Early Indications of Our New Defense
 

It appears that the 3-4 base defense is out the window. Reports so far indicate that we've gone back to the 4-3. My first thought was that this is Dennis Allen's influence but then I read somewhere that Rex Ryan will be running a 4-3 Under defense with the Bills which is the base defense that we've been installing as well. I think the Ryan brothers might be thinking alike.

Thoughts and opinions on this front seven based on how we've been lining up so far:

Weakside DE: Cam Jordan
DT: Kevin Williams
NT: John Jenkins
Strongside DE: Akiem Hicks

WLB: Dannell Ellerbe
MLB: Stephone Anthony
SLB: Hau'oli Kikaha

Re: Early Indications of Our New Defense
 

Ok, so far so good.

Re: Early Indications of Our New Defense
 

And that also leaves us with virtually no depth to rotate as well...

Re: Early Indications of Our New Defense
 

I like the base 4-3. The Saints just haven't had the LB's to run a 3-4. But, with Anthony, Kikaha, Tull and an emerging Powell, I had hopes to see how they got after the QB.

Re: Early Indications of Our New Defense
 

Wait wasn't Ellerbe excited to be an OLB in a 3-4 again? And Hawthorne and ILB? Didn't we just draft one of the top rushing 3-4 OLBs to do exactly that?

Please don't tell me that losing one knuckle head changes our entire defensive approach forcibg several players (yet again) to play out of position.

Re: Early Indications of Our New Defense
 

Didn't we draft players specifically to run the 3-4 the past couple years and now we are all of a sudden giving up.

I preferred the 5-2 that Rob ran in 2013

Re: Early Indications of Our New Defense
 

this isn't a normal 4-3...

it's a 4-3 under base which plays nearly identical to the 3-4. The SLB stays at the LOS and typically rushes the QB, the WLB and MLB function more as ILBs.

You guys are getting concerned over semantics.

Re: Early Indications of Our New Defense
 

My concern(s) aren't semantic in nature...

First, if Cam Jordan is essentially the fourth linebacker as you rightfully pointed out in the 4-3 under, aren't you pretty much showing your hand pre-snap which way the base rusher is coming from as opposed to a true 3-4 base where it can come from anyone of the four linebackers?

Second, we don't have that many proven big men up front, wouldn't it be prudent to have at least one available to rotate to keep the big hogs up front from getting winded late in games?

Third, I think we have accumulated the most talented OLBers than we've had since the late 80's/early 90's and to play this front may mean we cut OLB for a down linemen that's better suited to this system...

We made moves and draft picks to get these guys, for damn sake play the MFers and quit trying to justify a contract...

Re: Early Indications of Our New Defense
 

It's the same defense Seattle uses... It works well for them. Jordan will play the Michael Bennett role and Kikaha/Spencer will play the Bruce Irvin role.

Re: Early Indications of Our New Defense
 

Re: Early Indications of Our New Defense
 

Re: Early Indications of Our New Defense
 

Just coach up the talent and put them in a position to succeed.

Re: Early Indications of Our New Defense
 

Re: Early Indications of Our New Defense
 

Chris, no question same defensive scheme...

But not the same defensive personnel...

I'd rather have something like what Pittsburgh used to have with the talent we've brought in at linebacker, nose tackle...

Re: Early Indications of Our New Defense
 

Don't get me wrong, I was thrilled about the move to a 3-4, and it did indeed seem like we finally started adding the right pieces. I'm kinda pi$$ed that we never actually fully committed to it over the last two years. Some folks here said that adding Dennis Allen would probably facilitate a move back to the 4-3 and I didn't want to believe it... But they were right.


We just can't seem to find consistency on defense. The thing that I don't get is that Sean Payton came back from his suspension and the first thing he did was fire Spagnuolo and announce we're changing to a 3-4. We proceeded to waffle on making that transition for two years before apparently giving up on it.

Re: Early Indications of Our New Defense
 

I have been thinking for a while that the whole "changing from 4-3 to 3-4" thing may have just been Payton's typical OCD, short attention span type thinking. Or maybe he was just trolling everyone, putting out a smokescreen, and was never really intending to go all the way to a REAL 3-4, all the time, as the main defense. Some of the player and draft decisions made during that "transition" certainly seemed half-baked or not all the way thought out. I'm not sure that they really knew what they wanted, or maybe they glibly said a bunch of stuff about switching, and then realized later how complex and difficult the changeover would be, with the people and coaches they have....

Right now minus Galette, they look like they are doing the usual obsessive/compulsive tinkering, throwing things against the wall to see what sticks -- very typical for Payton/Loomis. And Ryan fits right in with that mentality.

Re: Early Indications of Our New Defense
 

Name it whatever you want. Fact remains, this organization has a history of putting square defensive pegs in round defensive holes.

Just because this year's defense has a new name, doesn't mean that's changed...yet.

Re: Early Indications of Our New Defense
 

I don't understand the logic sometimes

Payton announces we are going to a 3-4 so we start drafting 3-4 personell, we then give up after 2 years with a roster full of 3-4 suited players.

Re: Early Indications of Our New Defense
 

Is it really anything specific? Doesn't Ryan create kind do a hybrid D?

Do agree with jeanpierre though - depth is a problem.

Re: Early Indications of Our New Defense
 

There really is no 34 or 43 base defenses anymore. 40% or less of all defensive plays are what we call standard 34 or 43 sets. pass happy and point orientated NFL has changed all of that. Defenses can no longer play defense like they did. like the NBA it is all about manufacturing points and hand cuffing the defense so offense thrives. soon one day they will be awarding 7 points for all plays over 40 yards and 8 points for all plays over 80.

The new base defense are the sub packages.