Anthony Hargrove's Statement/ Yahoo Sports
 

Anthony Hargrove's declaration to NFL regarding Saints bounty scandal - Yahoo! Sports

Sorry, it won't allow me to copy and paste.

The gist of it is that he was coerced into lying by Williams and Vitt with the implied promise to become the starting LDE.

If this is true then GW and Vitt are pretty scummy.

And if true... A lot of people "assumed" the coercion came from the NFL...

Also..... Since that statement was taken in 2010...

MOOT

Based on the 2011 CBA :-)

Another out of the box thought.... In legal ease, if i understand correctly.... When an originating piece of evidence is ruled out for some reason then all knowledge gained from that original piece is not admissible either?

E.G... this all started in 2009/2010 so anything found after the new CBA in 2011 would be moot also by basis of origin?

Need a lawyer to vet this thought please.

OK. Granted, the lawyer here is Mike Florio, but he breaks it down well. He blasts the league.

Hargrove says Williams, Vitt told him to
Now for what Hargrove’s declaration doesn’t say. At no point in the declaration does Hargrove admit to any knowledge of the existence of a bounty program. Indeed, at no point does Hargrove claim that he was told to say anything different from what he would have otherwise said, without coaching.

In other words, Hargrove never says he was told to lie. Instead, he says he was told what to say, without commenting on whether he believed what he was told to say to be the truth.

And so, when the NFL said last week in the announcement of the suspensions of Hargrove and three other players that the declaration “established not only the existence of the program with the Saints, but also that he knew about and participated in it,” that statement was blatantly incorrect. And when “independent” counsel Mary Jo White explained in a conference call last week that the “thrust” of the declaration was Hargrove’s acknowledgment of “the nature of the program and his participation in it,” that was blatantly incorrect, too.

It may simply be semantics, given that Williams and Vitt apparently confessed to the existence of a bounty program — which necessarily means that Hargrove had lied. But in his declaration he never says that he lied, and he never admits that the bounty program existed.

The flaw in the NFL’s comments about the Hargrove declaration is subtle, but significant. The plain language of the Hargrove declaration as compared to the NFL’s characterization of it shows that the league is playing a little fast and loose with the facts. Which makes it even more critical that the league stop spoon-feeding the NFLPA and the media characterizations and summaries and conclusions, and that it start coughing up the raw data on which the characterizations and summaries and conclusions were based.

Back when I was practicing law, I’d periodically explain to a jury that, upon encountering a piece of rancid meat in a pot of beef stew, the reaction isn’t to keep eating but to dump it all out. Though the league’s mischaracterization of Hargrove’s declaration may not justify ignoring the full weight of the bounty evidence, it means that, at a minimum, someone must have an opportunity to scrutinize all facts, apart from the skewed, self-serving filter the league has applied when talking about the case.

This is getting juicy :popcorn:

Yeah, it really helps if you read it over again a second time -- he doesn't actually ever say that there WAS a bounty program, or that there wasn't a bounty program. And yet the league is acting as if he somehow did admit to it in this statement.

Here is the famous declaration. Now you know why Williams and Vitt were suspended. But, this does not confirm that Hargrove was aware of any bounty program. He simply says he said what he was told to say by the coaches.

Anthony Hargrove's declaration to NFL regarding Saints bounty scandal

http://l.yimg.com/bt/api/res/1.2/n9Q...pt/page1.1.jpg
http://l2.yimg.com/bt/api/res/1.2/bt.../ipt/page2.jpg
http://l1.yimg.com/bt/api/res/1.2/_F.../ipt/page3.jpg

This is a prime example of why the players should not have gotten punished. He was doing as told by his boss with the expectation of a reward for being a good soldier. I bet Hargrove is hiding in a hole somewhere now thanks to all this b.s.

Why would he hide? Read the declaration closely. No where does he admit to there actually being a bounty program. He could have been telling the absolute truth and still followed orders.

First, no way he was 'guaranteed' the starting job
Second, as for the signed document, they should have editted and come up with a different word than 'deny'. Unfortunately it implies guilt. However, all he signed for was the denial, not admittance.

Other questions this spawns for me:

Was there corroboration to Hargrove's statement by Williams? It seems like a very looooong stretch to look at someone confessing a lie and assume what he says "now" is the truth. He is no longer a Saint, no longer under GW, and what would he have to gain? He was suspended for 8 games, so what favor did his moment of clarity gain him?

Was Hargrove punished for a lie or was he punished for his participation?

What happened to make Hargrove recant over two years later?

The big azzzd hole in all of this is "what has Williams been saying to the NFL after his admission of the program?" He went eerily quiet after his march "I am sorry and hope to be a coach again" Comment.

I find it extremely difficult to believe that Greg Williams made his statement to the NFL, was punished, and that was it... He would need to be the soul corroborator for nearly ALL of the statements that were made unless they were full confessions and then he would need to be the one to look at it and say "yep, sounds about right".

I have issue with a liar recanting with out proof that his recant is the truth. The mastermind being the only person that could possibly verify anything verbal.

I think the NFLPA is missing a boat here... If I were the NFLPA, I would immediately commence with depositions, starting with Goodell, then Greg Williams, then each and every person on the investigation team ending up with the chick the NFL brought in to look over everything.

Fine NFL, Goodell, you do not want to show me what you have or tell me what I am up against? I will start digging for my self to find out who knows exactly what has been said, who said it, and whom it was said to.... I will compare stories on my own when I am done.

Any and all inconsistencies will become PUBLIC knowledge.

Of course I don't know, but I think this is precisely what the NFLPA is either doing now or preparing to do very soon. :handguns:

Not that I am a legal expert, but it seems that Hargrove did not admit to knowledge of, or participation in, any "bounty" program. He does admit to following instructions about making a statement precisely.

His best case scenario is that he deliberately obstructed the investigation by the NFL into the program, regardless of his status within the alleged program.

Had he stated to the NFL during his interview that he was told what to say by Williams and Vitt, essentially that his testimony had been tampered, he would have been determined to be guilty at that point, regardless of his position relative to the alleged incident.

Williams and Vitt accused Hargrove of being the "rat," and he was set up. I guess it took some time for Hargrove to figure this out....

I don't understand the signed document... all that's in it is Williams and Vitt told Hargrove to play dumb(which I'm not sure how in the heck that gets turned into lying). Besides that, Hargrove never copped to bounties or offered any evidence as to their existence.