So I have concluded, it was RR
 

Am I wrong?

Re: So I have concluded, it was RR
 

Too early to tell. Definitely some encouraging things today, but plenty of the same old bad that was present during Ryan's tenure.

Re: So I have concluded, it was RR
 

291 yards given up today; that's the lowest all season. The past three games, we have seen steady improvement since Allen has been in charge. I think it's safe to say that Ryan was one of the major reasons for the horrid showings...

Re: So I have concluded, it was RR
 

DA is doing a great job. Put some more talent on that D and we can be top 15 at least.

Re: So I have concluded, it was RR
 

I think Rob had a lot to do with it, but I'm not at all convinced that Allen is the answer. I'm not a fan of either of those guys. We were better today, but even in the other year that we were setting records for defensive futility, we managed to shut out the Bucs late in the year. They had a good game or two under Rob early in the year, also. So you never can tell from a game here and there.

We've had two major problems with defensive coaches. One was Rob confusing his players with overly complicated schemes, and the other is the problem we've had forever... Old coaches who don't develop young players. The vast majority of good players we've had on defense over the last decade have come from somewhere else. Vilma, Fujita, Mckenzie, Greer, Sharper, Lewis, etc. We've had very few home grown successes.

I just want to see someone, anyone, who can teach technique and discipline. Scheme's are overrated. Give me good players, with proper coaching.

Re: So I have concluded, it was RR
 

It improved the minute Rob's car was spotted leaving Metairie Blvd however we are still a bad defensive bunch & lack discipline. Too many dumb penalties and bone headed plays (Vacarro, Wilson and #39).

Re: So I have concluded, it was RR
 

Yeah, as for Wilson... He needs to find something else to do, after that crap show he put on today. Not only did he commit two personal fouls within 4 plays, but neither were even close. He was blatantly late on both. If I had been on the field with him I would have pulled his helmet off and hit him with it. That kind of thing is more than stupid. It's flat out selfish. "Look at me, I'm bad mf'er. I'm gonna announce my presence with a completely unnecessary hit, because I can".

Re: So I have concluded, it was RR
 

You give me 3 of the last 4 games like this I will agree. I do like how he knocked Browner down a peg and made him nickel back.

Re: So I have concluded, it was RR
 

The defence has got better over the last couple of games but there is still a long way to go before we even think of saying the Saints now have a good defence.

Also, as has already been said, the dumb, stupid penalties that the D are committing are so annoying to see. It must drive SP mad when we just think we've stopped the opposition on 3rd down and then a flag hits the turf and we give them a 15 yard/10 yard/5 yard penalty and its 1st and 10 again!!!

Grrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrr! :-(

Re: So I have concluded, it was RR
 

Way too soon to conclude anything, but I see a lot less confusion and a lot more fire and more gang tackling.
So far so good

Re: So I have concluded, it was RR
 

We're shy a biscuit at a few positions on defense. When Ellerbe comes in, our defense is tons better. Not that he's the best, but seems like we constantly play missing an experienced player at a position and the opponents expose it.

Re: So I have concluded, it was RR
 

Well, Dennis Allen hasn't been able to keep Kenny Vaccaro nor the rest of the defense from committing 15 yd Unsportsmanlike Penalties...

Granted, they were down a starter in John Jenkins, but I saw more pass rush due to a rookie quarterback starting to feel the pressure of a playoff spot than players outplaying a lesser tier offensive line unit...

WestBank was obviously injured and a liability as Delvin Breaux is on his way to challenging Stephone Anthony for Defensive MVP honors - whatever that's worth on this defense...

And it seems Hau'oli Kikaha has been reduced to being a coverage linebacker rather than a rush linebacker as he seems to be in coverage more than earlier in the season - and I don't get drafting a pass rusher and making him a coverage linebacker...

And Kasim Edebali looks like the next OLB that will hardly play for us and go to a team like the Patriots and have a great, productive career...

Neaux, can't hang it all on Ryan - and you still have to look at the decision to bring Ryan in and tie his hands in the first place...

Re: So I have concluded, it was RR
 

I'm thinking it has less to do with how good Ellerbe plays WLB and more to do with not having a good WLB on his team in several years. We need to draft/acquire some more OLBs

Re: So I have concluded, it was RR
 

The moment knew this D improved since Rob was fired was when I noticed that not only is Byrd in my TV screen when a play is being made, but he's actually making plays now! We just might get our money's worth

Re: So I have concluded, it was RR
 

I've noticed the tackling is better. It's a start.

Re: So I have concluded, it was RR
 

I think it has been a positive turn for the defense. 291 yards is ok but I have one demand of Dennis. Coach out the stupid in these guys. that total would have been a lot lower if penalties did not keep drives alive. Still can seal the edge to save our lives.

Is it possible to coach stupid out of a player?

Re: So I have concluded, it was RR
 

Take away the stupid penalties by 24 and 39 and it's a pretty decent performance IMO.

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Re: So I have concluded, it was RR
 

Definitely see improvement in the Defense.
And who is this RR you speak of?
Spent a lot of money on Pscychotherapy to get that rolling belly
out of my head.

Re: So I have concluded, it was RR
 

If this was high school football the team would be running gassers. If you run enough of them the stupid stuff will stop or your teammates will beat the crap out of you. Its about establishing a locker room culture.

Re: So I have concluded, it was RR
 

Why is it when a coach gets a unit to perform they get the props of "the unit he built" and so on

yet when they boot hits the butt he gets all kind of breaks and easy outs

Rob came in here got a boat load of control in players signed or not sign FA. A bulk of the draft picks to build his defense to fit his scheme.

Was Rob able to build the 34 deference he was hired to build? No

Did Rob show the skill of a DC that the Ryan name carries with it. No

He can not coach the close of a game much less coach up his players on the side lines to make the adjustments needed.

Rob belongs in an office day dreaming up his schemes and not on the side lines.

I will not give Rob a break nor will I praise DA, yet.

My opinion of Rob has never changed and all he did was prove me right.

He never has and never will be able to handle a DC job.

Re: So I have concluded, it was RR
 

So we don't fire Dennis Allen just yet ... :hallucinate:

Re: So I have concluded, it was RR
 

Effort has really improved. I think many guys didn't want to say it but they were showing it. They had quit on Ryan and he had quit on them. He wasn't talking to players on the sidelines, he wasn't coaching anyone up during a game. He was hiding behind his call sheet and nothing more. Only a handful were playing all out and most of those were rookies or guys fighting for jobs.

I am not sold that the whole change is Allen or just the guys want to play for themselves again now.

Yesterday, as impressive as many 3 and outs were there was still glaring lack of discipline, terrible blitzing (Bucs manned 99% of our blitzes to no pressure) and gashing run plays were had chances to stop. Lots of hits rather than tackles where they gained significant yards after contact. But the effort is way better and a welcome change.

If we change HC and GM we will have a new DC regardless.

Re: So I have concluded, it was RR
 

Ryan was scapegoat and it appeared as though he was kept on leash not allowed to really run the defense. Offense was just as offensive through the rough patch and left us in bad situations. Ellerby, Kikaha injuries really hurt, not to mention all the other injuries. Allen was coaching (supposedly collaborating) on the same defense. I would like to see entirely new defensive coaches. Payton needs to go fishing for a few months after the season.

Re: So I have concluded, it was RR
 

Scapegoat?? Ryan's horrible record as a DC for 14 years speaks for itself. Look it up.

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Re: So I have concluded, it was RR
 

Not buying the scapegoat arguement either...

Look if he was any good at being a DC he would have fixed the problem last year... it only got worse.

His record hasn't been a good one... he took over good D's and kept them good for a short while and then they fell apart and he was out. He doesn't have a record of fixing a problem so its justified cutting him loose now. Because in the off season he won't correct the problem then either.

Re: So I have concluded, it was RR
 

I say this off season we kick some tires and shake some trees to see who we could get to come in and do something with out D.

I don't think there is going to be much out there that is going to make a huge difference and if that holds then Allen is coaching for for a job the rest of the season.

Re: So I have concluded, it was RR
 

I think Allen is earning the right to throw his name in the hat to interview for DC next year. Nothing more.