Originally Posted by gosaints1 (Post 921181)

Weak? No. Inconsistent? An argument could be made that it is true. But a lot of shuffling was done and the results were elite, iyam.

6th rated rushing attack with 141.6 ypg average.
6th best pass protection unit allowing only a very meager 17.2% QB pressure.

Hiccups along the way? Sure, shuffling the line bc of injuries will do that. But those linemen, including “depth” players, over the long haul of a season, played at an extremely high level, once again iyam, elite level.

There is a reason as to why DB#9 is 1 or 2 in most passing records, but not even in the top 10 as far as sacks goes. Not even close, he’s 13th on that list, after 19 seasons, 15 with New Orleans. The OL has protected Mr. Brees like no other team, for a very significant period of time. That’s not an accident. That’s elite development and targeting, through the draft or FA, of linemen. Guards, Centers, and tackles, they’re fungible at the pos’n level in this scheme, and even at any quantitative analysis regardless of team or scheme. Not the eye test though, despite stats, we can see a bad player on an otherwise elite offensive line. I just haven’t found a “weak link” though, even with the eye test and completely ignoring metrics analyses. If the entire OL statistical play was bad, over the years, I would agree with you, but it hasn’t been, so I just can’t make that argument.

A fair debate could be had on whether the Saints needed to draft a LB, maybe your LSU LBer (PQueen) instead of another offensive lineman, but the value in Ruiz is clearly there. Also, keep in mind that the overriding mindset from year to year was ‘protect Mr. Brees, at all cost’.

I’ll take our two guards, even knowing Senor Sammich might get injured.

Bottom line, sometimes drives stall simply because the opposing team has superstar players trying to stop our momentum. You can’t win every play, every drive will not always end up in points. It’s an elite line, with one aging tackle, and one semi-brittle guard. But when they’re in, the entire line is one of, if not THE best in the entire league.

You very well could be right wrt the guards, but that would require an expert analysis from each snap that those guards were playing in and assigning a score to it. And, that would require trust in that expert being unbiased. I’m not prepared to do that deep dive my friend, lol. Heck, I’ve already spent ten minutes on this post, which I could have used more efficiently elsewhere. lol

Originally Posted by gosaints1 (Post 921181)

Weak? No. Inconsistent? An argument could be made that it is true. But a lot of shuffling was done and the results were elite, iyam.

6th rated rushing attack with 141.6 ypg average.
6th best pass protection unit allowing only a very meager 17.2% QB pressure.

Hiccups along the way? Sure, shuffling the line bc of injuries will do that. But those linemen, including “depth” players, over the long haul of a season, played at an extremely high level, once again iyam, elite level.

There is a reason as to why DB#9 is 1 or 2 in most passing records, but not even in the top 10 as far as sacks goes. Not even close, he’s 13th on that list, after 19 seasons, 15 with New Orleans. The OL has protected Mr. Brees like no other team, for a very significant period of time. That’s not an accident. That’s elite development and targeting, through the draft or FA, of linemen. Guards, Centers, and tackles, they’re fungible at the pos’n level in this scheme, and even at any quantitative analysis regardless of team or scheme. Not the eye test though, despite stats, we can see a bad player on an otherwise elite offensive line. I just haven’t found a “weak link” though, even with the eye test and completely ignoring metrics analyses. If the entire OL statistical play was bad, over the years, I would agree with you, but it hasn’t been, so I just can’t make that argument.

A fair debate could be had on whether the Saints needed to draft a LB, maybe your LSU LBer (PQueen) instead of another offensive lineman, but the value in Ruiz is clearly there. Also, keep in mind that the overriding mindset from year to year was ‘protect Mr. Brees, at all cost’.

I’ll take our two guards, even knowing Senor Sammich might get injured.

Bottom line, sometimes drives stall simply because the opposing team has superstar players trying to stop our momentum. You can’t win every play, every drive will not always end up in points. It’s an elite line, with one aging tackle, and one semi-brittle guard. But when they’re in, the entire line is one of, if not THE best in the entire league.

You very well could be right wrt the guards, but that would require an expert analysis from each snap that those guards were playing in and assigning a score to it. And, that would require trust in that expert being unbiased. I’m not prepared to do that deep dive my friend, lol. Heck, I’ve already spent ten minutes on this post, which I could have used more efficiently elsewhere. lol

Originally Posted by AsylumGuido (Post 921186)

Be careful or you'll be required to get new eyewear.

:D

Originally Posted by Rugby Saint II (Post 921177)

It's been a little testy on the boards recently. The season can't get here fast enough.

Originally Posted by jeanpierre (Post 921192)

Originally Posted by jeanpierre (Post 921192)

Originally Posted by jeanpierre (Post 921192)

Originally Posted by halloween 65 (Post 921208)

Surely didn't look good when Brees throwing int's. I thought they could have did a better job at protecting him. Looked shaky in crunch time.

Originally Posted by AsylumGuido (Post 921195)

Ooorrrr ... the offensive line (including the guards) have been doing a better job doing their job at an elite level than you are willing to admit.

And you need to get that neck pain checked out there, JP.

;)

Originally Posted by gosaints1 (Post 921211)

It’s a fair point, and one I understand, but see differently..., and ‘Pass opening up the run’? I doubt that. 31 other NFL teams knew that all they had to do was squat inside 20 yards bc as even the future first ballot Hall of Fame QB recently stated when going through his progressions:

1) “I can’t make that throw”

2) “I can’t make that throw”

3) “I can’t make that throw”

4) “I KNOW I can’t make that throw”

As our greatest QB aged, he no longer was able to make the throws needed, either bc of year long injuries or simply aging. The last few years, the pass most definitely did not open up the run. The running game was good for three reasons.

1) Alvin Kamara

2) Latavius Murray

3) An effective run blocking Offensive Line.

Brees getting the ball out quickly almost always meant a dump out in the flat to Kamara, or an out route inside ten yards..., and the entire league knew it. Sometimes it amazes me at the amount of success the Saints have had, in spite of Mr. Brees recently. Not meaning to disparage him, truly I’m not, but he was done. We saw it clearly the last year. But it’s my belief it’s been snowballing for several years now.