Memnoch_TP

Bow to his knowledge, just not his wisdom. Defense winning championships has NOTHING to do with NOT picking up Shockey. You have to have an offense, and a damn good one is better than an average one or a bad one.

I mean, we could probably trade Drew Brees for some stud defensive player. Wouldn't be too hard to do. I mean, we can get by with Brunell. He is solid, but not spectacular. Get Shaun Alexander and trade Reggie for a stud DB, and we are rolling.

I mean, why not? If upgrading the offense = hurting the defense, downgrading the offense should assure us a Super Bowl victory.

Who would have thought that Drew Brees and Reggie Bush were actually dragging us down. Drew and Reggie are why the defense sucks! Those bloody offensive leeches should be run out of town on a rail.



Have you ever gone to Waffle House? You see all those numbers they scribble on the side of the check? They are magic. No matter how many times you tally up the numbers, they are always different. They just shift around, and the waitress just approximates a total and scribbles it down. This is the phenomenon I have labeled "Waffle House Mathematics".

SFIAH, you have created the strategy and personnel version of "Waffle House Mathematics". Riddle me this, Waffle Master, why didn't we have "The Dome Patrol Part Deaux" when A.B. was behind center? LOL.

"Human beings, who are almost unique in having the ability to learn from the experience of others, are also remarkable for their apparent disinclination to do so." -- Douglas Adams.

SaintFanInATLHELL

We have a damn good one right now. #1 and #4 in the league in yards the last 2 years. 5th and 12th in scoring.

Now you've finally gotten to the cost argument. Good.

Let's start with Brees. He cost the team nothing but money. And money structured in such a way that if he didn't work out, the team could cut him for virtually no cost, because he had a $12 million option bonus after the first year.

Reggie was drafted. Again all he costs is money.

Let's not even talk about Alexander. Uggg.

In the case of Shockey, upgrading the offense is hurting the defense. Let's remember what the offer on the table to Giants supposedly was: Our 2nd round pick AND Roman Harper. That pick turned into Porter. So if the trigger got pulled then you lose a defensive starter and a player that's likely to be a contributor on the defense and ST.

Now let's look at the Saints defensive acquitions this offseason so far:

Vilma: cost a 4th round pick and possibly a second next year.

Morgan: just money:

Ellis: A 3rd round pick with the swap that turned into Nicks, projected to be a 2nd round talent. WOW! You get a 2nd round offensive player too!

Porter: nothing but the pick

Pressley: nothing but the pick.

So upgrading the defense cost little more than a couple of picks.

More pointedly, absolutely none of these guys have been reported to be anything other than team oriented pros in the locker room.

Maybe you haven't read my analysis of what should be done with the offense. In summary:

1) Resign our free agents. Check.
2) Integrate PT23 into the running game. Remains to be seen.
3) Pay Colston. Remains to be seen.
4) Get Meachum out on the field. Remains to be seen.
5) Continue to shore up the offensive line to keep Brees upright and to bolster the running game. Goodwin at center and the integration of the young OL (Allenman, Bushrod, Nicks) should assure that.
6) Get Stickum for the receivers hands

In short, the offense is already capable of playing at a championship level.

Funny.

Don't get me started about Brooks. There isn't enough space on the Internet for that discussion.

BTW that 2000 Saints defensive squad was 10th in the league in scoring defense. That, along with the 10th best scoring offense, led the Saints to the NFC west crown and the teams first playoff win.

The bottom fell out in 2001. Guess what? The defense dropped to 27th.

My "Waffle House Mathematics" as you put it doesn't change. Successful teams in the NFL play defense. That's the foundation. It's a theme that is recurrent and timeless.

BTW I think it's disingenuous for you to intimate that I want to dismantle the offense to build the defense. I certainly would have had a problem if the Saints wanted to get rid of Brees, Bush, Brown, Colston, or any of the offensive talent to improve the defense. So far the FO has done a brilliant job of rebuilding the defense through judicious trades of draft picks, free agency, and the draft.

But Shockey has deep meaningful costs associated with acquiring him. All I've been pointing out throughout the now dozen pages of this thread is that while he'd certainly improve an already outstanding offense, that the costs in personnel, money, and team chemistry are going to cut, and cut deeply into the fabric of this team.

I'd certainly have no issue with the money if that's all it would cost. I'd even consider rocking the team chemistry boat. But the personnel cost? That's over the top for me.

SFIAH

Super Bowl Championships: New Orleans Saints:1, Carolina:0, Atlanta Chokers: STILL ZERO

Only Atlanta choked in an unchokable situation... Life is definitely good.