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-   -   No Running Game (https://blackandgold.com/saints/60963-no-running-game.html)

B_Dub_Saint 10-06-2013 10:16 PM
Re: No Running Game
 
I honestly thought we we attempted to run the ball more than any game this year. I'm probably wrong but watching the game live, I was thinking, we'll we are attempting to be more balanced.

alleycat_126 10-06-2013 10:17 PM
Re: No Running Game
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by st thomas (Post 535654)
im taking the dump offs, screens, and third options for brees as more of our running game. the running game is what it is. there will be your 100 yard plus days but it has to do with what payton has on that card. i'm accepting it; its winning and i'm pumped for the next one. and today with the 4th and 1 so many of them was like someone said earlier we just were not stretching the ball out for a better spot and just bad spots by the stripes. unawareness of the line is another our fault. its all good. what a win.
Here's what I am gonna say to the all the 4 and 1's we saw today. I explained this in a room full of Saints fans earlier..... so im confident in my diagnosis.... LOL .... In a normal game situation.... I say the two passes to Jimmy that came up short are both conversions. I'm gonna go out on a limb here and say that they were told not to stretch out for extra yardage or fight for first downs because of how adept this Bears team is of punching the ball out and causing turnovers... no turnovers by us is what won the day!!!

WHODATINCA 10-06-2013 11:40 PM
Re: No Running Game
 
I just got to see the whole game. I take it all back. We did some much better running plays today. Improvement!!! Yay!!

dueceloose 10-06-2013 11:56 PM
Re: No Running Game
 
As long as we're brees'n thru opponents who needs to run.

jeanpierre 10-07-2013 06:11 AM
Re: No Running Game
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by dueceloose (Post 535679)
As long as we're brees'n thru opponents who needs to run.
Eventually Teams will figure it out; the interior line has got to start earning those checks...

hagan714 10-07-2013 06:40 AM
Re: No Running Game
 
PT always does well in chicago

jeanpierre 10-07-2013 07:08 AM
Re: No Running Game
 
Coach Payton and the trainer need to have a meeting of the minds about the sneakers the players will use on grass after the Chicago game...

We had several third and shorts because our players were having some traction issues...

TheOak 10-07-2013 07:23 AM
Re: No Running Game
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by thebdj (Post 535490)
Yes, that's exactly what I was saying. You did well to read between the lines there ... ummmm ... no. I wasn't questioning Pierre Thomas, which I had hoped was indicated by the rest of the context around it. I was saying that based on the logic we have crucified Mark Ingram on, we should also hold up Pierre Thomas. And because I don't think Pierre is to blame, I was using that to demonstrate the real problem definitely lies with the O-line. Having said that, the stats do not lie, on the ground we are very poor indeed.

Look at those down-and-1 conversions. They were worrying. You should be able to plough through them and carry on but we were at 4th down far too many times.

We are definitely managing the clock very well but let's understand why we are doing that. That's largely because we are getting the opposition offence off the field so damn quickly. That is our defence doing that great work. And yes Brees throwing the ball about with so much accuracy obviously helps a great deal but I would rather see a balanced game and an improved running game.
Quote:
Originally Posted by westbankdaze (Post 535493)
Referring to the OP comment that we kept coming up short because of the running game, I blame the turf. That ground at Chicago is ass crap.


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Did you watch the same game I did? We were not at 4th and 1 because of our running game. We had at least 3 4th and 1s because Jimmy Graham caught the ball on the wrong side of the 1st down line.

Brees was throwing to Jimmy believing Jimmy could drag the pile a yard... he didn't.

What lecture is Jimmy getting today? Know where the damned first down is and dont turn around to catch it unless you are on top of it or past it.

We could have Adrien Peterson running for us gaining 7 YPC... If we are throwing to Jimmy Graham on 3rd down and he is a yard inside of the 1st down, catching and going down you end up with 4th -1 all day... Those has zero to do with our running game.

dam1953 10-07-2013 08:22 AM
Re: No Running Game
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by TheOak (Post 535746)
Did you watch the same game I did? We were not at 4th and 1 because of our running game. We had at least 3 4th and 1s because Jimmy Graham caught the ball on the wrong side of the 1st down line.

Brees was throwing to Jimmy believing Jimmy could drag the pile a yard... he didn't.

What lecture is Jimmy getting today? Know where the damned first down is and dont turn around to catch it unless you are on top of it or past it.

We could have Adrien Peterson running for us gaining 7 YPC... If we are throwing to Jimmy Graham on 3rd down and he is a yard inside of the 1st down, catching and going down you end up with 4th -1 all day... Those has zero to do with our running game.
I agree. It looked like every time we had a 3rd and x we ended up gaining x-1. Our receivers were consistently running routes just short of the needed yardage and gaining nothing after the catch. Colston had at least one of these.

Budsdrinker 10-07-2013 08:37 AM
Re: No Running Game
 
Amazing, we average 2.36 yards rushing and still I'm hearing how much better the run game is without Ingram.

Mardigras9 10-07-2013 08:41 AM
Re: No Running Game
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Budsdrinker (Post 535774)
Amazing, we average 2.36 yards rushing and still I'm hearing how much better the run game is without Ingram.
A lot of the running yards was after contact. Ingram consistantly does not get yards after contact so the numbers would have been even worse if he was there.
The running game looked better in the beginning of the game, but the Bears adjusted and shut it down. The short passes compensated for the lack of running game.
They just have to take what they can get every game.

ikecomp 10-07-2013 10:57 AM
Re: No Running Game
 
You're not a buzzkill. The running game is still lacking. However, I do like how we look with the other backs even though they aren't getting a ton of yards. Unless they get tackled in the back field they are consistently finding positive yardage however small that Ingram just can't get.

It also appeared that we were definitely trying to commit to the run a lot more. I like PT getting 19 carries. I hope that theme keeps up

TheOak 10-07-2013 04:49 PM
Re: No Running Game
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Budsdrinker (Post 535774)
Amazing, we average 2.36 yards rushing and still I'm hearing how much better the run game is without Ingram.
PT. 1.9 YPC
Robinson 3.0 YPC
Sproles 3.3 YPC
Collins 3.7 YPC


PT had at least 2 slips.

Our ground game is getting better

9thWardDesire 10-07-2013 05:02 PM
Re: No Running Game
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by dam1953 (Post 535476)
No running game, no problem. Time of possession is supposed to be an indication of a strong ball control running game.

Saints: 36:00
Duh Bears: 24:00

Go figure. Ball control passing attack wins again.
That's true. But remember, our opponents are watching and plotting as we speak (in this case, type....)

rezburna 10-07-2013 05:17 PM
Re: No Running Game
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by 9thWardDesire (Post 535936)
That's true. But remember, our opponents are watching and plotting as we speak (in this case, type....)
Every team has a weakness. What are they going to do? Shut down our non existent run game? Well that plan obviously doesn't work. We're 5-0. Our run pass ratio just needs to stay balanced. Ineffective running still sets up the play action. Drew on play action? Bombs away.

homerj07 10-07-2013 05:23 PM
Re: No Running Game
 
I see this as a problem also. Right now everything is going ok. BUT at some point we are going to HAVE to run the ball. At this point we would fail.

TheOak 10-07-2013 05:30 PM
Re: No Running Game
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by rezburna (Post 535945)
Every team has a weakness. What are they going to do? Shut down our non existent run game? Well that plan obviously doesn't work. We're 5-0. Our run pass ratio just needs to stay balanced. Ineffective running still sets up the play action. Drew on play action? Bombs away.
Bingo! I said the same thing earlier, we have a weakness but it's not exploitable.

Budsdrinker 10-08-2013 08:19 AM
Re: No Running Game
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by TheOak (Post 535928)
PT. 1.9 YPC
Robinson 3.0 YPC
Sproles 3.3 YPC
Collins 3.7 YPC


PT had at least 2 slips.

Our ground game is getting better
We also played a defense missing it's run stopper and we didn't get to 4 yds per carry. Same thing this week against pats, they're missing their run stopper, we need to ave 4 yds a pop.

K Major 10-08-2013 08:27 AM
Re: No Running Game
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by rezburna (Post 535945)
Every team has a weakness. Our run pass ratio just needs to stay balanced.
+1. Absolutely.

neugey 10-08-2013 10:59 AM
Re: No Running Game
 
I think we showed improvement in the running game on Sunday. We ran well enough in the first half when the game was close. There were some big stuffs for negative yardage and I think we ran into run blitzes a few times so the overall yardage looks worse than it really was.

IMO I think we run better when we are on grass. The game is not so fast and it might be easier for our line to run-block. When we are at home or at an indoor venue it becomes more of a speed game. That's why we saw PT and Collins get the ball more in Chicago, and why we kept feeding Sproles vs the Dolphins. Good game-planning by Coach P.

TheOak 10-08-2013 11:43 AM
Re: No Running Game
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Budsdrinker (Post 536199)
We also played a defense missing it's run stopper and we didn't get to 4 yds per carry. Same thing this week against pats, they're missing their run stopper, we need to ave 4 yds a pop.
Every team we have played or will play has a piece missing, it's the nature of the sport.

Football is doing the best with what you have available against the best they have available. While our opponents will have missing pieces, so do we.... Jahari hasn't been 100% all season., we have huge pieces missing on our defense.

Sometimes a backup provides more value than a starter just because there is no tape on tendencies, which is why I don't put too much thought into it.

In a nut shell sometimes starters going down makes a team better.... Kaepernick last season comes to mind. A pass rusher on defense goes down and his BU is a run stuffer would be another example.

Rugby Saint II 10-08-2013 01:29 PM
Re: No Running Game
 
Before the end of the year I want to see Robinson running all over the competition.

darstep 10-08-2013 05:22 PM
Re: No Running Game
 
I'm still waiting for Payton to start the game pushing and controlling the line of scrimmage.
It is so much easier to pass block after you get defenders on their heels.
Running the ball has been an after thought during the Payton/Brees era.
When our passing sets up the run, it's difficult to flip that switch on 3rd-and-1.
Especially the way we try to force our will with 2 tight-ends and Jed Collins...
That's just wayyyyyyyyy too much beef in the box for anybody to find a gap for 1 yard.
I would spread the field and run with only 5 defenders in the box.
The O-line wouldn't even need to blow people away, just stand them up.
Five weeks in, I'm still OK with it.
There will be a day that the play action will need to work...actually freeze LBs.
That only happens and is effective when we can run the ball.
Screens will work better when we run the ball.
The pocket and the passing lanes will be cleaner when we can run the ball.
I'm hoping sooner rather than later, we get to +100 with +400 totals.

Boutte 10-08-2013 06:34 PM
Re: No Running Game
 
It would be nice to be able to run it in from the 5.

Or run it on 3rd and 1.


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