Horn leading the NFL
 

Joe's leading the NFL in receptions as well as receiving yards. Way to go Joe, although we all knew you were over the hill before the season, right guys??

Horn leading the NFL
 

Yup, a WARRIOR will be a WARRIOR no matter what the situation...too bad there aren\'t more problem characters on the team who refuse to be embarrassed like him,huh?!

Horn leading the NFL
 

What Joe Horn is doing this year is absolutely amazing. Where are those guys who said he was over the hill? Where are those guys who said we should cut or trade him next year. I don\'t care if he\'s the HIGHEST paid WR in the league next season, he DESERVES it. After all, he\'s 1st in yards and receptions right now isn\'t he? He\'s on track to have his best season ever. He\'s on track to go to the Pro Bowl (4 out of 5 years and the only one he missed he had nearly 1000 yards receiving and 11 TDs despite barley being able to walk on a bad knee half of the season).

What\'s more amazing is that he\'s doing it on this team. A team with more presnap penalties, more 3 and outs, more boneheaded QB plays, more missed assignments, and fewer opportunities than any other I can remember. Joe Horn is the best player we have right now, and Deuce at 100% is the only guy who coule be better.

I mean, look at the other guys who are close to him. Look at the offenses they\'re on. Think Philly\'s offense is slightly better than the Saints? This guy deserves to his due and he should retire a Saint.

Horn leading the NFL
 

Amen to that. Pay the man.

Horn leading the NFL
 

The thought of him working his magic somewhere else sickens me. Sometimes you have to bite the bullet and pay the man. If a useless turd like Sullivan can take 10 million of Bensons money, then Horn has to be paid, regardless of what some capologist says!!

If the Saints are gonna stake any claim to success then Joe has merited inclusion in their plans. He is the only reason that we can feel any league-wide pride right now. It certainly isn\'t a fluke that he is on top in receptions and yardage, the guy played 74 out of 78 snaps last week, cynics will say it is because he wants the crown, I say it\'s because he gives us the best chance of making something happen.

Horn for President !!!!!
Deuce can be his Veep

Horn leading the NFL
 

I got $20 towards his new contract. Who\'s with me??

Horn leading the NFL
 

The Horn worshippers are sounding off, but they can\'t just enjoy what Horns doing, they have to take shots at those who don\'t think he should be paid Randy Moss like money.
But that appears typical on this board.
1. Forget that he runs wrong routes frequently (look at the 1st play from scrimmage vs Dallas)
2. Forget that he drops as many as anyone else on this team.
3. Forget that he jumps off-sides as much as any other WR on this team.
4. Forget that he\'s going to be 33 years old.
5. Forget we have to sign Deuce, and Howard and several free-agents and may have to take a huge hit on Sully\'s contract if we cut him.
6. Forget that most of his stats come when we\'re playing catch up. Its called stat-padding when we discussing Brooks.
7. Forget teams are stacking the line to stop Deuce, while Horn reaps the stats.
8. Forget we need to sign about 3 stud LB\'s this offseason
9. Forget he doesn\'t block well


Forget all those FACTS and lets just slam and ridicule anyone who thinks we should evaluate the situation closely before throwing the bank at a 33 year old WR.

But wait, we suck and he has stats and cool dances. LMAO.

Horn leading the NFL
 

OK Danno, let\'s \"evaluate the situation.\"

First, those 9 things you listed, they\'re not FACTS. They\'re opinions. I\'m quite sure you know the difference. Moreover, they\'re unsubstantiated opinions.

For example, let\'s look at drops. Of the catchable, key word catchable, balls thrown Joe\'s way I bet he drops somewhere in the area of 5 to 10 percent. Now, let\'s think about Donte Stallworth (I\'d guess more like 30%), Boo Williams (40%), or Ernie Conwell (78%). Only Pathon has hands as good as Horn, but he\'s primarily a non-factor in most games. Of course, I don\'t have the stats, but those are my guesses. Maybe you can provide some stats to substantiate your position. If not, then my \"facts\" are as good as yours.

Now, let\'s consider his age, shall we? He\'s 33 years old. Is that effecting his play? Hmm... if you mean, he\'s getting better with age then yes, it is. No one is suggesting we sign the guy to a 7 year deal. We\'re simply suggesting he play out his current contract - a contract, mind you, that doesn\'t pay him top 5 money despite the fact that that\'s exactly what he\'s earned over the past 5 seasons.

As for your claim that he runs routes and makes various other \"mental\" mistakes - I just don\'t see it. I believe that your opinion is based significantly on one article that came out earlier this year suggesting that Horn makes the most mental mistakes on the team. I can\'t remember who wrote that or where the author got his information, but how do you constantly run the wrong routes, jump offsides, and miss blocks and still perform at a Pro Bowl level for five straight years? If it were that easy, AB, a name you brought up, would have been selected by now.

And speaking of AB, I find it interesting that you bring him up and then talk about cap impact. When I argued that AB wasn\'t worth the $6 million a year we\'re paying him, you and others jumped on me citing our huge cap surplus and asking - who has AB stopped us from signing. Of course, you don\'t apply the same situation to Horn. I can clear up $15 million in cap room right now. Wanna see? Brooks, Howard, Sullivan - see you guys later. Deuce, here\'s $10 million this season - now the team has a mere $15 or $20 million under the cap to sign those other players. Ta-da!!!

One last thing - he shouldn\'t be paid Randy Moss money? Maybe not. Good thing A) he isn\'t and B) he\'s more productive than Randy this year, isn\'t he?

Joe Horn is making $600,000 this season if memory serves. That\'s 10% of AB\'s average annual pay. You think AB is 10 times more valuable than Horn? Do you think ANYONE on the team is more valuable than Horn? You want to sign Deuce long-term? The guy you say fades down the stretch, is underachieving and not really a top 5 talent, who has really only proven himself one year? OK, so do I, but I can\'t understand why you think a guy who has proven himself to be one of the top 5 WRs in the league for 5 straight years at a bargain discount rate doesn\'t deserve to get paid like a top % WR for ONE year - nevermind AB has been paid as a top 5, now top 10, QB for 4 years despite NEVER being top 5. Better watch out Danno, some people on this board might suggest you\'re saying these things solely because you harbor a hateful personal grudge against Joe Horn and that you really just hate the guy and are saying these things to forward your own anti-Horn ag---

LAMO ;)

Horn leading the NFL
 

Took the words right out of my mouth WHO. One week Danno says Deuce is bad, and he is playing like crap, and why isn\'t he getting more blame for the losses, and the next week it is we need to get rid of out best offensive weapon cause he costs too much and so we can sign Deuce to a long term deal. I am a little confused myself. I mean, the man is making $600,000 this year and putting out $6,000,000 worth of effort. Pay him. And he hasn\'t complained once about it, even though he is hurt pretty much every game.

Horn leading the NFL
 

It\'s Christmas tiiiiiiiime, in the city......... :heartpump:

Horn leading the NFL
 

I never said he was bad, I said he wasn\'t playing well.

Never said we should get rid of him. Only that we shouldn\'t overpay for him. There\'s a difference.
I\'ve also stated that Deuce IS our best player, he just needs to step up.

Wouldn\'t hurt my feelings if we did overpay somewhat for him. He\'s earned it. But there\'s no need to twist what I\'ve said. My whole point was every post praised him, then followed with a slanted slam against anyone who points out valid arguements for not paying him a HUGE amount of money. Much like your statements about my position on things.
Would you pay him 200 million? Probably not.
Would you pay him 2 million? Hell YES!

There is a line there that benefits both parties. Where do you draw it?

[Edited on 14/12/2004 by Danno]

Horn leading the NFL
 

Why not draw that line at, gee, I dunno, the contract the Saints signed with Horn three years ago? They agreed on a number that was mutually beneficial to both parties right? All we\'re suggesting is that both parties honor that contract. You, I believe, are suggesting that the Saints should renig by trying to restructure to give Joe less now, or continue to push back his pay day until a time when they can cut him to avoid paying him his due. I don\'t like those tactics. Pay him what you agreed to pay him. He kept up his end of the deal, didn\'t he? Deuce-hater!!! Horn-Hater!!! AB and Haslett Lover!!! LOL :)

Horn leading the NFL
 

Uhh? WTF? I never jumped on you for that. You must be remembering someone else.

Actually (without asking you to provide proof) I agree with Brooks/Howard. But cutting Sullivan would increase our cap substantialy. All his bonus money would count against 2005. Probably the only reason he\'s still here.

So True!
I think it\'s already started. but I\'ve been misquoted so often I\'m getting used to it. ;)

Don\'t get me wrong (although I\'m sure many will) I think Horn right now is our best player on offense. NO QUESTION.

[Edited on 14/12/2004 by Yo\' Mama]

[Edited on 14/12/2004 by Danno]

Horn leading the NFL
 

Sounds like ag--- talk to me! :)

Horn leading the NFL
 

I don\'t know what ag--- talk is, but I\'ll wade in here. I like Horn and I like his aggressiveness and desire to win. He seems like one of the three who wants to win (Read Horn, Deuce, Pathon). The rest aren\'t worth a cup of warm spit to me. I\'m with whoever said that we could free up $15 mil in cap room by getting rid of Brooks, Sullivan, and ??

I am concerned about both Horn and Lewis. Michael looks like he\'s lost a step and although Joe is cooking right now, I fear that he is overdue for a major injury. As I said before, I like Joe Horn a lot because of his fire. I do continue to worry about his durability. I find it sad that we didn\'t give Joe the $36 mil that we pissed away to Fumbles the Clown when he had his temper tantrum in 2002. If Haz had a set, he\'d have sat Fumbles down and played Jake just to assert his HC authority and show the team who was boss. By caving in to Fumbles, he has now shown that he plays favorites.

The major question to me is: This is Contract year for Deuce, are they gonna hose him like they have Joe Horn? Kinda makes you wonder, doesn\'t it?

MERRY CHRISTMAS