Saints' Sean Payton takes blame for fourth-and-goal misfire
 

The Saints took a field goal off the scoreboard to attempt a fourth-down run from the 1-yard line at the end of the first half. But running back Mark Ingram was stuffed for no gain, forcing the Saints into the locker room with nothing to show for their effort.

Payton said he "did a poor job of really giving our guys the best opportunity," shifting the blame from the players to himself.

Ingram, who was also pushed back for a loss on second-and-goal, took the brunt of the criticism on the sequence of events. He had only eight rushes for 20 yards Sunday.

"He had some good runs in that game," Payton said. "I think the balance and the mix of the players we have is going to be important for us, especially at the running back position. The fourth-down call, we ended up getting an over front, a different defense than we were expecting.

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Re: Saints' Sean Payton takes blame for fourth-and-goal misfire
 

Payton seems to invested in Ingram to bench the guy... Wonder how much longer we will see Mr. 2 ypc get the majority of the load. Its a shame we let Ivory go for this chump, we have a mini Ivory in Robinson who will never see the field because of Mr. 2ypc.

Re: Saints' Sean Payton takes blame for fourth-and-goal misfire
 

Seriously?! We traded Ivory for the opportunity to draft John Jenkins. Jenkins has outplayed Ivory and Ingram both combined so far this year...

Re: Saints' Sean Payton takes blame for fourth-and-goal misfire
 

Should have been PT in that situation, that is the only real mistake.

Re: Saints' Sean Payton takes blame for fourth-and-goal misfire
 

@LarryHolder: RT @Gil_Brandt: Look for @Saints coach Sean Payton to become spokesperson for @Reebok. Contract to include bonus for being named COY.

Re: Saints' Sean Payton takes blame for fourth-and-goal misfire
 

This is what a good coach does. Privately I bet he is just as frustrated with Ingram as the rest of us. You might notice that Ingram played very few snaps in the second half of that game and I think only touched the ball once.

Also, forget Ivory. He's too injury prone to play that "tough back" role effectively over the course of a whole season. But you know who I miss? Mike Bell. That dude was money, a perfect fit for the offense, and we let him walk for nothing.

Re: Saints' Sean Payton takes blame for fourth-and-goal misfire
 

I think even WITHOUT the Ingram factor, it was totally not the right play call. Payton even says it -- he knew that whatever the initial call was on the field, from the refs, touchdown or no touchdown, he knew it was not going to be overturned, regardless of whether it REALLY was a touchdown or not. It was just gonna be a big pile of bodies, and they always let the initial ruling on the field stand when they see that. The only way to make that play is to REALLY make it, where the guy is unequivocally IN THE END ZONE, busted completely through, or stretched out where he falls into the end zone by three or four feet. Because everything else with trying to figure out is his knee down or was forward progress stopped, where is the invisible line, did he get across, that's all just malarky when it comes to a referee deciding a touchdown like that. You have to be clearly IN to get it. And Ingram is just not "that" guy.

Psychologically, the refs had already seen the Saints O-line get pushed back and pushed back, when running the ball right there. They were NOT gonna give the Saints the benefit of the doubt, on a sketchy touchdown push, "breaking the plane" type stuff, NO WAY.

Re: Saints' Sean Payton takes blame for fourth-and-goal misfire
 

Yea but we would have to assign Mike Bell his own personal equipment manager. :chug:

Re: Saints' Sean Payton takes blame for fourth-and-goal misfire
 

Right about Ivory, but Mike Bell was no better than Ingram.

Re: Saints' Sean Payton takes blame for fourth-and-goal misfire
 

Just give the ball to Terron Armstead on short work,his 40yard time is 0:03 behind Ingram and try stopping a 305lb man gaining that yard.

Im only half serious but it could work

Re: Saints' Sean Payton takes blame for fourth-and-goal misfire
 

I 100% agree with his call to take points off the board. Moves like that are what Payton is known for. Most of the time it works. We had the momentum. Just happened to not work out.

Re: Saints' Sean Payton takes blame for fourth-and-goal misfire
 

I agree with Dude. Payton goes against the norms sometimes, and I
dont think he does it just for the sake of rebellion. I think he's really
thinking. And there's nothing I hate more than kicking a FG from inside
the 5. In today's NFL, a field goal is a punt with benefits.

Re: Saints' Sean Payton takes blame for fourth-and-goal misfire
 

If true, this could turn out to be SUPER important....

Because once you're in Payton's doghouse, you pretty much become invisible to him. I remember watching Reggie Bush on the sidelines in the Seattle playoff loss, standing next to him, being totally IGNORED by Payton, who literally wouldn't even look at him, except for shooting him DON'T EVEN THINK OF TALKING TO ME looks. Mike Bell slipped on the one yard line, got yelled at, disappeared in the second half of the Super Bowl, and never came back. Remember the interview where Chris Ivory actually came out and said, the coaches "weren't talking to him" during practice....I even remember some game years ago with Joe Horn, seeing him on the sidelines, on TV, looking like he wanted desperately to go in the game, and getting the ignore treatment from Payton.


This could be about to get interesting.

Re: Saints' Sean Payton takes blame for fourth-and-goal misfire
 

If Ivory was used like Ingram is his stats would be much better. Hard to stuff a freight train. If Ingram was traded instead of Ivory we would have gotten a lot more trade value. I do miss his toughness!!

Re: Saints' Sean Payton takes blame for fourth-and-goal misfire
 

I'd argue that he was. He was more consistent, showed the ability to carry the load by himself in several games, and was dependable in short yardage. All things that Ingram lacks.

He also wouldn't have cost a first-round draft pick. All because we overreacted to all the running back injuries from the year before.

Re: Saints' Sean Payton takes blame for fourth-and-goal misfire
 

Shades of "Refrigerator" Perry. :D

Re: Saints' Sean Payton takes blame for fourth-and-goal misfire
 

I understand why he's putting the blame on himself for the Saints not making a TD on that 4th and goal that's what great coaches and leaders do to mask a bigger problem (Ingram).

I have/had no problem with Sean going for it on 4th down, it's the play call and the execution,well lack there of, that's what chapped me

Re: Saints' Sean Payton takes blame for fourth-and-goal misfire
 

I loved me some Mike Bell when he was with the Saints but if my memory is right .... he didn't get a single carry after he screwed up wearing the wrong kind of shoes in the SB and if he did, it was like 1 or 2

Re: Saints' Sean Payton takes blame for fourth-and-goal misfire
 

I absolutely noticed that Ingram was benched after that 4th and goal and I pray to God that Payton is finally fed-up. Enough is enough.

Re: Saints' Sean Payton takes blame for fourth-and-goal misfire
 

2 things about that play/entire stand: 1)-DLP got blown up the **** up on that play and Ingram ran into Tampa's d-line trying not to trip over his own centre...but I agree that we should have used PT or Sproles on the goal line cause we seem to have more variety when they are in the game and 2)-Ingram was wide open in the end zone 2 plays earlier and Drew drilled the ball into the stands for some reason. Our entire offensive line is a hot mess right now, Brees is getting hit way more than he should and he seems jittery or something, not making the reads we're used to. Strief let Clayborn run around him with out so much as laying a hand on him and then proceeded to watch him smash our franchise qb square in the f*cking face...

Re: Saints' Sean Payton takes blame for fourth-and-goal misfire
 

I'm fairly certain you're right.

Whatever the case, my only point was that it was a colossal waste of a high draft pick to get Ingram when there are any number of veterans available every year to play the short yardage role and do a better job of it.

Re: Saints' Sean Payton takes blame for fourth-and-goal misfire
 

Just went through the play by play.. Looks like Ingram had 2 touches in the 3rd Qtr and none in the 4th Qtr.

Re: Saints' Sean Payton takes blame for fourth-and-goal misfire
 

John Jenkins, has played well.

Re: Saints' Sean Payton takes blame for fourth-and-goal misfire
 

:rofl:

Disagree, we made a good trade and got good value; while we probably gave up more than needed we got a great prospect in Big John Jenkins...

Re: Saints' Sean Payton takes blame for fourth-and-goal misfire
 

I would have liked to see a fake handoff and a rollout to the right in that situation - on the earlier downs.

Re: Saints' Sean Payton takes blame for fourth-and-goal misfire
 

I would love to see Robinson take some snaps in a real game.

Re: Saints' Sean Payton takes blame for fourth-and-goal misfire
 

We didn't let IRvory go for Ingram.

I'd also love to see what Robinson can do, but he's no mini-Ivory. He's a mini-PT. He's much more versatile than Ivory. We just don't know about pass-pro and durability yet.

Re: Saints' Sean Payton takes blame for fourth-and-goal misfire
 

you want yard on fourth down? PT is the call. he will slither through an opening the OL can make as long as they make one and it was there in tampa. Ingram squared up in the hole and gave the LB a great target. thats the difference in the two styles of RB and the reason the blocking has to be different depending on the back

Re: Saints' Sean Payton takes blame for fourth-and-goal misfire
 

That series of plays happened right in front of where I was sitting. Should have never tried to throw it on first down, should have been a power run behind Collins and Evans all 4 tries if needed. PT did run the ball on 3rd down not Ingram. Ingram ran it on 2nd and 4th down. He never had a chance on either run and also that grass was coming up after the rain which the field crew had to repair during half time and he had no traction. In the dome, I believe he scores. While I will agree Ingram has not performed as well as we would like, I do want to point out that he is always in against base defenses which usually has the 8 guys in the box which is how Jimmy scored the first TD. Ingram was in the game and Tampa had base run defense in and Drew checked out of run and hit a wide open Jimmy because the LB couldn't keep up. I know some of us keep repeating the same thing about defensive personnel but it is easier for Sproles and PT when they run against the nickle packages as oppose to Ingram trying to run against base packages. Now with that said he still needs to run better and it starts with the OL getting some sort of push which they are struggling with right now.

Re: Saints' Sean Payton takes blame for fourth-and-goal misfire
 

How much trouble did Doug Martin have with traction?:)

Re: Saints' Sean Payton takes blame for fourth-and-goal misfire
 

I should have clarified the traction statement. Near the endzones was bad. I guess the water drains to the endzones so inside the 5 thru the endzone was bad. There was even a twitter comment before the game how bad it was by the goal lines. Martin never got close to the goal line all day. His work was done between the 20's.

Re: Saints' Sean Payton takes blame for fourth-and-goal misfire
 

You can see it in this video, after the camera zooms in, you can see the divots and the general muck down there by the goal line area. It was visibly worse there than in the middle of the field.

Not giving Mr. Ingram any excuses though, but the field WAS really sloppy. He looks even worse in slow motion. Which as a lifetime watcher of the old "NFL Films" productions, I can tell you that's not a good thing. You are supposed to look AWESOME running in slow motion, with an orchestral funk sports rock soundtrack.

Re: Saints' Sean Payton takes blame for fourth-and-goal misfire
 

We could have easily traded Ingram away to the jets for the same picks.... Seriously...

Now I don't think he is much trade bait at all.

Re: Saints' Sean Payton takes blame for fourth-and-goal misfire
 

Wrong; the Jets started the trade... They wanted Ivory not Ingram... They were trying to get Ivory even before the draft started, I believe...

Re: Saints' Sean Payton takes blame for fourth-and-goal misfire
 

We had the option to shop Ivory or Ingram... The staff wanted Ingram. No doubt we could have traded for similar if not the same value for Ingram. There was a decision made of which RB to trade.

I guess I should have phrased my statement differently.

Re: Saints' Sean Payton takes blame for fourth-and-goal misfire
 

It was his fault.....he trusted ingram to get the job done.

Re: Saints' Sean Payton takes blame for fourth-and-goal misfire
 

We didn't get the ball back in the first half after getting stuffed on the goal line.
In the second half...
Ingram got two more carries
Pierre got four more carries
Sproles got two more.

I don't think Ingram was benched and if so, it was only until 5:22 in the third quarter.