Give Our Backs some Space
 

Looking at the Eagles running game , I think what ails our backs is spacing...

When any of our backs hit the second level they are a problem to take down ...
But that's a catch 22 because very seldom our backs have The chance to hit the second level

We're too cluttered and too easy to stop from running distances ...

Re: Give Our Backs some Space
 

The problem with so many running backs is we specialize them too much. As a defense, all you have to do is study tape and you'll take Ingram down every time in the backfield.

P.T. gets more variety than Ingram, which makes him a bit more illusive and successful. Ingram maybe had 1 or 2 holes against the Falcons.

Re: Give Our Backs some Space
 

That's what I've been trying to say forever. Seems everybody is so quick to bash Ingram instead of trying to figure out why he's struggling.

Re: Give Our Backs some Space
 

Kind of like the Harper hate... Everyone bashes him until he has a decent game...

Re: Give Our Backs some Space
 

I tell you line Ingram in the slot in a for as a fourth WR and have PT in the backfield will either result in a time out or Ingram in a favorable match up.

hell a swing pass in a four wr set would stump the defense. pass the rock to him for the love of god. screens do not count

Stop stuffing him down the throats of the defense and use him in other way will open up the defense and give the kid a chance.

Re: Give Our Backs some Space
 

Re: Give Our Backs some Space
 

Jahri has possibly his worst game as a saint, falcons DT babineux was in the backfield nearly every play, grubbs was getting blown up and brees was constantly under pressure - yet people still think ingram was the reason he couldnt gain any yardage and call for him to be traded

Re: Give Our Backs some Space
 

Sunday was one game... The Ingram issue has been around for 2 years now.

Re: Give Our Backs some Space
 

True but sproles had literally the same stats as ingram minus his receiving totals

Last year vs bucs top ranked run D ingram had his best game, ingram does sometimes mess up behind the LOS (trips etc) but if he's not getting hit 2 yards in the backfield it would be a start

Re: Give Our Backs some Space
 

Stiff arm and cuts are his strengths. It's as if we go out of our way not to utilize them.

Re: Give Our Backs some Space
 

Lol idiots talkin bout he should cut it back and find another hole , are they refferring to the traffic jam in Jed Collins back or grubs getting blown back ... There is no cutback lane or hole ...

Glad y'all are just fans and not coaches , Payton is keeping ingram around for a reason , he even said the praise of beating the falcons was completely gone when he watched the tape and saw the offensive line ...

Re: Give Our Backs some Space
 

You calling others idiot?

Re: Give Our Backs some Space
 

We should start cutting backside , too often have I seen Sproles or PT get a seem and shoelaced down , cutting on draws , heck just cut everyone ...

I know when I played I hated it lol

Re: Give Our Backs some Space
 

Which hole do you cut back to when your completely surrounded the very moment you get the ball ... How can any rational thinker say ingram shouldn't be i our team when we haven't done right by him ?

He's a bust , then Reggie is too huh ?

Get off it ... Perhaps my choice of words may not have been TE beat but it certainly describes the thinking of ingram haters ..

Re: Give Our Backs some Space
 

5.0 never had a problem getting out of the backfield.

But, yeah, I'll wait for this miraculous breakout year to materialize.

In the meantime, he will make a great decoy for Drew to capitalize on.

Alaska

Re: Give Our Backs some Space
 

There is a reason Ingram is 3rd on the depth charts.

Give Our Backs some Space
 

Fine, lets have an honest discussion about Ingram with out the name calling if you are capable. If you're not please let me know, I can facilitate if you can grasp.

1. Ingram compared to Bush: Seriously? Reggie (and I am no fan of his) was polar opposites depending on the game, but when he was on he was nearly a human highlight reel. Roll the historical tape in your pea and tell me of all the cover worthy Mark Ingram highlights? Reggie's production is near double Ingram's, look at his stats, the receiving nearly doubles his production. Reggie is a comparison for Sproles...Not Mark Ingram.

2. Ingram compared to Sproles: Basically the same statement as above? (Lowest YPC as a Saint 5.1)

3. Ingram compared to Ivory: Do you really want to have a performance comparison between these two? (Lowest YPC season 4.7)

4. Ingram compared to PT: ...... See #3 (other than his injured season in 2010 he is a 4.8 YPC back)

5. Ingram is a consistent 3.8 YPC back for 2+ years now, you can blame the Sunday o-line all you like. Are you going to blame 2011 and 2012 on our online Sunday? The same line all of our other backs found a way to get it done?

As far as being an "Ingram hater", that's a cop-out school girls use when they can't reasonably debate with factual evidence.. I am no Ingram hater, I carried Ingram for two entire seasons on my fantasy football team hoping he would get something done. I'm a realist, a pragmatist, and he is yet to get it done or earn a pass on one bad game.

As far as for your idiot statement, you called people that comment "he should cut back" idiots right after you "liked" a comment saying that cutting back is one of his strengths.

This is the what have you done for me lately league, list all of the great games Ingram has had to prove he is worth staying instead of covering all of the excuses that have been covered a dozen times before. Never-mind, I looked for you, grand total of about 5 games out of 28 starts worth of games worth honorable mention.

Lets also put the BS about he needs more carries to get better, to bed. Have you looked at his situational stats before proclaiming those that do not agree with you "haters"?

2012
Attempts 1-10. 4.2 YPC
Attempts 11-20 2.1 YPC

Why doesn't Payton give Ingram more carries? Because Ingram hasn't earned them. Can you, with a straight face, tell me that Sean Payton.... the genius that made something out of Pierre Thomas, Lance Moore, and Marques Colston; becomes an idiot when it comes to Mark Ingram and doesn't know what to do with him or how to make him productive, IF he can be productive with the Saints? The Ingram isn't cutting it threads have been going on for over two years here, we didn't just wake up Monday morning and decide one game sealed his fate.


Now, why should he be kept coach?

Re: Give Our Backs some Space
 

Ingram and Bush are injured around the same amount of games as well.

You forgot that one.

The only difference I see (you may label this as another excuse as well) was the effort to engage in zone blocking on Sunday that wasn't executed all that well.

I'm into Ingram as a Saint this year even though I've commented that he won't ever be a 1,000 rusher in New Orleans.

For the first time he's 100% and he certainly looks the part.

Re: Give Our Backs some Space
 

I'm no X & O genius, but I see what I see.

When Ingram gets the ball, he's surrounded by defenders 2-3 yards behind the LOS.

When our other RB's get the ball, they aren't.

Its been that way for 2 years.

I'm not smart enough to get past that one.

Re: Give Our Backs some Space
 

I'm in no way saying Sunday was all Ingram, but 1/2 was. Read Holders film study I posted; when you only get 9 carries you can't afford to get tripped up, or falling over into DLP's azz. You need to run EVERY run like its your last... PT or Ivory style.


Have you ever known someone that just always has problems and actually is never the cause? The blame may not be his but the fact still remains that that person is always caught up in some problem. Some people just do not have good luck and that matters.

Re: Give Our Backs some Space
 

We see the same thing Danno. I have said before, it looks like he closes his eyes and runs into out linemens asses. So it's either Ingram or an offensive line conspiracy?

I don't see a conspiracy as he is too quiet from what I don't read about him. If he is hitting the hole too soon there wouldn't be defenders in the backfield. Is there a chance he is hitting the hole too late? It doesn't look that way but speed can be deceiving in the NFL. Anomaly where Ingram on the field makes LBrs faster?

Even when he tries to get around the end he ends up getting skated out.

Re: Give Our Backs some Space
 

Here is what I noticed Sunday. Ingram has no peripheral vision. He doesn't see things like PT does and therefore can not make things happen. He lacks the vision at this level that he needs.....apparently the game hasn't slowed down for him yet.

Re: Give Our Backs some Space
 

What?

Re: Give Our Backs some Space
 

This is a problem that won't go away. We have been talks g about it since the playoff loss to Seattle.

Re: Give Our Backs some Space
 

It's simple, the defense picks up on Ingram and commits. Multiple times they're busting through before Brees gets the ball off. It's too obvious.

Re: Give Our Backs some Space
 

I don't buy that excuse cause Ivory had those same holes without any variety and he did better. Ingram just not illusive, he just a brute runner. It work for him in college but the linebackers and safeties in the pros are much better tacklers

Re: Give Our Backs some Space
 

So the defense also knows the snap count? Our o-line is weaker when Ingram is in thus the defenses ability to "bust through"?


I think Rugby Saints II hit the nail fairly close to the head, if the truth were known, id wager that PT doesn't always hit the intended hole, he makes it work.