Looks like we are stuck with Howard, for now
 

Darren Howard went to the pro bowl last year? I am still looking for him on the roster. Did I miss him? How can you have a pro bowl DE who isn\'t in the pro bowl? Was he in the pro bowl the year before when he only played what 8 games? That would be impressive as hell. So can someone explain to me how someone is a pro bowl DE when he hasn\'t been to the pro bowl, at least in the last two years? I guess Jerry Rice is a pro bowl receiver still too. Wow, talk about overvaluing a player.

I get it now though. We have fans who feel the Saints are on the verge of a Superbowl, so keeping Howard makes sense and screw the cap. Let\'s keep everyone. Let\'s pay Joe Horn top 5 and big money to Darren also. We can just release everyone next year after we win the Superbowl right? :nutz:

Looks like we are stuck with Howard, for now
 

So what would be the alternative....play Howard and have Smith warm the bench??? Smith WILL NOT be playing LB this year, so that\'s out. I personally believe that Will Smith will be a better DE in time than Howard is right now, so why impede his progress?

Howard can play at an pro-bowl level, but hasn\'t done it yet. 11 sacks is good, but not elite level.

Stockpiling high caliber players doesn\'t insure a high caliber team. Ask Washington.

Looks like we are stuck with Howard, for now
 

GT, you don\'t get it, SCREW THE CAP. We can be just like Washington. Sign every name player we can so we have to trade away our draft picks and be 5-11. It\'s beautiful. Who needs a first round pick anyway? They are overrated. Not picking until the second and third round is the way to go cause you have all these names on your team. Then you can\'t keep Smoot or young stars like Pierce and have to trade Bailey and have to restructure Samuels so he can stay and lose Jansen. It would be great. :o

Looks like we are stuck with Howard, for now
 

This really isn\'t worth getting a debate over... Lets see what are the options, getting rid of a Pro-bowl player for a second round pick, hmmm. I do give you we save some duckets but... what do you get really, sure lose some talent and save some money... with that thinking lets trade everyone and hire all of here on this site for league min. That would save what 77 million or so...

Looks like we are stuck with Howard, for now
 

Again, when did this happen? Not last year or the year before. I will say I can not remember if he went to the pro bowl the year before that, but Jerry Rice used to go to the pro bowl too.

Yeah seems to hurt NE and Philly. Lose Lawyer Milloy and Ted Washington, win a Superbowl. Eagles cut BOTH starting corners, go to a Superbowl. Terrible strategy.

Can you play football at an NFL level? Can anyone on this site? If you could, I am sure you would be worth a tryout. I\'d like to see an example of an NFL team doing this so I can see this as not just a ridiculous statement cause you have no argument. Washington actually has done what I said.

Looks like we are stuck with Howard, for now
 

Probowl caliber player... come on now what\'s the bickering for. It doesn\'t hurt us to have him and it doesn\'t hurt us to trade him. If we can trade him for some picks that would be great, and if we were to retain him he\'ll get us another 10 sacks. What\'s wrong with that? Let\'s worry about the cap next year, he\'ll be off our books regardless if we get compensation for him or not. We aren\'t over the cap so why worry about it so much. We\'re the fans... let\'s let the management worry about that stuff and us worrying about having quality players on the team to win.

Looks like we are stuck with Howard, for now
 

Actually it does hurt us to have him.

1) Joe Horn wants a new contract. He expects it to be top 5. We are about 5 mil under the cap with Howard and his franchise tag. How does that deal get done, if we do it?

2) 5 mil under the cap, and as someone else pointed out here, last year rookies costed us 3.8 mil against the cap. So that leaves us with what, 1.2 mil? Huh? That sounds like a good idea?

3) Howard has said he DOES NOT want to be in a rotation and he DOES NOT like playing DT. Wait, these are the exact two things we are gonna ask from him should he stay. How does that not hurt?

4) Howard is demanding a 16 mil signing bonus and a deal similar to Grant Wistrom\'s. How does that not hurt us?

5) The organization has said it is a priority to have a new deal for Bentley and Deuce this off-season, I guess they are gonna do that with that available 1.2 mil they will have after the draft huh? Or they just go back on their word. Yeah, that sounds like a good thing to do. How does that not hurt us?

Looks like we are stuck with Howard, for now
 

UGH... this debate could last the ages...

Looks like we are stuck with Howard, for now
 

nah, just another coupla seasons when joe is at 44 catches and 10.3 ypc.

Looks like we are stuck with Howard, for now
 

Let\'s worry about it next year. We can think about it through the season and see what we want to do and what needs to be addressed. Who should we sign, consider signing, and resign? There is a lot of money that needs to be thrown out next year to core members of this team so how about waiting and see how they perform this year... What if Horn regresses this year? What if Bentley gets injured again? It\'s not like we are signing anymore free agents so why do we need so much cap room RIGHT now? Who cares if Howard doesn\'t want to be a part of any type of rotation? He\'s going to get paid 7.8 million to do whatever the heck the Saints want him to do. Let him be a big baby and cry about it, it will only drop his market value for next season. So why would he want to do that? ;)

Looks like we are stuck with Howard, for now
 

Seattle Seahawks sign DE Grant Wistrom to a six-year, $33 million deal that includes a $14 million signing bonus.

That\'s Wistrom\'s contract he signed last year. Not 17 million, not 16 million, 14 million. By asking for 16 million we all have an idea how much Cowboys/Saints were offering. And if they meet him halfway, it will probably be in the 13/14 million dollar bonus range. It was Javon Kearse who signed the 66 million 6 year contract with the 16 million dollar signing bonus. Just fixing the number and finally setting it straight. :P

Looks like we are stuck with Howard, for now
 

Howard\'s agent asked for 16 mil, that is somehow not close to 14 mil? Wow.

I\'ll repeat this part.

[Edited on 15/3/2005 by saintswhodi]

[Edited on 15/3/2005 by saintswhodi]

Looks like we are stuck with Howard, for now
 

In hindsight, I wonder how our D-line would look if we hadn\'t drafted Will Smith (who I like a lot) and selected Vince Wilfork instead?

D. Howard
B. Young
V. Wilfork
C. Grant

Hmmm. That looks pretty sweet.
Just speculatin\'

Looks like we are stuck with Howard, for now
 

That woud have been pretty nice. Of course had we gotten Wilfork, we would not be talking about trading Howard. but instead how do we cut or trade Sully. Noone kneww he was gonna be this big of a bust.

Looks like we are stuck with Howard, for now
 

The only way Sullivan could be a bigger bust is for him to have breast augmentation!

Looks like we are stuck with Howard, for now
 

I\'m pretty sure Saints/Cowboys made an offer first. And by asking for 16 million, he would expect them to meet them halfway. But if he\'s wants 16 million which I highly doubt, nobody and their mama would want him. He wants in the prox. of 13/14 bonus. Anyone want to bet?

Looks like we are stuck with Howard, for now
 

papz, come on dude. I know you can read. But I will put it in quotes again. How in the world does that sound like the Saints or the Cowboys proposed that? You\'re wrong dude. I don\'t know how it can be any clearer.

Looks like we are stuck with Howard, for now
 

Like and demanding is a whole different story... sw if this guy get\'s more than a 14 million dollar signing bonus in which I absolutely highly doubt, I will pay for a pair of Saints tickets for me and you to go see. ;) It\'s all about meeting halfway here... it\'s a strategy to get what you really intend to get. I will bet you they are offering a 10/11 million dollar signing bonus and he wants what Winstrom got... around 13/14. And they only way he will get it is to demand approx. 16. Does this make sense at all?

:cheers: I mean no harm here... just my 4 cents ;) Wouldn\'t mind seeing a game with you though... so let me be wrong :cool:

Looks like we are stuck with Howard, for now
 

I hope you are wrong as I am planning to come home for a couple of games anyway next year considering it may be my last chance to see them there(unless they move here to San Antone). ;)

But I think this is a legit demand from Howard and a hold up in the trade. I think there is NO WAY he wants to get less than what Wistrom got, and truly he is a better player. The problem is Wistrom was overpaid, plain and simple. But that set the market. Now no way in hell Dallas or NEw Orleans wants to pay that much, and the Cowboys aren\'t gonna trade for him without a signed deal in place. Therein lies the non-completion up to this point of this deal. So we can blame Seattle. Hopefully they step in and make the deal since it\'s their faults anyway. The report also says Howard wants a percentage increase from what Wistrom got so that tells you right there he ain\'t playing for less or the same amount as Wistrom, he flat out wants more.