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-   -   Who's definitely left at 16? (https://blackandgold.com/saints/8262-whos-definitely-left-16-a.html)

Danno 03-25-2005 02:35 PM
Who's definitely left at 16?
 
After reviewing several mocks, i think its no doubt these guyswill be gone when we pick...
1. Alex Smith
2. Aaron Rodgers
3. Carnel Williams
4. Ronie Brown
5 Cedrick Benson
6. Derrick Johnson
7. Braylon Edwards
8. Mike Williams
9. Adam Jones
10. Antrell Rolle
11. Alex Barron

That leaves several players I'd be happy with at 16.
Travis Johnson DT
Jammal Brown OT
Carlos Rogers CB
Thomas Davis WLB AND SS
Anttaj Hawthorne DT
Trade Down

Yep, I got it all figgerd out.

Saint_LB 03-25-2005 02:43 PM
Who's definitely left at 16?
 
What about Matt Jones, Danno. How high do you think he will go and do you think he would be a good prospect for the Saints?

baronm 03-25-2005 02:45 PM
Who's definitely left at 16?
 
I\"m very concerned about davis\' instincts after several articles ahve been written..BUT..a lot of people say he is a play maker.
Quote:
Also, OLB / S Thomas Davis improved on his poor 4.60 timing at the Combine by running a 4.45
Quote:
SCOUTING REPORT
Strengths: Was a safety in a linebackers body as a junior...Very strong, tough and physical...Excellent athlete...Great size...Has great range...A force in run support...Great instincts...Good tackler...Very productive...Has a lot of upside.
Weaknesses: Raw and still developing...Has only average speed but it is good for his size...Doesn\'t have a lot of experience at safety and may be best suited for linebacker in the pros...May be a bit of a S / OLB \'tweener.
Notes: Has the potential to be great and hasn\'t even begun to reach it yet...Could project to either safety or linebacker at the next level depending on the team and defensive scheme.
Quote:
Thomas Davis has bounced around between safety and linebacker at Georgia, but he’s been a playmaker no matter where he lines up. As a sophomore, Davis had a huge season. He ended the season with 138 tackles, 8 for loss, and 4.5 sacks. He was named to various All-American teams for that season. He didn’t put up numbers quite as big as a junior, but he still was a force in the secondary with 73 tackles, 2 for loss, 1 sack, and 1 interception.
You don’t generally find too many players that can bounce from linebacker to free safety, but Davis has that type of versatility. He has the size and strength to line up in the front 7 and be a force, but the athleticism to play deep in coverage. He is very aggressive and physical when attacking the line of scrimmage.


Even though he has played free safety in college, Davis projects to strong safety in the NFL. He doesn’t have the pure foot speed to play free safety. Other than that, experience is really all he lacks. Since he’s spent so much time switching from linebacker to safety, he hasn’t had the time at one spot to fully understand one position.

Thomas Davis is an awesome safety prospect . He looks a lot like Roy Williams physically, and he could have that type of impact in the league with the right coaching to teach him the safety position. If Davis declares, he will be the first safety selected, and is a first round lock. Good workouts should propel him into the Top 20. For a safety to be considered in the Top 20, he has to be special, and Davis has an excellent chance to be taken that high this year.
footballfutures.com

rogers and brown wouldn\'t be bad pickups at all..but I\'M JUST thinking that several cbs later will be just as good.

Quote:
brown
Jammal Brown has lead a talented offensive line that has cleared the way for some talented rushing attacks . Brown was a big part of Quentin Griffin’s 1,880+ yard season two years ago, and this season’s freshman sensation, Adrian Peterson’s coming out party. During his junior season, he only allowed one sack all year in the passing game.

Jammal Brown is a talented, all around tackle. Oklahoma has a balanced offense, and it has allowed him to develop himself in both run and pass blocking. As a pass blocker, he shows good agility, and has long arms to keep the defender away from his chest. Physically, Brown is a very good athlete, with very good lateral agility. His long arms allow him to keep the defender off his chest. Brown plays right tackle, but his athletic skills should allow him to move over to the left side in the NFL.


While Brown is a good all around tackle, run blocking is an area he can work on. He needs to get stronger and more physical in this aspect . He can run block, but he doesn’t play with a great deal of power and doesn\'t dominates at the point. There is the ongoing question of if he can play left tackle in the NFL as well. Since he’s played RT for his entire career, it brings about the question of how well he would translate to the other side.

I think Brown is a very good offensive tackle prospect. I think he is a safer pick than Alex Barron, but doesn\'t have the upside Barron has. He looks solid as a first round pick, just how high will depend on how well he performs on the workout circuit. I think he is better suited to play LT in the NFL than RT, but he brings the versatility to play both sides, and that adds to his value.
Quote:
Strengths: Is very athletic...Has long arms...Agile with quick feet and moves well...Does an excellent job in pass protection...Has a lot of experience...May be able to play left tackle in the pros...Can still improve.
Weaknesses: Not as big or strong as you would like...Not a dominator in the running game...Not all that tough or physical...Lacks a killer instinct and doesn\'t finish his blocks...Needs to show a better work ethic.
Notes: Won the Outland Trophy as a senior...The best player on one of the best offensive lines in the nation...May be the best all around tackle in the draft but doesn\'t have the upside that Alex Barron does...Could come off the board early with tackle being such an in-demand position.
I/m starting to warm up to the idea of being ok with any of those three guys. Davis at SS taking bellamy\'s role inside the box and loetting the old man play third safety.

OT depth or cb depth would be next.

[Edited on 25/3/2005 by baronm]

D-buck47 03-25-2005 03:14 PM
Who's definitely left at 16?
 
Matt Jones is projected by most as a late second/early third round pick

saintswhodi 03-25-2005 03:18 PM
Who's definitely left at 16?
 
Last I heard Jones was projected in the 4th, and teams were trying to see if he could beef up to play TE.

baronm 03-25-2005 03:21 PM
Who's definitely left at 16?
 
problem we have is the chiefs picking right ahead of us. and they need defense in the worst way.

Danno 03-25-2005 03:24 PM
Who's definitely left at 16?
 
Quote:
What about Matt Jones, Danno. How high do you think he will go and do you think he would be a good prospect for the Saints?
That guy is a freak. Wow. I\'d be tempted but I think he\'d need quite a bit of quality coaching to make the switch to WR/TE and actually be better than what we have right now.

Quality coaching doesn\'t exactly describe our lovable group of misfits. But if he goes to the right team he can be a very dangerous weapon.

Another Slash?

D-buck47 03-25-2005 03:25 PM
Who's definitely left at 16?
 
Of the 3 sites I\'ve seen 2 have him going to Pittsburg in the end of the 2nd. He projects as a TE or WR at 6\'6\", 244 and running a 4.4 wow. Why not take a shot in the third? Plus, he played QB in college, which makes him great when you run trick plays, ala Hines Ward and Randall El

baronm 03-25-2005 03:29 PM
Who's definitely left at 16?
 
Quote:
Quality coaching doesn\'t exactly describe our lovable group of misfits
see that\'s what worries me about most of the guys who will be there when we pick...can bellamy teach davis how to play linebacker? cause our coaches sure can\'t.

saintswhodi 03-25-2005 03:34 PM
Who's definitely left at 16?
 
Gotcha D-buck. Just saying last I read they had him in the 4th. Your info must be more current.

D-buck47 03-25-2005 03:37 PM
Who's definitely left at 16?
 
Maybe, the guy is talented, but would be a major project. Hopefully he lasted unitil the 4th

saintswhodi 03-25-2005 03:38 PM
Who's definitely left at 16?
 
Quote:
Matt Jones
QB | (6\'5\", 220, 4.65) | ARKANSAS

Scouts Grade: 59

Flags: (C: CHARACTER) Problems on and off the field
View by: Round | Player | NCAA School | Position | NFL Team | Flag | All Ranked Players | NFL Draft History
You are signed into Insider and have access to the exclusive draft content below.


Career Totals Passing Rushing
SEASON CMP ATT YDS CMP% YPA TD INT SACK RAT ATT YDS AVG TD
2004 151 264 2073 57.2 7.9 15 12 11 132.8 83 622 7.5 6
2003 132 230 1917 57.4 8.3 18 7 6 147.1 96 707 7.4 8
2002 122 234 1592 52.1 6.8 16 8 20 125.0 129 614 4.8 5
2001 12 27 275 44.4 10.2 4 3 2 156.7 74 616 8.3 5
· View full player card
Strengths: Is a very good athlete for his size. He has great height and good bulk for his frame. He has decent quickness but really accelerates as he runs. He has long strides and seems to be deceptive in his speed when he takes off to run because defenders often come up short on their pursuit angles. He has adequate arm strength. Throws a good deep ball and shows better accuracy and touch on those passes than on short-to-intermediate ones that require more precision and zip. He is a dual threat who is very difficult to defend because of his mobility and effectiveness as a thrower on the run. Also has versatility and could have more upside as a WR in the NFL.

Weaknesses: Has a very nonchalant attitude. Not sure if he loves playing the game of football? Is too inconsistent as a passer. His accuracy varies and he misses entirely too many targets. He doesn\'t have great patience in the pocket. Will take off too early and tries to run too much at times. Doesn\'t have a great feel for reading defenses or picking up hot reads. He locks on to his primary target too often and does a poor job of making his check downs. He has adequate but not good arm strength and would struggle to fit the ball into tight spots in the NFL. He also seems uncomfortable inside the pocket and tries to roll outside a lot and get on the move.

Overview: Jones is an interesting late round draft prospect because of his athleticism, size and versatility. Also a four-year member of the Razorback\'s basketball team, Jones began his football career at Arkansas as a wide receiver. He split time at quarterback and wide receiver as a freshman in 2001 before taking over as the fulltime starting quarterback in \'02. He has had lingering injuries and he continues to be an inconsistent performer with more of a sandlot style than anything. Jones has great size, decent arm strength and good athletic ability, but in all likelihood his best chance of making it in the NFL will be as a possession receiver. He has experience at the position, he has enough speed and running ability, and he certainly is a big enough target to take a chance on in the final few rounds of the 2005 draft.
* Player biographies are provided by Scouts Inc.
This is from Scouts INC on ESPN Insider.

D-buck47 03-25-2005 03:46 PM
Who's definitely left at 16?
 
Thanks for the post. I didn\'t know he had character issues

saintswhodi 03-25-2005 03:48 PM
Who's definitely left at 16?
 
Honestly, me either. I just knew he was supposed to be like a 4th round guy or such at the earliest. I was not aware of character issues until I just read that.

papz 03-25-2005 03:54 PM
Who's definitely left at 16?
 
TRAVIS JOHNSON!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! :cool:

I don\'t think Matt Jones needs to beef up. I can\'t see why they want to make him into a tightend. He has the size, speed, and hands to make a switch to WR just as Drew Bennett did years ago. Making a former QB with his attributes help block DE\'s and linebackers is a little strange to me. I\'d say he would make a fine receiver down the road and would gamble on his with a late 3rd/4th round draft pick on him.

About his speed, he ran a 4.4 at the combine. They need to update that.

spkb25 03-25-2005 07:37 PM
Who's definitely left at 16?
 
i\'d take brown only because o tackles are so hard to come by. and if we have a solid line this year ( that depending on mayberry and gandy\'s play) then we have someone that next year could be a stud at tackle. maybe he can play this year. either way if the guy is going to be a very good o tackle we cant go wrong. they are hard to find

FireVenturi 03-26-2005 11:32 AM
Who's definitely left at 16?
 
The only guy on ur list Danno i would stay away from is Hawthorne. Heard he has a lot of the traits that Sully does, plus he will probably be there in the 2nd. Any of those other guys would be fine.

papz 03-26-2005 11:51 AM
Who's definitely left at 16?
 
Hawthorne is actually the complete opposite of Sullivan. He is considered to be an extremely hard worker. Johnson, Hawthorne, and Cody are considered the top 3 defensive tackles.


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