How Would You Fix the D?
 

What are some things that ya'll would suggest to make our D better? Maybe a complete scheme change is the answer and maybe it isn't. Some seem to think that the new players we signed will solve all of our problems and that might be true. If you could be a defensive advisor for a day, what would you suggest? Since our defense is too small to switch to a 3-4 how about us switching to a base cover 2? I thought maybe a switch to a pressure 3-4 would help hide our flawed secondary but that was too crazy of an idea to even have an adult discussion about. The cover 2 is another way to do more with less at safety and corner and our LBs would be a great fit. Let me hear what you got?

Re: How Would You Fix the D?
 

It could work to go to a base 2, but I just think with our d-line and the new LB's if we just blitz more and put some pressure on the QB our D would look alot better.

Re: How Would You Fix the D?
 

I agree that with the new guys coming in we should be able to blitz more effectively. It's been a long time since we had a great pass rushing LB. I'm trying to remember the last time we had a true sack artist at LB. Anyway HUSKER, we ran some zone looks last year and I remember thinking that MM looked very natural in it. At this point in his career I think going to a base cover 2 would help him out alot. When he was at GB he could keep up with any WR in the league not named Randy Moss but he has lost a step. Aside from MM it would help J. David and R. Gay as well because that's what they're used to. I got jumped for suggesting a switch 3-4 mainly because of the whole Vilma is better in a 4-3 deal. Well hell, if two of our top three projected corners are a better fit for cover 2, then why not run it?

Re: How Would You Fix the D?
 

It's a short list:

1) Get quality defensive players in at every level.
2) Teach the players to work together.
3) Enforce to each player that they must DO THEIR JOB!
4) Remove any player from the defense that isn't meeting point #3.

Point 1 is off to a decent start. Vilma, possibly Morgan, I hope Gay, and McCray represent talent. We're still short in the secondary as I'd like to see another top flight corner in the fold.

#2 and #3 is where the Saints have been awful the last couple of seasons. CB out on islands without safety help because the safeties bite on run fakes. LBs getting swallowed up because tackles do not occupy double teams. Jason David peeking into the backfield instead of just running with his receiver. The list goes on and on.

The staff stuck with Simineau way too long. Bullocks is a train wreck waiting to happen, and when David got hurt midseason last year, the passing defense got better. But when he got healthy, the staff put him back in.

If a defensive player is not doing their job, they need to be benched and give another player a chance. KK is better than Bullocks. All the LBs on staff is better than #53. Let them play.

Nope. The Saints have to dance with the girl they came with. It'll take two years to effectively learn to function in a new scheme. It requires completely different styles of players. Cover 2 is very dependent on the D-Line, MLB, and safeties. It takes time and talent to learn how to play it properly.

The Saints have to do subtle changes to their existing scheme. First and foremost they have to generate more consistent pressure on the QB, Do this be improving the D-Line with a stud tackle and by being unpredictable with pressure packages. The second key thing is to teach the safeties to do their job and not bite on run fakes. Let the front 7 handle the run (which is where Vilma and Morgan will be vast improvements) and have the safeties cover in the defensive backfield.

Finally get David out of the #2 corner slot. I don't care if it's Gay, Craft, Young, or a draft pick, anyone is better than David. Drop him to the nickle (or even better the dime).

Improve players, more pressure, do you job. With our offense all the Saints defense has to do is be able to get off the field on one third down per drive to be effective. Become an effect bend don't break instead of broker than broke defense and they'll be fine.

SFIAH

Re: How Would You Fix the D?
 

The problem with all of you suggesting that we blitz more, plug in more pressure packages, ect. is that it won't happen as long as Gibbs is DC. Gibbs has proven to me over the last two years that he will take very little chances and play a embarassingly vanilla defense. I mean the guy wouldn't blitz David F****** Carr who is a guaranteed sack if you blitz. And as a result he beat us. DAVID CARR BEAT US! WTF!! This was the game that killed Gary Gibbs in my mind, but by no means is the only reason the only reason I think he needs to be replaced.

I don't care who we sign as long as we have Gary Gibbs as our DC our defense won't be able to be be dominant, and probably won't rise above mediocre. Payton needs to be very careful about loyalty in this case, because I can see him walking down the same road as Haslett, with his Defensive Coordinator's ineffectiveness leading to his failure. That said I love Payton and hope this does not happen.

So how would I fix the D?

Step 1: (and the most critical step) Fire Gary Gibbs
After that I believe we would see almost immediate improvement.

Re: How Would You Fix the D?
 

Plain and simple... attack. I really don't have anything to say besides that.

Re: How Would You Fix the D?
 

I would say the last time we had a great pass rushig LB was Pat Swilling thats why I think we still need to draft a LB with one of our first two picks.

Re: How Would You Fix the D?
 

i've coached basketball for 7 years now....basketball and football are completely different sports, but the key to any great defense is to force the offense to do what you want, instead of trying to react to what they are doing.

the saints need to start forcing opposing offenses to react to them. i am sick of watching the saints d run a gameplan based off what the other team has.

Re: How Would You Fix the D?
 

Part of the reason we can't do anything everyone is suggestions is due to the limited D Coach we have. We need innovation. We need a coach who can instill disipline and play calling instead of just a basic set... "bend don't break" WTF?

Re: How Would You Fix the D?
 

it's already been fixed.

Re: How Would You Fix the D?
 

Hahahahaha

Ok here's my plan:

1. Attack, and do it with the right people. We need to use the faster people on blitzes. Last year I saw a bunch of Simoneau blitzes where he ran into the lineman and just played patty cake, it was pathetic. Use Vilma or Morgan off the edge, something that will actually work. Use Harper from the free safety spot, he had a bunch of success two years ago on FS blitzes.

2. Start the best people. Here's my lineup as of right now:

DE - Charles Grant
DT - Hollis Thomas
DT - Brian Young
DE - Will Smith
WLB - Dan Morgan, if healthy, or Shanle
MLB - Jon Vilma
SLB - Scott Fujita
CB - MM, if healthy, or Randall Gay
CB - Usama Young or Jason Craft
FS - Roman Harper
SS - Kevin Kaesviharn

Bullocks and Simoneau should never see the field.

3. Change the scheme to fit the personnel. I understand that Gibbs likes the man-to-man coverage on the outside, but if we don't have the players who can play that kind of defense, why not change it up? I'd love to see us go to a Cover 2, but if not, just play more zone coverage. It doesn't make sense to stubbornly stick to a defense when we don't have the personnel to play it right.

Re: How Would You Fix the D?
 

We are on the same page on this one TheDeuce. That's exactly what I've been saying. Gibbs is bound and determined to make a sqaure peg fit into a round hole. It is so obvious that our secondary is not cut out for a predominantly man to man defense. There is no way that Gibbs doesn't realize that. I think that it is imperative that we run more zone this season if we are going to be the contenders we were supposed to be last year. I don't see any other solution because let's face it, Bullocks is in the bottom 10 starting safeties in the league, Harper is a marginal starter, MM is past his prime and probably won't be 100% healthy any time soon, David is just gruesome in man, Usama showed promise but is too raw to be relied on, and Gay has been a zone corner his whole career.

A few people are against running the cover 2 because they feel like the transistion takes too long. If I remember correctly someone said that the transistion takes two or three years. It might take two or three years to perfect but I've seen teams have alot of success in year one. Of course the success of any scheme change depends on the talent the team starts out with when they decide to make the switch. In regards to the Saints I think we have the players needed for a relatively smooth transistion. When our DEs are healthy and in shape they can provide some of the pressure that is needed for the cover 2 to work properly. On paper our LBs seem like they would be very solid. Two of the top three CBs are better in zone. IMHO Roman Harper could be a very productive player in cover 2 but I'm not sure if there is any hope for Bullocks. The DTs wouldn't be the best fit.

Re: How Would You Fix the D?
 

DE - Charles Grant
DT - Hollis Thomas
DT - Brian Young
DE - Will Smith
WLB - Dan Morgan, if healthy, or Shanle
MLB - Jon Vilma
SLB - Scott Fujita
CB - MM, if healthy, or Randall Gay
CB - Usama Young or Jason Craft
FS - Roman Harper
SS - Kevin Kaesviharn

I really wish they'd go with this as the starters.

Re: How Would You Fix the D?
 

DE - Grant and Smith
DT - Hollis and Young
LB - Morgan, Vilma, Fujita
CB - David, McKenzie
Nickel - Gay
S - Bullocks and Harper

Those are my starters.

Re: How Would You Fix the D?
 

Did you seriously just put Jason David in front of Randall Gay? Nobody could be worse than David, not even Fred Thomas. Come on papz

Re: How Would You Fix the D?
 

Plain and simple, the Saints MUST hit a couple of home runs in the upcoming draft to get that defense right. On paper, it appears there was only slight improvement during free agency. Yes, if he is ready to go, Vilma appears to be a major upgrade. It all boils down to pass rush. If the Saints get it going, the defense should be fine. If not, it doesn't matter what type of scheme they employ, it will get picked apart.

Re: How Would You Fix the D?
 

Other than Vilma, no real impact players in FA, just solid back-ups. Still need beast OLB, DT and DB help (CB/FS)

Re: How Would You Fix the D?
 

That's my starting lineup because Payton already said he wants Gay to man the nickel. As much as I rather seeing David be the nickel/dime back, I also want Gay to be put in position to excel. I don't think David nor Gay would be a good 2. I'd start with David as he's more familiar with the system and did show signs of improvement towards the end of the season. If that doesn't work out, I wouldn't hesitate subbing Gay in there for the rest of the season.

Those are my starters but it doesn't mean I like it.

Re: How Would You Fix the D?
 

I'm hoping Usama Young or some bright young rookie from the draft gets the nod over Jason David. I'd like to see Gay man the nickel as well. He's a good nickel corner, just not a true #1 or #2.

Re: How Would You Fix the D?
 

I think the needs are at CB, DT and Safety in that order.

CB we need another shut down corner like Big Mac and I still think this will be the first pick in the draft. Cromartie, Talib, Jenkins, McElvin, all bring their own pro's and con's to the table and I think anyone of them would work.

Safety Bullocks can be burned, Bellamy's too old, and Special KK should be better this year. Harper can't do it all on his own. We need another big hitter like Harper.

DT I think this will be our 2nd round pick and will either be Dre Moore or Laws. Both will be put into the rotation immediately and could start depending on how fast they developed. With Hollis and Young back this wouldn't be a sore spot anymore.

Re: How Would You Fix the D?
 

Missile, I agree with you totally on replacing Bullocks. I feel that as bad as JD was last year, Bullocks was just as responsible for the bad play in the secondary if not more so. He has never been good. Never will be good. But as far as replacing him, if we do not pick up anyone I really feel that if we just replace Bullocks with KK it will be a significant upgrade. In the games that Kaesviharn started he looked so much better than Bullocks. That doesn't mean that KK is the answer, but I am positive that he is better (I mean Simoneau looked good to me at first after two years of Courtney Watson, sorry to bring that name up again). With Harper now being two years removed from ACL surgery and having another year of experience and KK replacing Bullocks, I feel like our safety play won't be such a liability next year, and might even be a pleasant surprise. Also maybe Phillips can fall to us in round 2, or even better we could trade down and pick him later in the 1st round.

Re: How Would You Fix the D?
 

Usualy it takes players about 2 years to fully recover from an ACL injury, so we can wait to make our final judgement on Harper until this year. I think he will be fine. Probably not great but good enough.

Re: How Would You Fix the D?
 

Everybody wants to change scheme ,coaches etc... The problem with the Saints D is very simple we lack talent at several positions . CB is a very high profile one everybody seems to think that if we get the second coming of DEON that the Saints will solve there defensive problems , IMHO I beg to differ The Saints need a DT capable of creating a push up the middle and requiring offenses to double team him . This would free up LBs and DEs to rush the passer . Our LBs are very mediorce ,I think the FO has realized this and is attemting to upgrade this position with the additions of Vilma and Morgan . Today's NFL uses alot of spread offenses 3 and 4 wide sets IMHO it is difficult for DBs to efffect the game without a substantial pass rush. I hope that we use our draft to improve our front 7 and add some talent to our DB roster

Re: How Would You Fix the D?
 

I'd rather that also gandhi. One can only hope Young would be ready to man the 2 spot but I honestly feel he won't make a big contribution until next year.

Re: How Would You Fix the D?
 

I agree with you Papz. I don't know what people saw last year that makes them think that Usama is ready to be a starter. I don't see him being anything more than a dime back. He was terrible at tackling, and I can't remember ever thinking during a game "That was great coverage by Usama." He's a work in progress and will take a year or two more, if he even pans out at all. To be perfectly honest, with McKenzie probably on the PUP, Jason Craft is the best CB on our roster that played for us last year (and I hated Craft before last year). Go back and look at the film. He played very well last year. I'm skeptical because of his age and his lack of ever impressing me before, but he played good last year. Usama on the other hand was irrelevant.

Re: How Would You Fix the D?
 

what you guys don't get is MM is going to start the season :).

Re: How Would You Fix the D?
 

The question is whether or not he'll be anywhere close to 100%.

SFIAH

Re: How Would You Fix the D?
 

Completely false. With a successful surgery and rehab a player can make it back completely in about 9 months.

Re: How Would You Fix the D?
 

It takes about 9 months before they are cleared by a doctor and they can play again. That doesn't mean the player is going to come back and be his old self right away. For RBs it usually takes a full season of playing to get back to where they were before the injury. The way it usually goes is a RB get's hurt in one season and sits out, comes back the next season and looks like about 85% of his old self, and then by the third season he is back to 100%. However, alot of non-RBs are able to come back the season after the injury and not skip a beat. I think Roman was healthy last year, he's just not all that fast or agile. He was never a track guy to begin with.

Re: How Would You Fix the D?
 

do you think he needs to be? I'd rather have MM at 70% than have Jason David or Jason Craft, lol.