Need your "vote." Biggest Problem?

GumboBC · 08-19-2004, 09:16 AM

If you had to name ONE thing that COULD be the down-fall of this Saints team; What would it be??

List the problem and give an explaination as to why you feel this is a the BIGGEST problem.

Only list ONE problem. Please do not go into other areas. Just tell us what you feel is the SINGLE biggest problem on this team !!

After everyone has "voted", I would like to discuss the problem more in-depth and see if we can ALL come to some kind of conclusion on that problem.

BlackandBlue · 08-20-2004, 06:17 PM

I think Haslett thinks he can fix the unit on the cheap.

This kind of thinking may have actually saved us.

BrooksMustGo · 08-20-2004, 06:07 PM

Hmmm, I say \"coaching\" and you say \"coaching\" and you still give this response?

I JUST CAN\'T LET THIS ONE SLIP BY...

Complete refusal?
Drafted a LB in every draft for 4 straight years.
Signed free agent LB\'s Ruff and Rogers
Signed/Drafted a CB for 4 straight years.
Carter/Ambrose/Brown/Craft
You can argue he hasn\'t had glaring success, but NO WAY can you claim a refusal to address.

I\'ll concede a little bit. How about an interest in filling critical needs on the cheap? Ruff and Rogers weren\'t really major coups when we landed them. I don\'t recall a lot being said like, \"wow the Saints defense just took a major step in the right direction.\" Carter, Ambrose, Brown and Craft are the same story. Carter used to be a good player, but was a big risk when we signed him. Ambrose and Craft weren\'t going to remain with their teams anyway.

In the draft, Hodge was a 3rd round pick, Allen was a 3rd rounder, Grant was born injured and Watson is the most promising of the bunch. In 03, we traded up for Sullivan who is having a hard time starting when we could have gotten Boss Bailey or Nick Barnett or maybe both.

We haven\'t made a big move on a free agent who would make a difference like Spikes, Fletcher, Colvin, etc. So yeah, I think Haslett thinks he can fix the unit on the cheap. Same deal with CB. The best free agents that become available and there is not a peep of interest from the Saints. I hold Venturi, dismal though he is, less responsible than Haslett. Venturi is making do with the guys he has.

I have no clue what this means.

It means, Haslett drops whatever formula he operates under to mimick the last super bowl winner. Wide open passing attack, speed on defense, etc.

he doesn\'t decide that anyway. Loomis does.

You\'re right, Loomis\' extensive and long term football background must mean that he makes all personnel decisions in a vacuum and Haslett has no role at all. I take comfort in remembering that when push comes to shove, Haslett will still blame the fans for poor performance. Philly is always so successful because their fans are so supportive and understanding of mistakes.

As does every coach.

What gets me is that Haslett continues to make excuses for Brooks. And he\'s willing to make guys like Willie Roaf who can do nothing but help you win games not want to play for you. I can\'t explain why Haslett coached teams give up on him. I don\'t know what it is, maybe taking the poker table out of the locker room will give a more blue collar, workmanlike approach to the club, but Dave Campo took the same approach with the cowboys in his last year.

I don\'t think its a much folding as it is ignorance.

Whatever it is, Haslett has dug himself into a hole in several winnable games where he goes for 2 once and fails and has to go for 2 again just to try and break even. I don\'t get it.

I don\'t see where the heartburn is coming from? Don\'t open up the spinach or anything, I just think the problem is coaching and Haslett ostensibly is responsible for that part of the game.

Danno · 08-20-2004, 04:23 PM

I JUST CAN\'T LET THIS ONE SLIP BY...

1. The complete refusal of the head coach to address areas of glaring need (LB, CB)

Complete refusal?
Drafted a LB in every draft for 4 straight years.
Signed free agent LB\'s Ruff and Rogers
Signed/Drafted a CB for 4 straight years.
Carter/Ambrose/Brown/Craft
You can argue he hasn\'t had glaring success, but NO WAY can you claim a refusal to address.

2. The total inability of the head coach to turn potential into players.

One right!

3. The head coach\'s need to be last year\'s superbowl champion.

I have no clue what this means.

4. The head coach makes excuses (Roaf was a cancer, Ricky was a cancer, too many injuries, Aaron is too young, no affordable free agents, it was our fans, etc)

Haz never said Roaf was a cancer, or that Rickey was a cancer. Haz never said there were no affordable free-agents. he doesn\'t decide that anyway. Loomis does. He never blamed injuries for squat. Some have suggested they have played a part but Haz never blamed injuries for anything.

5. The head coach plays favorites among players and makes enemies of other players.

As does every coach. I don\'t think he\'s worried about enemies like Turley and Hawthorne or Gravy. I think most knowledable coaches would have done the same thing.
Funny, T-rex had nothing but great things to say about Haz and the Saints.
You think Turley would have tipped off Conwell about Haz. Maybe Conwell knows Turley better than most.
Hawthorne: Have the Vikings traded Randy Moss for him yet? He\'s as good a WR as Moss and is one of the best CB\'s in the league.
Gravy: Lets see, we cut him when he ballooned up to 370 lbs and was taking too many plays off, for the 4th year in a row.

6. The head coach folds under pressure (Gee a 2 pointer makes so much sense here)

I don\'t think its a much folding as it is ignorance.

[Edited on 20/8/2004 by Danno]

deucerulez · 08-20-2004, 03:15 PM

im a new guy to the forums...but i say the prob is LEADERSHIP

BlackandBlue · 08-20-2004, 03:16 PM

Elaborate

BrooksMustGo · 08-20-2004, 04:04 PM

Coaching

1. The complete refusal of the head coach to address areas of glaring need (LB, CB)
2. The total inability of the head coach to turn potential into players.
3. The head coach\'s need to be last year\'s superbowl champion.
4. The head coach makes excuses (Roaf was a cancer, Ricky was a cancer, too many injuries, Aaron is too young, no affordable free agents, it was our fans, etc)
5. The head coach plays favorites among players and makes enemies of other players.
6. The head coach folds under pressure (Gee a 2 pointer makes so much sense here)

BlackandBlue · 08-20-2004, 01:59 PM

I didn\'t say he was the BIGGEST problem, I just stated he needed to disappear. McCarthy has me scratching my head as well.
I pulled Venturi up because our defense hasn\'t been the same since he took over for Zook.

GumboBC · 08-20-2004, 01:28 PM

This little vote I\'m conducting is taking more time than I thought.

The majority says that \"coaching\" is the biggest problem.

Now that we\'ve got it narrowed down. What\'s is THE BIGGEST problem with the coaching??

B&B has tabbed Venturi as BIGGEST of the problems with our coaching staff. I agree with that.

Don\'t make me call you guys OUT (lummOx

) Let\'s hear it. Might as well vote. I ain\'t going no where.

And neither is this thread...LMAO... :P

ScottyRo · 08-20-2004, 08:32 AM

Since mine was a singular vote, I feel the need to explain further (although I thought it was self-explanatory).

As compared to the LBs, if Aaron improves his play and playsat least 80% of his potential I think we win most games regardless of whether the LBs get better. I don\'t think the converse, that if the LBs improve and Aaron doesn\'t, we win, is true.

08-19-2004, 09:16 AM	#1
GumboBC Banned Join Date: May 2004 Posts: 2,616	Need your "vote." Biggest Problem? If you had to name ONE thing that COULD be the down-fall of this Saints team; What would it be?? List the problem and give an explaination as to why you feel this is a the BIGGEST problem. Only list ONE problem. Please do not go into other areas. Just tell us what you feel is the SINGLE biggest problem on this team !! After everyone has "voted", I would like to discuss the problem more in-depth and see if we can ALL come to some kind of conclusion on that problem.
GumboBC Banned Join Date: May 2004 Posts: 2,616

08-20-2004, 06:17 PM	#2
BlackandBlue Kinder, gentler Join Date: Mar 2003 Location: dirty south Posts: 3,889	Need your "vote." Biggest Problem? I think Haslett thinks he can fix the unit on the cheap. This kind of thinking may have actually saved us.

08-20-2004, 06:07 PM	#3
BrooksMustGo 1000 Posts + Join Date: Sep 2003 Posts: 1,762	Need your "vote." Biggest Problem? Hmmm, I say \"coaching\" and you say \"coaching\" and you still give this response? I JUST CAN\'T LET THIS ONE SLIP BY... Complete refusal? Drafted a LB in every draft for 4 straight years. Signed free agent LB\'s Ruff and Rogers Signed/Drafted a CB for 4 straight years. Carter/Ambrose/Brown/Craft You can argue he hasn\'t had glaring success, but NO WAY can you claim a refusal to address. I\'ll concede a little bit. How about an interest in filling critical needs on the cheap? Ruff and Rogers weren\'t really major coups when we landed them. I don\'t recall a lot being said like, \"wow the Saints defense just took a major step in the right direction.\" Carter, Ambrose, Brown and Craft are the same story. Carter used to be a good player, but was a big risk when we signed him. Ambrose and Craft weren\'t going to remain with their teams anyway. In the draft, Hodge was a 3rd round pick, Allen was a 3rd rounder, Grant was born injured and Watson is the most promising of the bunch. In 03, we traded up for Sullivan who is having a hard time starting when we could have gotten Boss Bailey or Nick Barnett or maybe both. We haven\'t made a big move on a free agent who would make a difference like Spikes, Fletcher, Colvin, etc. So yeah, I think Haslett thinks he can fix the unit on the cheap. Same deal with CB. The best free agents that become available and there is not a peep of interest from the Saints. I hold Venturi, dismal though he is, less responsible than Haslett. Venturi is making do with the guys he has. I have no clue what this means. It means, Haslett drops whatever formula he operates under to mimick the last super bowl winner. Wide open passing attack, speed on defense, etc. he doesn\'t decide that anyway. Loomis does. You\'re right, Loomis\' extensive and long term football background must mean that he makes all personnel decisions in a vacuum and Haslett has no role at all. I take comfort in remembering that when push comes to shove, Haslett will still blame the fans for poor performance. Philly is always so successful because their fans are so supportive and understanding of mistakes. As does every coach. What gets me is that Haslett continues to make excuses for Brooks. And he\'s willing to make guys like Willie Roaf who can do nothing but help you win games not want to play for you. I can\'t explain why Haslett coached teams give up on him. I don\'t know what it is, maybe taking the poker table out of the locker room will give a more blue collar, workmanlike approach to the club, but Dave Campo took the same approach with the cowboys in his last year. I don\'t think its a much folding as it is ignorance. Whatever it is, Haslett has dug himself into a hole in several winnable games where he goes for 2 once and fails and has to go for 2 again just to try and break even. I don\'t get it. I don\'t see where the heartburn is coming from? Don\'t open up the spinach or anything, I just think the problem is coaching and Haslett ostensibly is responsible for that part of the game.
	http://www.blackandgold.net/site/signature/buddysig.jpg

08-20-2004, 04:23 PM	#4
Danno Truth Addict Join Date: Dec 2003 Location: Spanish Fort, AL (via NO and B/R) Posts: 24,747	Need your "vote." Biggest Problem? I JUST CAN\'T LET THIS ONE SLIP BY... 1. The complete refusal of the head coach to address areas of glaring need (LB, CB) Complete refusal? Drafted a LB in every draft for 4 straight years. Signed free agent LB\'s Ruff and Rogers Signed/Drafted a CB for 4 straight years. Carter/Ambrose/Brown/Craft You can argue he hasn\'t had glaring success, but NO WAY can you claim a refusal to address. 2. The total inability of the head coach to turn potential into players. One right! 3. The head coach\'s need to be last year\'s superbowl champion. I have no clue what this means. 4. The head coach makes excuses (Roaf was a cancer, Ricky was a cancer, too many injuries, Aaron is too young, no affordable free agents, it was our fans, etc) Haz never said Roaf was a cancer, or that Rickey was a cancer. Haz never said there were no affordable free-agents. he doesn\'t decide that anyway. Loomis does. He never blamed injuries for squat. Some have suggested they have played a part but Haz never blamed injuries for anything. 5. The head coach plays favorites among players and makes enemies of other players. As does every coach. I don\'t think he\'s worried about enemies like Turley and Hawthorne or Gravy. I think most knowledable coaches would have done the same thing. Funny, T-rex had nothing but great things to say about Haz and the Saints. You think Turley would have tipped off Conwell about Haz. Maybe Conwell knows Turley better than most. Hawthorne: Have the Vikings traded Randy Moss for him yet? He\'s as good a WR as Moss and is one of the best CB\'s in the league. Gravy: Lets see, we cut him when he ballooned up to 370 lbs and was taking too many plays off, for the 4th year in a row. 6. The head coach folds under pressure (Gee a 2 pointer makes so much sense here) I don\'t think its a much folding as it is ignorance. [Edited on 20/8/2004 by Danno]

08-20-2004, 03:15 PM	#5
deucerulez Registered Join Date: Aug 2004 Posts: 45	Need your "vote." Biggest Problem? im a new guy to the forums...but i say the prob is LEADERSHIP
deucerulez Registered Join Date: Aug 2004 Posts: 45

08-20-2004, 03:16 PM	#6
BlackandBlue Kinder, gentler Join Date: Mar 2003 Location: dirty south Posts: 3,889	Need your "vote." Biggest Problem? Elaborate

08-20-2004, 04:04 PM	#7
BrooksMustGo 1000 Posts + Join Date: Sep 2003 Posts: 1,762	Need your "vote." Biggest Problem? Coaching 1. The complete refusal of the head coach to address areas of glaring need (LB, CB) 2. The total inability of the head coach to turn potential into players. 3. The head coach\'s need to be last year\'s superbowl champion. 4. The head coach makes excuses (Roaf was a cancer, Ricky was a cancer, too many injuries, Aaron is too young, no affordable free agents, it was our fans, etc) 5. The head coach plays favorites among players and makes enemies of other players. 6. The head coach folds under pressure (Gee a 2 pointer makes so much sense here)
	http://www.blackandgold.net/site/signature/buddysig.jpg

08-20-2004, 01:59 PM	#8
BlackandBlue Kinder, gentler Join Date: Mar 2003 Location: dirty south Posts: 3,889	Need your "vote." Biggest Problem? I didn\'t say he was the BIGGEST problem, I just stated he needed to disappear. McCarthy has me scratching my head as well. I pulled Venturi up because our defense hasn\'t been the same since he took over for Zook.

08-20-2004, 01:28 PM	#9
GumboBC Banned Join Date: May 2004 Posts: 2,616	Need your "vote." Biggest Problem? This little vote I\'m conducting is taking more time than I thought. The majority says that \"coaching\" is the biggest problem. Now that we\'ve got it narrowed down. What\'s is THE BIGGEST problem with the coaching?? B&B has tabbed Venturi as BIGGEST of the problems with our coaching staff. I agree with that. Don\'t make me call you guys OUT (lummOx ) Let\'s hear it. Might as well vote. I ain\'t going no where. And neither is this thread...LMAO... :P
GumboBC Banned Join Date: May 2004 Posts: 2,616

08-20-2004, 08:32 AM	#10
ScottyRo 1000 Posts + Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: Williamsburg, VA (ugh, the food here) Posts: 1,704	Need your "vote." Biggest Problem? Since mine was a singular vote, I feel the need to explain further (although I thought it was self-explanatory). As compared to the LBs, if Aaron improves his play and playsat least 80% of his potential I think we win most games regardless of whether the LBs get better. I don\'t think the converse, that if the LBs improve and Aaron doesn\'t, we win, is true.