinson have more impact on winning for their NFL teams than quarterbacks, hence their value. Controlling the ground game has and will be the foremost issue for Super Bowl caliber teams, and there's no sense in making ourselves Benson-like and going against this reality. How many rated rookie franchise qb's actually delivered? We're still waiting for most of them to put their helmets on.

But more than anything, whoever's starting at RB better damn well hold onto the ball this year. This crew can't hold on to their ass while wiping.

xan, ever heard of Tom Brady? Course you have. In his first two superbowls, what kinda running game did he have? Hardly any. Peyton Manning? How easy do you think it is for Edge to run with defenses knowing Peyton can light them up at will? Donovan McNabb? No running game, made the superbowl last year, and NFC champ game 4 straight. Tomlinson? He was the best back in the league 3 years ago, and the Chargers were 4-12. They sucked for his first 2-3 years, yet he was the best back in football. Not until Drew Brees stepped up did they take the next step. Please don't try and tell me a great QB can't overcome a weak running game. But a great running game can't cover for a weak QB. How many titles did Barry Sanders win for the Lions? To me he is the best back ever. IMO, Deuce can still do it. blocking, and coaches fluctuating his weight screwed with him. I am willing to bet he will come back next year hungrier, leaner, and ready to carry the load. No way we pass on Leinart. No way.

Deuce is done. I blame the Oline as well they are horrible can't block for Brooks can't block for Deuce... If we have a shot at Bush I say we snag him, if not we address that Oline. Thats where everything starts.

Yeah, I've heard of that 6th round pick before, what's your point? That it's a total crap shoot on qb's and while Deuce did have great impact in his 1st two years here, the drag on him in that draft was that he'd be hurt most of the time, and guess what! The Saints need a whole lot of everything. But like Euph said, if the O-line doesn't think you'll hit the holes they're making because you're fat and slow and decellerate at the point of attack, why bother blocking (I'm liberally translating here, sorry Euph). The only thing that makes a qb good enough to develop into a Brady is the threat that someone else on your team will beat you worse than him; Brady has had some excellent and durable RB's to hand the ball to over 45% of the time. Deuce is not that guy anymore. Bush is. I'd rather have Leinart's O-Line than Leinart, push came to shove.

Antowain Smith and Kevin Faulk? Excellent and durable? Agree to diagree.
What about McNabb? No running game ever in Philly.
What about LT and the 4-12 Chargers with crap QBs, when LT was gaining 1500 yards and catching 100 balls?

NE had noone with that threat. Not until they got Corey Dillon. Great QBs are great QBs. period.

I'll just agree to disagree, and will welcome you back on the Deuce bandwagon, and onto the Leinart bandwagon, with both are ready to go.

Living as I do in the Northeast, I've had the miserable pleasure of watching the Eagles each weekend plus the Patriots most every weekend. The Eagles have had several fantastic running backs and one of the strongest running games, including most recently Brian Westbrook (who's a threat all over the field) because there were no wideouts worth throwing to there (until TO). Antawain Smith has looked better than Deuce and ran for almost as many yards as Deuce with NE; Cory Dillon was only slightly more effective than Antawain last year (many analysts have said that Dillon was not an upgrade). All I know about the Charger is that the Chargers' D was miserable (worse than the Saints, even), which accounts for their 4-12 seasons with LT.

I'm on the bandwagon of bringing buzz and people into the Dome to show that the franchise is viable in NO. Next year will be a losing season no matter what, so I'm for getting the most exciting player in the draft and hyping the hell out of him to sell tickets. Otherwise there won't be much to cheer about after next season. Chicago flocked to see Jordan though the Bulls sucked for 3 years, I'd bet the Gulf would flock to see Bush. The only monkey wrench is that Benson won't do SQUAT to market in the Gulf no matter who we draft.

I'd bet they'd flock to see Leinart too, especially for how long many of them have been tired of Aaron Brooks. Franchise QBs will always outdraw franchise RBs. Always.

Last year the Eagles were 24th in rushing. Made the superbowl.
Year before the Pats were 27th, won the Superbowl.

I don't know where to begin with how false that is. Deuce didn't become our starter until what, 2002? He had 1300 yards. Following year, 1600. After getting hurt, still had 1000 last year. Smith's best season EVER was 1157 yards. As a matter of fact, in 4 1/2 years, Deuce is only 2300 yards behind Smith, who has played for 9 years. That's COUNTING Deuce not playing when he was a rookie, and getting hurt for the year this year.

Sure, if you consider slightly better 1635 yards and 12 Tds as opposed to 642 yards and 3 TDs, which was Smith's last yea with NE, when they won the Superbowl. 1000 more yards and 9 more TDs is only "slightly" better? Harsh standards.

They weren't worse than the Saints. We were dead last in total yards last year. But, I thought all they needed was a great RB.and that would be enough. But they were 5-11 in 2001 with LT, and they had the 10th ranked defense. Go with Leinart.

Before anyone gets too excited about Reggie Bush, just take a look at Barry Sanders' career. He was a one of a kind back, that never played with a decent quarterback and could never carry the franchise past the first round of the playoffs. There have been 39 Super Bowls, or 78 starting quarterbacks. Exactly 39 or 50% of the starting quarterbacks for Super Bowl teams have been first round picks. The Saints have drafted one quarterback in the first round (not counting Dave Wilson in the supplemental draft) in the franchise's history. Maybe it's time to draft a second.

I agree with everything you said, compeltely, except:

The Lions did make an NFC Champ game with Barry, and they lost of course.

and people wonder why he retired early.

That's right, I stand corrected.

It's all good. Hell, I was making the Barry point a few posts back myself:
That's a prime example of having a great RB, one of the greatest ever as a matter of fact, and continued poor QB play over the course of almost a decade dooming that great RB. Leinart is the choice. We need this.

I think modeling ourselves either after the Bronco's or Patriots, we need to start upfront. Brady is nothing without that line. Denver you can put any rusher behind that line and they are going to do very well. They won Superbowl yeah yeah Elway but still nothing without that line. They have also remained competitive with the 'rebuilding' since Elway because the line.

That's what FA is for, building the line. I'd rather take a FA offensive lineman than a rookie one anyway in most cases. So we get a good LT in FA, keep LeCharles, and draft Leinart. What's the problem?

I also think the line would be better if we had decent coaches. Lastly, how many times has Bouman been sacked since he started? Far less than Brooks. The line will be fine once they get someone they actually want to block for behind them.

If Leinart is there I say take him, If D'angelo Williams is there and Leinart and Bush are not I say take Williams, Trade AB dump Bouman and get two more qb's in camp for some real competition with A-Mac

Competition qb's should be young and hungry to play, ie Rivers, Kingsbury, Jay Cutler (2nd or third round draft), Brad Smith out of Mizzou (Late round draft pick), Mauck, Nall, David Green, etc.

I am not sure hom many quality veteran qb's are going to be out there in the market...Does anyone know who will be available?

less ye all forget, this is the saints drafting.....................sigh........................
i'd still take eli for brooks, duece, and whatever our draft pick is.................
whoodi, when you compare leinart to brady, (in a matter of speaking) well, i'll trade for brady over eli...........
i mean really, what was brady, a fifth? who'd a ever thunk?
but, hats off to all that say it starts up front...............we do need that line.........
now, in all superbowls, if you go by statistics, how did the defense rank?
there again, where do we start?
anyway, i am still curious as to hear more fans state their opinions about duece.....
oh, and whoodi, care to make a friendly wager as to who will be taken first? smitty

Glad you're not in the front office. Yikes. I like Eli and all.........

Didn't really compare him, just making the point it does not take 3-5 years for a young QB to make an impact.

Hmm, there is already a consensus on who is the number one pick, except if we get number one. So if we have the first pick, I will gladly make that wager. Other than that, just about anyone else would take Bush, what is there to bet on? If a DE was rated the number one overall player, and we didn't need it, which we don't, would you suggest we take one of those again? Would that make a lot of sense? No? Neither does taking another RB after you have just made yours one of the highest paid players in the league.

I'm truly at a loss for words after reading this entire post. Sure, Deuce has had some injury problems the last two seasons. Sure, his durability may be a question mark. Sure, he hasn't put up the numbers that we were all hoping he would. I can see where we all are frustrated by that. There is no reason to just toss him to the side like yesterdays garbage, though. When Deuce was running for what? 8 or 9 straight 100 yard games were any of you wanting him gone? No...EVERYONE was on the Deucewagon. The only people who weren't were people who were too busy defending that numbskull Brooks. So if Deuce committed a fumble, then they were all over him. Everyone else was quick to defend Deuce. Me included. I'm here again to do the same. I'm glad they signed Deuce to an extension. I'm glad he'll be a Saint for years to come, barring trade, of course. To draft Reggie Bush would only be for ONE REASON......to turn right around and trade HIM. It would be an idiotic move by the organization (though it wouldn't surprise me). Whodi hit the nail on the head by saying that if we draft Bush, then we tie up money into ONE POSITION and have no money left to improve the team where it really needs it. Keep Deuce. Draft Leinart. 'Nuff said.

i'm just saying plain and simple if leinart is there when we draft, i don't think the saints go that route. while we probably should start over at scratch with a possibly qb of the future the picture is cloudy at best in no.
those that don't like benson now, really may want his head come draft time with the crap he could stir.........if haz is indeed gone, who knows what new puppet benson will bring in.
if you remember when haz was being interviewed about the benching of brooks, he made sure to mention that benson was informed of this. i'm guessing contract wise, this was a must and haz was covering........after all, we have witnessed what happens to those that don't follow bensons rules........
here is the scenerio i think may happen........
1) come the end of the season, benson may try to offer haz a different contract coming off a 3 or 4 -13-12 season......after all, it is about money and not winning in no......and once again, benson holds the cards......
2) brooks may be offered to rework his contract to the advantage of the payroll dept while the saints try and figure out what went wrong and how to correct it.....
and with this scenerio, figure this, brooks has had time to cool off a bit and may be willing to do it provided he has the chance to compete and win the starting job again.
3) if either one or two happens, which direction do you think the saints will go?

remember this, though most want haz and brooks gone, they are'nt.........yet..............
and, if after the last game, benson does not do the sweep immediately, we may see at least haz back again next season where ever the saints are........

scary? smitty

Here's something to think about, if Haslett quits/gets fired next week, it would be in his best interest to hire someone good/capable, and draft someone worthy because the San Antonio situation still won't be resolved. And it is in his best interest to get this team back on a winning track in case he does get the ok to move, because he is going to have to sell tickets in Texas, and I think he realizes that just showing up in Texas isn't going to guarantee that people will show up and be ready to pay full price for tickets for a losing team.

i'd agree with that except for one thing, san an is supporting the losers now......and will continue as we did for 40 yrs if they did move...........win or lose as i do.............smitty